Need help with new oscilloscope match up...

[grider99]

Hello,

I'm in the market for a new Oscilloscope (digital). My range of spending would be between $500.00 up to $1000.00. I guess the range doesn't matter much as I think if my top limit is 1000.00 then i should just say that I want a scope around $1000.00.

What am I going to use it for?
- old retro/new Tv's
- CB radio and other communications stuff
- stereo equipment old/new,
- old 70', 80's and up retro computers and consoles.
- current PC troubleshooting.

I've looked at Rigol and Siglent, not sure about keysight and others. What's the best bang for the buck? Is there one I can get for around $1000.00 and also unlock for free to further it's features without having to pay extra?

[bdunham7]

If you don't have anything now, or have an analog CRO, the Siglent SDS1102CML+ at $299 will do all those things, except I've never used scope to fix any modern (this millenium) PC so I'm not sure what you mean there.  This scope is also the only DSO that I'm aware of that still has the ALT TRIGGER function, which can be handy in certain instances.  If you want to go upscale from there, we need more details as to what you expect.  That $700 you don't spend on a 'better' scope would buy a nice signal generator or something.  What other equipment do you have now?

[bob91343]

Why do you specify a digital oscilloscope?  I find their use a bit cumbersome, especially for troubleshooting.  The analog is the way to go.  Of course they don't make those any more.

I have several of each type and automatically reach for the analog unit for general purpose work.  If my needs are more specific, it's a different story.

A very good analog oscilloscope can be had for very little money (used).  In fact I got my last two of them free.

[james_s]

I was always a proponent of analog scopes, but honestly now in 2021? I would never recommend one to anybody unless they want to collect vintage equipment, or if they need XY mode. I absolutely love my Tek 465B, it's a work of art, but I pull it out probably once a year if that. Other than XY mode there is nothing it can do that I can't do with my TDS3054 or TDS784C, and those DSOs can do numerous things that no analog scope can. Unless you're on a very tight budget or have very specific needs, forget analog. With a $1k budget especially, you can get quite a nice DSO for that price.

Many of those things you mention don't really need a scope though. Modern computers? I don't think I've ever used a scope to diagnose any computer problems, modern computers are full of high speed differential signalling that is well beyond any scope even remotely close to your budget. Vintage computers, a logic analyzer is likely going to be a lot more useful than a scope. Stereo equipment you'll probably want a signal generator or audio test oscillator and a test amplifier to follow signals around, a scope may be handy on occasion but not needed for a lot of repairs.

[mindcrime]

The Rigol DS1104Z-S Plus is 100mhz, 4 channels, and has an optional Logic Analyzer expansion available. They can be had for around $700 USD, which is well within your budget. If you buy the Logic Analyzer add-on, you're still only looking at around $900.00. 

If you wanted to spend a small amount more, you could buy the low end of the Rigol MSO5000 series, a MSO5104 which is a 100mhz model, and hack it to unlock the same capabilities as the high-end model. There's a thread here on the forum somewhere about hacking the MSO5000 series scopes. And as an MSO, (Mixed Signal Oscilloscope) you get Logic Analyzer capability "out of the box".

From a logic analysis perspective, either of those would be more than capable enough to handle anything that I think generally falls under the rubric of "retro computing". For that matter though, you can probably do anything retro computing related you want to do with a $10 chinese made USB Logic Analzyer and Sigrock. For debugging deep internals of an actual modern PC, you would probably need a high specialized, and very expensive, piece of dedicated gear. Like, if you wanted to view changes on a DDR4 bus in real-time. That's a whole new ballgame.

In either case, don't forget about the various discounts that are available to EEVBlog forum members. Tequipment.net is one of the vendors who offers a discount. There is also a discount on Saelig kit. I think there may be others as well.
 

[tautech]

Hello,

I'm in the market for a new Oscilloscope (digital). My range of spending would be between $500.00 up to $1000.00. I guess the range doesn't matter much as I think if my top limit is 1000.00 then i should just say that I want a scope around $1000.00.

What am I going to use it for?
- old retro/new Tv's
- CB radio and other communications stuff
- stereo equipment old/new,
- old 70', 80's and up retro computers and consoles.
- current PC troubleshooting.

I've looked at Rigol and Siglent, not sure about keysight and others. What's the best bang for the buck? Is there one I can get for around $1000.00 and also unlock for free to further it's features without having to pay extra?

You will need a 4ch DSO and possibly MSO capability also to analyze data busses depending on your skill level.
What scope are you upgrading from and what features doesn't it have that you think you need ?

[MarkF]

Neither could I recommend an analog scope in 2021.
And there is a good chance you'd end up repairing a used analog scope instead of the things you're really interested in.

Nor could I recommend a Rigol DS110Z-S Plus.  Unless, you don't want to hack it and want to pay full price.
A DS1054Z hacked to 100MHz for $349 and a separate Logic Analyzer or Signal Generator might be a better option.

Be aware the Rigol -S and Plus versions need to be taken apart and the memory dumped to be able to hack them.

You will want 4-channels and maybe the Siglent or Rigol route.
Work on 'modern' PCs might require much higher bandwidths to work on...
I've had a Rigol DS1074Z for six years now.

The UNI-T UTG932 Function Generator  for $139 and has been discussed on the forum  with a cheaper scope,
like the DS1054Z, might be more useful.  @tautech can probably recommend the best companion Siglent scope.

[mindcrime]

TBH, I wasn't aware there were any hacks for the DS110Z-S Plus series. I simply bought my DS1104Z-S Plus straight up and use it completely un-modified. I quite like it as is. There may be cheaper ways to achieve the same ends, but if optimizing for the last penny spent isn't the OP's goal, then I have no qualms recommending the DS1104Z-S Plus as a fine scope in the price range mentioned.

OTOH, the ability to hack the MSO5000 and MSO7000 series scopes is quite interesting, but even at the low end they start above the OP's stated budget, so that might not be an option.

Back when I bought my first scope, I decided to prioritize bandwidth over channels, and went with a Rigol DS1102E. Those are also perfectly good scopes, albeit only 2 channels.  Knowing what I know now, I would always opt to pay for more channels and pay less for bandwidth, assuming a scope brand that can be software hacked to unlock the higher bandwidth.