Author Topic: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)  (Read 20901 times)

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Offline nanofrog

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #50 on: May 04, 2015, 03:27:02 am »
I would love to know where I could buy a Hakko FX-888 in the USA, in the SILVER color.   I would buy a Hakko but I just don't like the blue/yellow fisher price color scheme.   The batterfly.com site someone mentioned earlier is the first place I've actually seen one for sale and I'm not sure about ordering from a site whose default language isn't even English.   :)
I'm not seeing a P/N for a silver model in 120V from Hakkousa.com (Hakko's official US website). The one on Batterfly is a 230V version.

Silver case parts could be had if you're that set on it though (i.e. paint the main shell & replace the control section so you have the labeling). Seems excessive effort & expense though.  :-//
 

Offline rob77

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #51 on: May 04, 2015, 05:37:00 am »
and it's 2 part device. having 2 separate footprints on a desk/bench might be a disadvantage
Seriously? It allows more flexibility in placement. You can put the power/control unit out of the way, and move the iron's stand closer to the work.

Seriously ! ;) and please note the word "might" and also the the part "especially for small benches" which you stripped off in your quote ;)
 

Offline nanofrog

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #52 on: May 04, 2015, 06:47:08 am »
and it's 2 part device. having 2 separate footprints on a desk/bench might be a disadvantage
Seriously? It allows more flexibility in placement. You can put the power/control unit out of the way, and move the iron's stand closer to the work.

Seriously ! ;) and please note the word "might" and also the the part "especially for small benches" which you stripped off in your quote ;)
So you set the stand and control unit right next to/on top of - one another if your bench space is tight. JBC's Compact Line takes this approach by bonding them together in this fashion.  ;) Other brands you can set the stand on top of the station, similar to old Wellers (anything with a flat top on the control unit). Or if you don't want to set them next to or on top of one another (or can't for whatever reason), there's things like shelves that the control unit can be set on. Stand too for that matter.  >:D  :box:
 

Online wraper

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #53 on: May 04, 2015, 07:40:21 am »
new models use 413 tips, for example LF-3000/3200/3500 (they start at $110)
Where do they start at $110? I don't know such a place. I only see that handpiece alone do cost $80 (almost as whole fx-888d) on the link you gave.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2015, 07:47:51 am by wraper »
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #54 on: May 04, 2015, 07:59:24 am »
new models use 413 tips, for example LF-3000/3200/3500 (they start at $110)
Where do they start at $110? I don't know such a place. I only see that handpiece alone do cost $80 (almost as whole fx-888d) on the link you gave.

http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_2143970_-1
of course there is 3 months wait time :D
model one power level up is available tho
http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_2181503_-1
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Offline rob77

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #55 on: May 04, 2015, 05:35:27 pm »
So you set the stand and control unit right next to/on top of - one another if your bench space is tight.
teach me master how to put the 2 parts of of hakko 888 on top of each other :D any solution involving duct-tape and hot-snot are not accepted  :-DD
JBC's Compact Line takes this approach by bonding them together in this fashion.  ;)
aren't we way off the budget here ?

simply admit it - the glorified hakko 888 is not necessarily the best option for everyone.
and among the single footprint there is  one more (and BIG) advantage of single-body soldering stations - you can't push the stand away by accident - the weight of the station won't allow you to do that ;)
 

Offline JackP

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #56 on: May 04, 2015, 05:46:22 pm »
I don't think this is going to be an issue in real life. Both parts are small, it gives you flexibility when needed, and for the price is very capable. Normally, if something is hyped up (especially by the knowledgeable people here) then there is good reason (ahem DS1054z).
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Offline Luckymat

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #57 on: May 04, 2015, 09:45:11 pm »
hi

i have talked o my Mom and asked her (again) for money
she was not happy at all  ::)
i will get RIGOL DS1054Z in some time for sure
but now i have to wait and i'm gonna buy 200€ Station
so what you think should i get

http://www.weidinger.eu/shop/loettechnik/jbc/jbc_loet-_und_entloetgeraete/jbc_compact_line/wl26830
or
http://www.beta-estore.com/rkuk/order_product_details.html?p=511

i won't buy hakko 888D for now
just vote or post other iron 150-250€

few People said i should get the ersa one but that JBC Looks interesting too
and i don't care whatever it has seperate holder or not it has Advantages and disadvantages i'll come along with both
« Last Edit: May 04, 2015, 09:47:52 pm by Luckymat »
 

Online Monkeh

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Offline Luckymat

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #59 on: May 04, 2015, 10:02:21 pm »
http://de.farnell.com/metcal/ps-900/l-tstation-60w-240v-eu-uk/dp/1560738

Looks OK enough for me
hmm i'll buy whatever gets many votes (so now i have 3 to pick from)
« Last Edit: May 04, 2015, 10:11:20 pm by Luckymat »
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #60 on: May 04, 2015, 10:53:24 pm »
no point looking at votes, between those three you will get similar top quality and performance, difference might be in how you like the handle and tip availability (and tip price)
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Offline kxenos

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #61 on: May 05, 2015, 01:49:20 am »
The tips of the JBC contain the heating element so they're a bit pricey (around 80euro each) but they last forever. Out of the three it is clearly the best, I think. Warm up in 2 seconds, can handle large ground planes and thick wires and they have the smallest tip width of all three. METCAL haven't proved so reliable for me (I use the MFR-1350 desoldering tool and 900 hot air station). In the ersa (old model, don't remember which one, I have replaced 2 heating elements and I think 4 tips in the last 10-12 years so I guess it's kind of reliable. Wellers, in my opinion are the worst of top quality brands, ugly, unreliable and expensive to fix. One other option is thermaltronix. Check them out to see if there is a model that suits you
 

Offline nanofrog

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #62 on: May 05, 2015, 01:59:54 am »
teach me master how to put the 2 parts of of hakko 888 on top of each other :D any solution involving duct-tape and hot-snot are not accepted  :-DD
Easy/lazy method = epoxy (single stage putty types found in automotive parts stores would be really handy for curved surfaces, as it's meant to be used as a filler & can take very high temperatures).  :o  >:D

If you've a problem with that, there's also fasteners.  :P

aren't we way off the budget here ?
It was only an example of a station that did a side-by-side enclosure construction rather than separates, which I'm sure you realized was the point.  ::)  :-DD

But not everyone is on a tight budget, so it depends on the person doing the shopping.  :box:

simply admit it - the glorified hakko 888 is not necessarily the best option for everyone.
Never said it was. I would however put forth the concept if a buyer is after a quality, entry level station due to budget restrictions (without being unrealistic), then the Hakko FX-888D is one hell of a value v. the Chinese brands that can be had for less money (i.e. you get what you pay for). Not to say 100% of all Chinese brands are garbage, as they're not. But those that are well made are also priced similarly to the FX-888D.

Now this ^ used to be only valid for the US/CAN market as we were the only ones that could get them for ~100USD, but with the advent of Batterfly selling the 230V EU version for 98EUR, that's changed to include the EU market as well (according to xe.com, the price works out to ~109USD).   :-+

and among the single footprint there is  one more (and BIG) advantage of single-body soldering stations - you can't push the stand away by accident - the weight of the station won't allow you to do that ;)
I would seriously have to disagree with you here. I don't have an issue with the stands being pushed away due to light weight at all (mine are heavy enough + rubber feet they I've had zero issues with it skittering across the bench when trying to stuff the iron in).

FWIW, 2 layer rubber ESD mats usually help keep stuff in place as well IME.
 

Online Monkeh

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #63 on: May 05, 2015, 02:03:37 am »
Now this ^ used to be only valid for the US/CAN market as we were the only ones that could get them for ~100USD, but with the advent of Batterfly selling the 230V EU version for 98EUR, that's changed to include the EU market as well (according to xe.com, the price works out to ~109USD).   :-+

+ delivery + 22% VAT. It is a damn sight cheaper than Dancap at any rate.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2015, 02:05:34 am by Monkeh »
 

Offline nanofrog

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #64 on: May 05, 2015, 02:14:59 am »
but now i have to wait and i'm gonna buy 200€ Station

http://www.weidinger.eu/shop/loettechnik/jbc/jbc_loet-_und_entloetgeraete/jbc_compact_line/wl26830

or

http://www.beta-estore.com/rkuk/order_product_details.html?p=511

Both are quality stations, and will give you excellent results.  :-+

There are some differences though, namely in the heating technology used, which has a direct effect on the cost of the tips.

The JBC uses cartridge tips, which means the tip, heating element, and sensor are all part of the tip assembly. Handle is nothing more than a plastic tube with 3 connecting tabs inside to interface with the tips. This also means the tips are more expensive.

The Ersa uses an iron that includes the heating element and temperature sensor, so all that's replaced, is the actual tip (just a plated copper slug). Makes the tip replacement cost a lot cheaper. 3 - 5x cheaper per tip on average (depending on tip profile and what you find for street prices).

From a technical standpoint, the JBC would have a slight advantage in performance only when pushed to it's limits (not often), but would cost you a lot more money to get your tip selection sorted, as well as have an increased tip replacement cost.

Do note that lead based alloys don't etch the iron off nearly as fast as lead-free alloys do, so it's not unheard of to get years out of a single tip for hobbyist users (some have seen 10+ years out of a tip).

http://de.farnell.com/metcal/ps-900/l-tstation-60w-240v-eu-uk/dp/1560738

Looks OK enough for me
hmm i'll buy whatever gets many votes (so now i have 3 to pick from)
This is also a well built station.

Do be aware that the tips on these set the temperature, so if you need more than one temp for a given tip profile, you'll have to buy more than one tip in that size. Sounds strange, but this actually makes sense from a process control POV in manufacturing, as the user cannot change the settings.

For a hobbyist however, this can translate to additional expense to build up a tip collection.

___________________________

Definitely something to think about, depending on what's important to you (suspect consumables cost are going to be a real issue for you for right now).

Personally I'd skip the Metcal/OKi entirely due to the lack of temperature control, and use tip cost as the deciding factor between the JBC or Ersa. That said, ultimately I've the sense the Ersa would be the best choice for ~200EUR based on what you've posted.
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #65 on: May 05, 2015, 02:33:46 am »
The tips of the JBC contain the heating element so they're a bit pricey (around 80euro each) but they last forever. Out of the three it is clearly the best

they are 20-30 euro now, and like you say they last forever
http://www.jbctools.com/catalegfitxa.php?idpro=890#C245673

there are two tips already included with 210Euro JBC, making it a great deal
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Offline continuo

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #66 on: May 11, 2015, 09:58:55 pm »
Weidinger does not sell to end consumers, they do only to business customers. So all of the prices on their website are without VAT, which in Germany is 19%... Add that to your 219€ and the price Luckymat had to pay, if they would sell it to him (which they will not), would be ~260€...

JBC soldering stations are hard to get for end consumers in Germany (same goes for Hakko), your best bet is eBay or http://www.chiemtronic.de/ - that's pretty it. That's a somewhat uncomfortable situation, because if, say in a few years from now, you need some spare parts or tips or whatever and these few shops are out of business by then, you may have a problem...

On the other hand, if you buy a Weller or Ersa (in Germany), you always get everything from hundreds of sources without any problems, even a decade or more later. I can even take my bicycle on a Saturday evening, ride the 30 Minutes to the next bigger town and buy me a Weller tip in an old fashioned brick and mortar store. Try that with a JBC tip... They wouldn't even know the company or think of car stereos...

So my advice would be to stick to the well known and supported brands here in Germany, even if the mentioned JBC station may be very appealing, from a pure technical standpoint of view. But broad availability and long term and easy support may pay out in the long run and (at least in my opinion) outweighs slight technical advantages by far...
 

Offline con-f-use

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #67 on: May 12, 2015, 09:26:42 am »
You could build one yourself that uses the excellent WXMP. Or if you prefer self-made Hakko/JBC.
« Last Edit: May 12, 2015, 10:36:09 am by con-f-use »
 

Offline Luckymat

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #68 on: May 12, 2015, 09:37:16 pm »
I think i will buy that ersa i-con nano (....again)
will it be shipped from eu if i buy it from that site? ( http://www.beta-estore.com/rkuk/order_product_details.html?p=511 )
I will get it somewhere next month
(I won't.close that thread for now becouse i may have problems)
« Last Edit: May 12, 2015, 09:39:30 pm by Luckymat »
 

Online wraper

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #69 on: May 12, 2015, 10:20:16 pm »
I think i will buy that ersa i-con nano (....again)
will it be shipped from eu if i buy it from that site? ( http://www.beta-estore.com/rkuk/order_product_details.html?p=511 )
I will get it somewhere next month
(I won't.close that thread for now becouse i may have problems)
It seem to be Ireland based. But I wonder, why would you want to get German made soldering station abroad while you can buy it in Germany for less money?
 

Offline Luckymat

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #70 on: May 13, 2015, 08:33:02 am »
I think i will buy that ersa i-con nano (....again)
will it be shipped from eu if i buy it from that site? ( http://www.beta-estore.com/rkuk/order_product_details.html?p=511 )
I will get it somewhere next month
(I won't.close that thread for now becouse i may have problems)
It seem to be Ireland based. But I wonder, why would you want to get German made soldering station abroad while you can buy it in Germany for less money?

link pls...
amazon did sell me kind of broken one...
 

Offline nanofrog

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #71 on: May 13, 2015, 11:12:58 am »
I think i will buy that ersa i-con nano (....again)
will it be shipped from eu if i buy it from that site? ( http://www.beta-estore.com/rkuk/order_product_details.html?p=511 )
I will get it somewhere next month
(I won't.close that thread for now becouse i may have problems)
It seem to be Ireland based. But I wonder, why would you want to get German made soldering station abroad while you can buy it in Germany for less money?

link pls...
amazon did sell me kind of broken one...
Click on the link, then scroll to the bottom of the page.

At which point you'll find this...

     Beta LAYOUT Ltd. | Bay 98
     Shannon Free Zone | Shannon, Co. Clare | Ireland
     Telephone: +353 (0)61 701170 | Facsimile: +353 (0)61 701164
     E-Mail: shop@beta-estore.com

As mentioned, Amazon has a nasty habit of reselling defective returns instead of sending them back to the manufacturer (even on top tier goods like Wiha & Ersa), and they're marked/listed as new, unopened.
 

Online wraper

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #72 on: May 13, 2015, 11:27:24 am »
link pls...
amazon did sell me kind of broken one...
So what? As if the soldering station would be different if bought from different place. Also at least a part of what you wrote was lack of understanding rather than actual fault.
http://www.ersa-shop.com/ersa-icon-nano-elektronisch-geregelte-l%C3%B6tstation-standby-antistatisch-p-364.html
« Last Edit: May 13, 2015, 12:26:29 pm by wraper »
 

Offline nanofrog

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #73 on: May 13, 2015, 12:08:41 pm »
link pls...
amazon did sell me kind of broken one...
So what? As if the soldering station would be different if bought from different place. Also at least a part of what you wrote was lack of understanding rather than actual fault.
http://www.ersa-shop.com/ersa-icon-nano-elektronisch-geregelte-l%C3%B6tstation-standby-antistatisch-p-364.html
Huh?  :-//

Regarding the station itself, a working Ersa i-Con Nano is a working i-Con Nano.  ;D  :-+ Worst case, it might need a different power cord.

I'm just advocating skipping Amazon in favor of a distributor instead (may still get a bad one, but not due to recycling defective units back into saleable stock nonsense that Amazon pulls).  ;) You won't have any potential issues with warranty support either.

I only posted Beta's physical address to confirm they're based in Ireland as he requested a link for proof. As per why it's cheaper in Ireland than Germany, they're in a unique location, Shannon Free Zone (lower taxes in this particular case), and gross wages are higher in Germany than Ireland (sources =Eurostat and National; after taxes however, it seems the Irish end up with more in take-home pay <lower gross values, but higher net values in Ireland are consistent in both sources>).
 

Online wraper

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Re: Soldering Station for <200€ (EU)
« Reply #74 on: May 13, 2015, 12:25:45 pm »
Huh?  :-//
Quoted right sentence from the wrong post  :palm:
 


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