calibration-fluke 87V - what's the correct price ?

[eevblogfan]

hey

I called to some lab here that saied that he could calibrate my 87V for only 36$ . is he kidding on me ?

I thought that it's cost 100$++ . am I wrong ?

is that possible ?

p.s : thought to post it here on begginers since that's kinda begginer's questuion I guess 

thank you in advance

[jpb]

Calibration costs for standard 4 1/2 digit DVMs are at about that level (I was quoted £30 to calibrate a 5 1/2 digit meter which I thought suspiciously cheap).

The labs might not realise that the 87V has a high resolution 30000(?) count mode so have quoted their standard price for DVMs.

Meters with more digits get increasingly expensive to calibrate especially if traceable standards are used. I've heard that 8 1/2 digit meters cost more to calibrate
than it is to buy your average house but I've no personal experience.

[eevblogfan]

it can do 20,000 on hi res mode

as per the price , I think the 8 1/2 meter is 4000$ or so . not house price - though I could be wrong

does my hp3478A should cost 30~70$ to callibrate ? or more ?

thank you in advance

[saturation]

The going price varies by country, it remains  ~ $100 in the USA,  but it must be a NIST traceable certificate by an NVLAP or equivalent lab. 

For whatever you pay, if its not traceable to the standards lab of your country, the calibration is questionable, regardless of price.

[olsenn]

It's a bloody 4-digit handheld multimeter... buy a another cheap ($50) multimeter from Extech etc. and use that to calibrate it yourself. Then you have two multimeters. Handhelds aren't used to high accuracy lab testing or for obtaining certifications... they are for repair work and general purpose work, where as long as you can tell that P17 has +12V on it, plus or minus 5 percent, it does its job. Don't waste $100 on getting the damn thing a NIST traceable certificate.

Besides, the Fluke 87 is known to keep its accuracy for a LONG time... it is probably still in calibration anyways.

[EEVblog]

It takes about (or should take about if they do it properly) an hour to fully calibrate a Fluke 87 and produce a traceable test report. Do the math based on your countries typical hourly rate for something like that.

[StevenB]

Handhelds aren't used to high accuracy lab testing or for obtaining certifications... they are for repair work and general purpose work,

I'm going to have to dissagree with you there.  We use 87's all the time for certification testing and they serve that purpose well.  I'm not sure I understand why them being handheld or 4-digit should matter (as long as that accuracy is adequate for the application).

Besides, the Fluke 87 is known to keep its accuracy for a LONG time... it is probably still in calibration anyways.

If you are required to have calibrated equipment, reputation of its reliability doesn't matter.

[eevblogfan]

he is within 0.06% out compare to my trusty 3478A

that's out of call ,

besides , I bought it used , perhaps a-lot of time that it wasn't calibrated ( it states n000 on the cal counter built in )

so 36$ isn't a-lot to pay for that calibration - isn't it ? 0_0

[olsenn]

If you are required to have calibrated equipment, reputation of its reliability doesn't matter.

I'll admit truth to that; in the workplace, many times the written requirements for your project require you to make tests only with equipment that has a traceable calibration. However, if you are just looking to calibrate your personal multimeter for home use, forget all that... the behavour mentioned above is a Dilbert comit in the making... sheer foolishness. Companies pay hundreds (and thousands) of dollars to get new stickers on their equipment each year and it doesn't mean a damn thing. The point of doing it is to be able to pass blame onto somebody else if things fail!

[c4757p]

he is within 0.06% out compare to my trusty 3478A

Are you sure your 3478A is trustworthy? Both of those meters should have very good stability. If they don't match I see no reason to blame one over the other.

[StevenB]

I can definitley attest to the Dilbert-like behavior when it comes to equipment calibration. 

I was told at one company I worked at, a meter was determined to be in calibration if the mains voltage was measured within tolerance.  I always hoped that was a joke.

[eevblogfan]

the hp3478A was calibrated last year ,

I have got 787 and the 287 and the 3478A agreed till the last digit ( the 278 was relled out )

the 87 is out of call that's for sure

[c4757p]

I was told at one company I worked at, a meter was determined to be in calibration if the mains voltage was measured within tolerance.  I always hoped that was a joke.

If you mean "within the meter's tolerance according to another meter" than I submit a icon. If you mean "within mains voltage tolerance" (114V to 126V IIRC) I don't have one strong enough - can we pretend  is contemplating suicide?

[saturation]

FYI the Fluke 87V is not easy to calibrate; you must perform the entire process, in sequence, from start to finish, including a 10A DC and AC source, 1 kV DC and AC source, all of reference quality.  If you do not complete it the calibration sequence will abort, and the meter will revert to the last state.

Given the Fluke's hold cal for very long times its worth it to do it once; the only time I've seen a Fluke 80s series go off cal is after an accident: a blow fuse or a drop of over 3' to concrete.  On the older 80 series with pot based cals, you can DIY easily and trim it as needed.

In contrast, the 1272a Agilent meters and others in their Escort designed series are amenable to DIY cal you can do just one range and that's it.

[eevblogfan]

hey

DIY cal is nice but unfortunately my 87V is not one of this meters 

[StevenB]

If you mean "within the meter's tolerance according to another meter" than I submit a icon. If you mean "within mains voltage tolerance" (114V to 126V IIRC) I don't have one strong enough - can we pretend  is contemplating suicide?

Yeah, unfortunately, I mean the later.  I don't think their is an emoticon strong enough to represent my reaction at the time.  As long as you have that sticker on it, we are good to go, right?

[saturation]

hi, what I mean is if you think your 87V or similar Fluke DMM is out of cal, its worth the price to have it professionally calibrated and adjusted.  If you are the only user and don't abuse it and blow the 10A fuse, its unlikely to be cal'd again for the rest of its life.  I've 4 80 series meters, all have kept cal in 20+ years.

hey

DIY cal is nice but unfortunately my 87V is not one of this meters 

[ivan747]

Since thisis about calibration, what would be the price for calibrating 3, 4 and 5 and a half digit multimeters?

[saturation]

Up to 4.5 or maybe 5.5 digits its ~ same cost, its about labor.  If calibrators are fully automated it lowers the cost; if there is some manual component it increases cost, so it depends on the meter being calibrated.

Note, I used the word "calibration" to include adjustment in my prior posts, its often understood to be separate so calibration could mean only insuring the meter is to spec, but does not include adjusting the meter to stay in spec. 

Finally, it common to have levels of calibration certification.  They charge extra if the raw calibration data be reported to you, or if they provide a NIST or ISO certificate.

Since thisis about calibration, what would be the price for calibrating 3, 4 and 5 and a half digit multimeters?

[ace3838]

I am a calibration tech.  We charge $65.00 for a full ISO 17025 calibration.  The purpose of calibration is to check a unit under test against a known standard and to make it right.  A Known standard has to be at least 4 times more accurate than the unit under test and within the acceptable range.  Not to mention it needs to be calibrated it'self. And you have to use an industry accepted procedure for the calibration.  If your doing a DIY calibration, think about this. If your "Standard" is let's say +-0.005 accuracy and your unit under test is +- 0.005.  Then the combined error could be 0.01! Not to mention if your standard is not properly calibrated, then you are potentially adjusting your unit under test out of stated accuracy.  If you suspect your meter is not reading right, send it to someone who knows what they are doing, and make sure they are ISO17025 accredited with a certificate stating that.  www.weedonengineering.com

[wilheldp]

A Known standard has to be at least 4 times more accurate than the unit under test and within the acceptable range. 

I don't doubt what you are saying, but is there really a voltage standard that is 4 times more accurate than an 8-1/2 digit multimeter with 0.05 ppm dcV transfer accuracy (Agilent 3458A)?  If so, how would you calibrate the voltage standard?

[saturation]

Most cal labs use at least 4x more accurate references to check a DUT, its standard procedure.  But for calibrating high accuracy devices, such as the references themselves, the standard used to check it may not be 4x. Mathematics and special procedures are used to reduce the risk of error. 

For example, to calibrate the HP 3458a, there are 2 common methods, the one I mentioned which costs $600, and against the volt standard, the Josephson Junction, which cost $1600.

A Known standard has to be at least 4 times more accurate than the unit under test and within the acceptable range. 

I don't doubt what you are saying, but is there really a voltage standard that is 4 times more accurate than an 8-1/2 digit multimeter with 0.05 ppm dcV transfer accuracy (Agilent 3458A)?  If so, how would you calibrate the voltage standard?