Electronics > Beginners
Looking for a better breadboard
tggzzz:
--- Quote from: dcbrown73 on September 26, 2019, 01:12:12 pm ---
--- Quote from: tggzzz on September 26, 2019, 12:16:18 pm ---Whichever breadboard you use, you will find you spend more time debugging the breadboard than your circuit.
Much better to bite the bullet and use rat's nest or manhattan techniques over a solid groundplane.
--- End quote ---
While in many cases, this is without question true. Breadboards do have their place. Especially for people just getting into the hobby building small low freq circuits.
I try not to warn people away from breadboards. Just warn them of the potential hazards they could face when using it depending on the circuit. You can build a lot of things on a breadboard without issue. Especially when testing concepts that your learning.
--- End quote ---
Until the varying resistance in an intermittent causes puzzlement. Or an audio frequency circuit oscillates at RF due to the the inductance of wire, stray capacitance and mutual inductance.
Nowadays I refuse to try to debug someone's circuit if it is on a solderless breadboard.
dcbrown73:
--- Quote from: tggzzz on September 26, 2019, 01:16:47 pm ---
--- Quote from: dcbrown73 on September 26, 2019, 01:12:12 pm ---
--- Quote from: tggzzz on September 26, 2019, 12:16:18 pm ---Whichever breadboard you use, you will find you spend more time debugging the breadboard than your circuit.
Much better to bite the bullet and use rat's nest or manhattan techniques over a solid groundplane.
--- End quote ---
While in many cases, this is without question true. Breadboards do have their place. Especially for people just getting into the hobby building small low freq circuits.
I try not to warn people away from breadboards. Just warn them of the potential hazards they could face when using it depending on the circuit. You can build a lot of things on a breadboard without issue. Especially when testing concepts that your learning.
--- End quote ---
Until the varying resistance in an intermittent causes puzzlement. Or an audio frequency circuit oscillates at RF due to the the inductance of wire, stray capacitance and mutual inductance.
Nowadays I refuse to try to debug someone's circuit if it is on a solderless breadboard.
--- End quote ---
...and I certainly don't blame you. :)
tooki:
--- Quote from: tggzzz on September 26, 2019, 12:16:18 pm ---Whichever breadboard you use, you will find you spend more time debugging the breadboard than your circuit.
Much better to bite the bullet and use rat's nest or manhattan techniques over a solid groundplane.
--- End quote ---
Please stop with the perpetual anti-breadboard crusade. You don’t need to hijack every single thread about breadboards with this crap.
By taking an absolutist stance, rather than a realistic, measured approach, you also impugn your credibility, since plenty of people make all kinds of circuits on breadboards successfully. No, you’re not gonna do a high power microwave transmitter on one. But they work really well for most of the stuff beginners start with, as well as for plenty of digital logic circuits, etc. Learning the real-world limitations of a tool is also very important, as dcbrown said. (And frankly, I think you’re exaggerating more than just a little when you say you’ll spend more time debugging the breadboard than the circuit. I haven’t found that to be the case at all. Additionally, the problems you claim can also happen with other construction methods. You aren’t seriously going to claim that a perfboard or point-to-point audio amp can’t oscillate, are you?)
Breadboards have their place, and it’s just wrong to pretend they don’t. Breadboards significantly lower the barrier to entry for beginners, by making it quick and easy to experiment, and to reuse parts. It’s ridiculous to suggest that beginners should start soldering together everything right from the start. There’s a reason why kids start with LEGO, not with bricks and mortar.
scatterandfocus:
--- Quote from: tggzzz on September 26, 2019, 12:16:18 pm ---Whichever breadboard you use, you will find you spend more time debugging the breadboard than your circuit.
Much better to bite the bullet and use rat's nest or manhattan techniques over a solid groundplane.
--- End quote ---
Noob question here on using copper clad board for manhattan construction. Why is it good to have a such a big groundplane, as opposed to much smaller ground traces on a pcb or solderless breadboard?
tggzzz:
--- Quote from: scatterandfocus on September 26, 2019, 05:38:39 pm ---
--- Quote from: tggzzz on September 26, 2019, 12:16:18 pm ---Whichever breadboard you use, you will find you spend more time debugging the breadboard than your circuit.
Much better to bite the bullet and use rat's nest or manhattan techniques over a solid groundplane.
--- End quote ---
Noob question here on using copper clad board for manhattan construction. Why is it good to have a such a big groundplane, as opposed to much smaller ground traces on a pcb or solderless breadboard?
--- End quote ---
There are many many advantages, particularly low inductance and resistance.
FFI, Google for benefits of a ground plane.
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