Is this oscilloscope perhaps the best for the beginner?

[rstofer]

I'm just not convinced that getting a scope is the first thing I would suggest for somebody entering engineering/technical school.   Yes they will eventually want one, but I'd flesh out that work bench with other things before the scope.    Frankly I can't see a scope being hugely important in the first year anyways.

Scopes aren't generally backpack portable.  Although they may not be available, I would still recommend every EE student have an Analog Discovery 2 and a laptop computer in their backpack.  Just about anything that needs doing can be done with the AD2.  It is particularly useful for students.

Unfortunately, with distance learning, the backorder situation is ridiculous and I'm pretty sure Digilent has increased the price.  I thought it used to be about $279 and now it's $399.  Then again, Digilent was sold to NI so we have to expect things to change and not for the better.  Maybe just opportunistic pricing...

And, yes, a decent DMM would be at the top of the list.  However, the AD2 has 2 voltmeter channels (actually, the scope channels interpreted as voltage). Good enough...

[grawutsch]

Hi everyone,
I want to chime in on this discussion by asking how much of a difference is it to beginners that the two of these oscilloscopes have to offer? Rigol DS1054Z & SDS1104X-U

I learned a few things about oscilloscopes about 20 years ago in school but I had nothing to do with them afterwards until now.
One or two years ago I started to tinker around again with microcontrollers and I build guitar pedals as a hobby. A dream would be a diy synth. That's what I could use an oscilloscope for.
I got some money in the drawer and want to spend it on something usefull for my bench.
Given the fact that I am a hobbyist and don't need it for a living I want to buy something that is not too expensive but no crap. My grandfather used to say that we are to poor to buy cheap.
But my limit would be 400€.

I know that the Siglent-SDS1204X-E has more to offer for than a Siglent SDS1104X-U but 100€ are still 100€.

Is a Rigol DS1054Z still the best bang for the buck? (hacked or not hacked)

Right now there is a discount on the DS1054Z with a few "options".
Rigol DS1054Z
https://www.batronix.com/shop/oscilloscopes/Rigol-DS1054Z.html
With following options included SD-DS1000Z Serial Decoder, AT-DS1000Z Advanced Trigger, MEM-DS1000Z Memory Option, REC-DS1000Z Record-Module
€ 374.85

Siglent SDS1104X-U
https://www.batronix.com/shop/oscilloscopes/Siglent-SDS1104X-U.html
€ 427.21

I don't know if I realy need it but I love to learn new stuff and I don't want to buy another guitar

[rstofer]

Hi everyone,
I want to chime in on this discussion by asking how much of a difference is it to beginners that the two of these oscilloscopes have to offer? Rigol DS1054Z & SDS1104X-U

I believe the SDS1104X-U will have a better user interface than the Rigol.  You can check over in Test Equipment for any reviews on the -U model.

But my limit would be 400€.

I know that the Siglent-SDS1204X-E has more to offer for than a Siglent SDS1104X-U but 100€ are still 100€.

Based on Amazon and currency exchange, you are $15 short of the SDS1104X-E which has more features than the SDS1104X-U - notably the Bode' plot which you may never use.  I believe it requires a Siglent waveform generator.

The hot setup right now is to buy the SDS1104X-E and unlock it to get the 200 MHz option like the SDS1204X-E.

Is a Rigol DS1054Z still the best bang for the buck? (hacked or not hacked)

It was a couple of years ago but today I believe the SDS1104X-E is the way to go.  It costs an additional $150 but it can be unlocked to 200 MHz and that's a nice feature for digital systems.  It is meaningless for audio.

If audio and low speed uC peripherals (SPI, I2C, UART) is the application arena, either of the DS1054Z or SDS1104X-E will serve just fine.  Of course, the DS1054Z would have to be unlocked to 100 MHz.

Right now there is a discount on the DS1054Z with a few "options".
Rigol DS1054Z
https://www.batronix.com/shop/oscilloscopes/Rigol-DS1054Z.html

Doesn't matter!  When you unlock using DSER, you get all the options and the 100 MHz bandwidth.  Search Google for riglol

http://www.gotroot.ca/rigol/riglol/

DSER isn't listed for the DS1000Z but it is the proper one to use.

I keep linking to this mega-thread.  Charlotte buys the 2 channel SDS1202X-E (200 MHz 2 Channel) at message 150.  I would highly recommend you read the entire mega-thread.  We do some very interesting experiments using features that practically nobody ever discusses.  It was a lot of fun learning about all the features of the Siglent.

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/beginners/what-an-oscilloscope-recommended-for-a-woman-passionate-about-electronics/msg3100087/#msg3100087

There are two other threads in the Beginner forum dealing with this exact subject.  There's no reason to repeat all the information.  Search for 'SDS1104X-E'

I own the DS1054Z unlocked to 100 MHz with all the options enabled and it's a fine scope for my purposes.  I wanted 4 channels, Charlotte figured she could get along with 2.  Her applications are likely different than mine.

Were I going out to spend money on a scope, it would be the SDS1104X-E and I would unlock 200 MHz as soon as I opened the box.  Then I would sit back and be happy.

[wizard69]

I'm just not convinced that getting a scope is the first thing I would suggest for somebody entering engineering/technical school.   Yes they will eventually want one, but I'd flesh out that work bench with other things before the scope.    Frankly I can't see a scope being hugely important in the first year anyways.

Scopes aren't generally backpack portable.  Although they may not be available, I would still recommend every EE student have an Analog Discovery 2 and a laptop computer in their backpack.  Just about anything that needs doing can be done with the AD2.  It is particularly useful for students.

Unfortunately, with distance learning, the backorder situation is ridiculous and I'm pretty sure Digilent has increased the price.  I thought it used to be about $279 and now it's $399.  Then again, Digilent was sold to NI so we have to expect things to change and not for the better.  Maybe just opportunistic pricing...

For a student something like the Digilent would be a good idea.

As for the sale to NI, that is reason enough in my  mind not to do business with them.  This is the first I've heard of them being National Instruments property.

And, yes, a decent DMM would be at the top of the list.  However, the AD2 has 2 voltmeter channels (actually, the scope channels interpreted as voltage). Good enough...

With the price bumped to $399 there are likely other USB connected "scopes" or similar devices competing.   That high price just opens up the field to many competing devices.   I'm not really up on what is available in this niche so maybe the competition isn't there yet.

[Electro Fan]

the SDS1104X-E which has more features than the SDS1104X-U - notably the Bode' plot which you may never use.  I believe it requires a Siglent waveform generator.

Off topic, sorry, but is this true of all Siglent scopes including X-E and X Plus?  Bode plots only works with Siglent sig gens?

[tautech]

the SDS1104X-E which has more features than the SDS1104X-U - notably the Bode' plot which you may never use.  I believe it requires a Siglent waveform generator.

Off topic, sorry, but is this true of all Siglent scopes including X-E and X Plus?  Bode plots only works with Siglent sig gens?

X Plus, no as they have an inbuilt 50 MHz AWG.

All X-E models and SDS5000X models require an external stimulus source for Bode plot that can be a standalone AWG or the 25 MHz SAG1021I AWG USB module that's controlled entirely from the scopes UI.

For Bode plot use with a standalone AWG it's automatically controlled via USB or LAN irrespective of the model of scope.

[rstofer]

With the price bumped to $399 there are likely other USB connected "scopes" or similar devices competing.   That high price just opens up the field to many competing devices.   I'm not really up on what is available in this niche so maybe the competition isn't there yet.

The Analog Devices ADALM2000 competes and costs just $249

https://www.analog.com/en/design-center/evaluation-hardware-and-software/evaluation-boards-kits/adalm2000.html#eb-overview

The software isn't even close.  I didn't spend enough time to actually use it for something because it didn't appear to have a 'demo' device.  One thing about Digilent Waveforms, you can run through the software with no external hardware.

Since I already have an AD2, there was no reason for me to actually compare specs.

It's unfortunate that the AD2 has increased in price.  It's a fantastic learning tool and competes well with a bench full of equipment.  At $400, I wouldn't have even had the experience.

[Adrian_Arg.]

Siglent Technologies SDS1052DL u$s259.0 in amazon

[tautech]

Siglent Technologies SDS1052DL u$s259.0 in amazon

Don't even bother as the feature set is minimal and memory depth pitiful. 
Never ever been tempted to import those here.

[rsjsouza]

With the price bumped to $399 there are likely other USB connected "scopes" or similar devices competing.   That high price just opens up the field to many competing devices.   I'm not really up on what is available in this niche so maybe the competition isn't there yet.

Wow, I just saw this and $399 + whatever taxes and shipping comes along, it is really expensive. That not accounting for some of the most useful accessories such as the BNC adapter.

Sure, it has a ton of features but, for the individual user, it seriously clashes with other products - for starters a Owon VDS1022 at $100 ($60~70 in a promotion) is a very competent starter. Link this to a Kingst or a cheaper Saleae clone and you start to have the components to a serious beginner's lab for much less money.

The Analog Devices ADALM2000 competes and costs just $249

https://www.analog.com/en/design-center/evaluation-hardware-and-software/evaluation-boards-kits/adalm2000.html#eb-overview

The software isn't even close.  I didn't spend enough time to actually use it for something because it didn't appear to have a 'demo' device.  One thing about Digilent Waveforms, you can run through the software with no external hardware.

This is probably the reason why the ADALM is cheaper. Maintain software is an expensive business, especially in these days of ever changing OSes and Browsers which seem to break compatibility quite often. Besides, in my experience the risk is higher as this educational platform is not really the core business of the company - it is not uncommon for a full discontinuation to be one reorg away, unfortunately.

[YurkshireLad]

As a beginner, I've been looking at (if I can convince myself to spend this kind of money):

• Rigol DS1102Z-E from https://shop.electro-meters.com/collections/digital-oscilloscopes/products/rigol-ds1102z-e-8560281
• Siglent SDS1102CML+ from https://www.transcat.ca/brand/siglent-store/oscilloscope/siglent-sds1102cml-100-mhz-oscilloscope-2-channel

They're both around C$400.

[StillTrying]

Rigol DS1102Z-E
Siglent SDS1102CML+

Between those 2, I doubt the SDS1102CML+ is worth it these days, others can draw better traces and there's no control over the memory. In the UK the DS1102Z-E is usually a bit cheaper.

[tautech]

Rigol DS1102Z-E
Siglent SDS1102CML+

Between those 2, I doubt the SDS1102CML+ is worth it these days, others can draw better traces and there's no control over the memory. In the UK the DS1102Z-E is usually a bit cheaper.

Yes, no contest as the 1102Z-E is far better spec'ed.
A comparable model from Siglent is SDS1202X-E or for a similar but little dearer price point SDS1104X-U.

[YurkshireLad]

What about a GW Instek GDS-1202B for a beginner? Or even the GDS-1102A, which is cheaper.

[andersthuresson]

What about a GW Instek GDS-1202B for a beginner? Or even the GDS-1102A, which is cheaper.

The GW Instek GDS-1202B seems to be a nice scope. Rumor has it that the FFT part of these scopes is quite nice and one of the better out there. My local prices here show that it's around 433 USD for the 1202B while the 1102A is actually a few dollars more expensive at 460 USD. These prices are from element14 (Farnell) and I guess there are cheaper places out there. Point is that the Siglent SDS1202X-E cost 359 USD at Amazon delivered, which is a bit cheaper. I recently got myself a SDS1104X-E and I am very happy with it so far.

[YurkshireLad]

The scopes in my price range appear to be (according to Amazon Canada pricing):

• Rigol DS1102Z-E
• Hantek DSO5102P
• Rigol DS1102E

[MikeK]

The Rigol DS1102E is now outdated, no?

[YurkshireLad]

The Rigol DS1102E is now outdated, no?

Possibly; one thing I haven't done is determine when these models were introduced.

[YurkshireLad]

I forgot to include the HANMATEK DOS1102, but I think it might be a re-branded clone.

Oh and the Owon SDS1102. I need to read these forums for comments on this one.

[StillTrying]

The Rigol DS1102E is now outdated

5.7″ QVGA (320 x 240) display

= Yes.

[rsjsouza]

The DS1052E/1102E is still a great scooe if you have nothing and find one in the used market for cheap. But paying the full price of a new unit, you are better served by other offers.