Author Topic: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide  (Read 1024571 times)

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Offline saturation

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #25 on: June 08, 2010, 02:45:46 am »
Hi Ed,

The only test left suggested by the manual is insure its set to Factory default settings before executing a frequency check on both channels, in the manual it simply uses the calibration output; see page 1-6.

I presume its a good way to see if it will load setups from memory [ you can have 10 custom ones] properly after the mod. 



Most excellent work in confirming the freq. response of the 1052E and making comparisons.

To finalize the 1052E hack:

Has it passed its internal Function Check?

Has it passed its self calibration?


Although I've been following the mod thread with relish, I haven't' seen anyone test the scope's other capabilities beyond frequency response and rise time, as Mark0 discusses here.  Sounds like you have the gear and the baseline equipment to make a detailed analysis:



If I am able I would be happy to run some more tests and give a report back to the group.  Any suggestions for tests to attempt.  I am pretty satisfied with what I have seen so far.  I went through self calibration after the mod, no problems.  Which internal function tests are you refering to?  Frequency and voltage were matching the other scopes, and the function generator when doing the earlier testing.

ED
« Last Edit: June 08, 2010, 12:12:04 pm by saturation »
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 Saturation
 

Offline PeterG

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #26 on: June 08, 2010, 08:14:19 am »
OK, i am sold on the DS1052E Scope. However, does anyone know where to get one in Sydney (Parramatta area)?

Regards
Peter
Testing one two three...
 

Offline saturation

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #27 on: June 08, 2010, 02:56:54 pm »
Interesting Rigol history story:

http://www2.electronicproducts.com/Outsmarting_local_competition_wins_global_recognition-article-sbsrc01_jun2009.html.aspx

And a current ad reflecting their official new pricing.



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 Saturation
 

Offline Polossatik

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #28 on: June 08, 2010, 04:38:38 pm »
Interesting Rigol history story:
http://www2.electronicproducts.com/Outsmarting_local_competition_wins_global_recognition-article-sbsrc01_jun2009.html.aspx

Nice, also explains why the hardware is indeed the same, the less different parts needed the better they can negotiate on the price...

40.000 in 2007 - I wonder how many they make now (under rigol and other brands)
Real Circuit design time in minutes= (2 + Nscopes) Testim + (40 +120 Kbrewski) Nfriends

Testim = estimated time in minutes Nscopes= number of oscilloscopes present Kbrewski = linear approx of the nonlinear beer effect Nfriends = number of circuit design friends present
 

Offline saturation

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #29 on: June 08, 2010, 08:06:29 pm »
I'm not sure if the true original was not Rigol, but its has perked my interest to look out for scopes that look or work like the Rigol.  Only the 'take it apart' part can see if they are true clones.  Consider from the 1052E, we have Instek, LeCroy WaveAce series, the Uni-T 2025b, Tenma 72-8395 [ Uni-trend is a OEM for Tenma brand, I believe] Atten 1102CA [ see google for lawsuit] and Siglent [ Atten OEM andsounds like Agilent  ::)?].

See also: https://www.eevblog.com/forum/index.php?topic=632.0















Interesting Rigol history story:
http://www2.electronicproducts.com/Outsmarting_local_competition_wins_global_recognition-article-sbsrc01_jun2009.html.aspx

Nice, also explains why the hardware is indeed the same, the less different parts needed the better they can negotiate on the price...

40.000 in 2007 - I wonder how many they make now (under rigol and other brands)
« Last Edit: June 12, 2010, 12:57:43 am by saturation »
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 Saturation
 

Offline ednspace

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #30 on: June 12, 2010, 10:59:46 pm »
Hi Ed,

The only test left suggested by the manual is insure its set to Factory default settings before executing a frequency check on both channels, in the manual it simply uses the calibration output; see page 1-6.

I presume its a good way to see if it will load setups from memory [ you can have 10 custom ones] properly after the mod. 


Hello saturation,
Finally got a chance to check this.  Factory settings load, I am able to see the calibration signal 1kHz 3V on both channels.  Everything seems to work fine.  I was able to save and load my own presets in some of the 10 memory positions.  It was easy to go back and forth between these and the factory default settings.  It all seems stable!  I am happy!

Thanks again for all the help and great tutorial
_enjoy
ED
 

Offline saturation

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #31 on: June 13, 2010, 12:06:26 am »
You're welcome, I'm glad it came out right, makes me more likely to try the mod ;)

More interesting tidbits:

If you watch the LeCroy tutorials, its nearly identical to the Rigol functions, and more importantly, the GUI concept.  Notably absent is the HELP button and the WaveAce can store more custom profiles:

http://www.tequipment.net/LeCroyWaveAceVideos.html

For archiving on this thread: the Agilent Series 3000, now discontinued, the Rigol ODM devices that made is famous

http://www.home.agilent.com/agilent/product.jspx?nid=-33863.536905607.00&cc=US&lc=eng

Interestingly Rigol considers Agilent's selection to re-badge one of their model lines in 2005 as a milestone in their history.

http://www.rigol.com/templates/T_About_en/index.aspx?nodeid=653

Hi Ed,

The only test left suggested by the manual is insure its set to Factory default settings before executing a frequency check on both channels, in the manual it simply uses the calibration output; see page 1-6.

I presume its a good way to see if it will load setups from memory [ you can have 10 custom ones] properly after the mod.


Hello saturation,
Finally got a chance to check this.  Factory settings load, I am able to see the calibration signal 1kHz 3V on both channels.  Everything seems to work fine.  I was able to save and load my own presets in some of the 10 memory positions.  It was easy to go back and forth between these and the factory default settings.  It all seems stable!  I am happy!

Thanks again for all the help and great tutorial
_enjoy
ED
« Last Edit: June 13, 2010, 10:34:34 am by saturation »
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 Saturation
 

Offline Polossatik

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #32 on: June 13, 2010, 09:53:51 pm »
nice to see the thread is useful , the zip file is about 200 times downloaded, so there are a lot of DS1052E who became a DS1102E  ;D
Real Circuit design time in minutes= (2 + Nscopes) Testim + (40 +120 Kbrewski) Nfriends

Testim = estimated time in minutes Nscopes= number of oscilloscopes present Kbrewski = linear approx of the nonlinear beer effect Nfriends = number of circuit design friends present
 

Offline RickTrelles

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// Thank you! plus a couple of questions //
« Reply #33 on: June 15, 2010, 11:22:05 am »
Thank you for all that help, polossatik.

I'm new to scopes and just bought a Rigol DS1052.

I have a couple of initial questions if you don't mind.

My unit reports it has "software version 00.02.04".
How you know yours is 00.02.04.01?

Why do you want to stay with firmware 00.02.02, shouldn't 02.04
have improvements and isn't it supposed to keep the 100MHz hack?

Have you actually returned your unit to 00.02.04 (or 00.02.04.01)?

Thank you again,

Rick
 

Offline idris

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #34 on: June 15, 2010, 12:14:15 pm »
I haven't seen anyone who has the release notes about what improvements, if any, there are with 2.04.

The "*IDN?" command gives the full version number, which can be different from the version reported through the menus.

Also, I believe the 2.04 firmware floating around the net is actually different from the 2.04(.01) that's currently being loaded at the factory, so then technically you won't be returning the scope to the previous firmware. But noone seems to know what the functional differences are anyway. Personally I didn't do the upgrade to 2.04 because I don't know what I'd get out of it, in exchange for taking on the inherent risks of flashing the firmware.
 

Offline Polossatik

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Re: // Thank you! plus a couple of questions //
« Reply #35 on: June 15, 2010, 03:18:42 pm »
Thank you for all that help, polossatik.

you're welcome

I'm new to scopes and just bought a Rigol DS1052.

I have a couple of initial questions if you don't mind.

congrats and not at all


My unit reports it has "software version 00.02.04".
How you know yours is 00.02.04.01?

see above post :)

Why do you want to stay with firmware 00.02.02, shouldn't 02.04
have improvements and isn't it supposed to keep the 100MHz hack?

Have you actually returned your unit to 00.02.04 (or 00.02.04.01)?

I have a strong "if it ain't broken , don't fix it" approach to life..
Seen the 02.02 works and tit's not clear what the other fixes ,  I stay on 02.02 until someone (or I) finds a bug in 02.02 that bugs me or there is a clear list of things that are fixed in 02.04 and the "real one" is somewhere available.
Real Circuit design time in minutes= (2 + Nscopes) Testim + (40 +120 Kbrewski) Nfriends

Testim = estimated time in minutes Nscopes= number of oscilloscopes present Kbrewski = linear approx of the nonlinear beer effect Nfriends = number of circuit design friends present
 

Offline xoom

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #36 on: June 15, 2010, 06:50:31 pm »
Hi,
just got mine scope this evening.. :)
after half hour of checking if everything is all right.. tryed this hack :)
and gues what?  ;)

im joining you all of 100MHz scope  ;D
(very happy)

ordered from DX at 5/19/2010
and have problem to sending to my country (Lithuania) then i have to change address to other. Thanks fly to Aramandas (A?i? tau) then he send to me from UK and today (6/15/2010) i finally have it after month of stress ;D

And Thanks to polossatik for guide :)
And of course Dave for inspiration :)

Best regards,
xoom
 

Offline saturation

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #37 on: June 15, 2010, 07:21:09 pm »
Congratulations xoom, was firmware version did you make the conversion from?



Hi,
just got mine scope this evening.. :)
after half hour of checking if everything is all right.. tryed this hack :)
and gues what?  ;)

im joining you all of 100MHz scope  ;D
(very happy)

ordered from DX at 5/19/2010
and have problem to sending to my country (Lithuania) then i have to change address to other. Thanks fly to Aramandas (A?i? tau) then he send to me from UK and today (6/15/2010) i finally have it after month of stress ;D

And Thanks to polossatik for guide :)
And of course Dave for inspiration :)

Best regards,
xoom
Best Wishes,

 Saturation
 

Offline xoom

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #38 on: June 15, 2010, 07:44:44 pm »
it was 02.04 but i didn't try, just downgraded to 02.02 :)
 

Offline tanjent

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Worked on Windows 7, 64 bit.
« Reply #39 on: June 21, 2010, 08:54:14 pm »
Just reporting in that the USB-based hack has worked from Win7-x64 with my brand-new scope, purchased on June 12th throgh Amazon.com from "Riko Instruments". Scope calibration date is April 24th, 2010.

Firmware was 2.04, downgraded to 2.02 SP2, installed visa441runtime.exe and "Ultrascope_for_DS1000E_Series.exe" (downloaded from the link in this thread), followed the steps exactly and everything worked just fine.
 

Offline MtnMike

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #40 on: July 02, 2010, 03:33:38 am »
I bought 2 of the DS1052E's.  Figure the price was right, and if I need a 4 channel scope, I can just trigger the second one off the first, and if one breaks, I still have one.  

Anyway, I just did the USB mod.  Followed the guide step by step, and it worked.  Great.

So, of course I had to see what it does.  So I hooked up a Tek TDS2022B 200Mhz 2GS/s, Rigol DS1052E with 100Mhz mod, and a regular DS1052E at 50Mhz.  I hooked them all up at the same time to a HP 8116A Function Generator with a 15.46MHz(based on the Tek TDS measurement) Square Wave(unterminated).  The results are in the pictures.  Of course the 200Mhz looks the best, and the 100MHz looks pretty good, and the 50MHz doesn't capture the waveform like the other 2.  

As for calibration issues every one is worried about, the modded unit measurements of rise time and Vpp are very close, while the unmodded 50Mhz unit has the worst measurements, compared to the Tek TDS2022B.  I'm sure this is because of the lack of bandwidth, as the measurement can't be as accurate as the other 2.  

So there you have it.  I'm happy.  Thanks again to the original poster with the dummy guide!
« Last Edit: July 02, 2010, 04:35:55 am by MtnMike »
 

Offline saturation

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #41 on: July 02, 2010, 04:33:37 pm »
Thanks, MM.  Every successful hack is further proof it can be done right and it results in higher bandwidth.  But the hack alone isn't as helpful as showing the specs are truly improved, and that the basic functionality has not been lost, as shown by a number of folks on this thread.

I bought 2 of the DS1052E's.  Figure the price was right, and if I need a 4 channel scope, I can just trigger the second one off the first, and if one breaks, I still have one.  
...
So there you have it.  I'm happy.  Thanks again to the original poster with the dummy guide!
« Last Edit: July 05, 2010, 06:07:54 pm by saturation »
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Offline wd5gnr

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #42 on: July 04, 2010, 02:33:32 pm »
If you watch the LeCroy tutorials, its nearly identical to the Rigol functions, and more importantly, the GUI concept.  Notably absent is the HELP button and the WaveAce can store more custom profiles:


Just for the record the DS1x52E has help also. You just have to hold down the button you want help on for a few seconds. However, if you updated to 2.04 firmware off the Internet, it has no help text (probably no localized strings). So when you do this it will pause a bit (trying to load the help) the first time and after that, nothing until you reboot. I understand those who got "factory" 2.04 have help and the 2.02 firmware you can get on the Internet also has it. I have not seen a 2.04 with help "in the wild."

 

Offline saturation

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #43 on: July 04, 2010, 03:08:49 pm »
THANKS wd5gnr, I really wasn't aware of it, its not in the manual!  But it is on websites.

Anyone who has done the mod, is the HELP contents still there?



If you watch the LeCroy tutorials, its nearly identical to the Rigol functions, and more importantly, the GUI concept.  Notably absent is the HELP button and the WaveAce can store more custom profiles:


Just for the record the DS1x52E has help also. You just have to hold down the button you want help on for a few seconds. However, if you updated to 2.04 firmware off the Internet, it has no help text (probably no localized strings). So when you do this it will pause a bit (trying to load the help) the first time and after that, nothing until you reboot. I understand those who got "factory" 2.04 have help and the 2.02 firmware you can get on the Internet also has it. I have not seen a 2.04 with help "in the wild."


Best Wishes,

 Saturation
 

Offline MtnMike

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #44 on: July 05, 2010, 05:14:40 pm »
THANKS wd5gnr, I really wasn't aware of it, its not in the manual!  But it is on websites.

Anyone who has done the mod, is the HELP contents still there?



If you watch the LeCroy tutorials, its nearly identical to the Rigol functions, and more importantly, the GUI concept.  Notably absent is the HELP button and the WaveAce can store more custom profiles:


Just for the record the DS1x52E has help also. You just have to hold down the button you want help on for a few seconds. However, if you updated to 2.04 firmware off the Internet, it has no help text (probably no localized strings). So when you do this it will pause a bit (trying to load the help) the first time and after that, nothing until you reboot. I understand those who got "factory" 2.04 have help and the 2.02 firmware you can get on the Internet also has it. I have not seen a 2.04 with help "in the wild."



Yes, the help menu is still there after the mod, in version 2.02.
 

Offline wd5gnr

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #45 on: July 05, 2010, 06:35:54 pm »
Yeah the mod doesn't make the help go away. It is the "internet" version of the 2.04 firmware.
 

Offline saturation

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #46 on: July 05, 2010, 06:46:31 pm »
Its not a critical loss, but it would have been good to know it was there when I was learning how to use it  >:(.  So I read the manual, but that didn't help  :'(.  Thanks for the tip, it can still aid as a reminder  :D.

Yeah the mod doesn't make the help go away. It is the "internet" version of the 2.04 firmware.
Best Wishes,

 Saturation
 

Offline beerhunter

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #47 on: July 05, 2010, 08:13:46 pm »
Yeah the mod doesn't make the help go away. It is the "internet" version of the 2.04 firmware.


Yep, it seems you are right. I just loaded a 00.02.04 version of the FW that I got directly from Rigol NA. The scope saw it as an upgrade and I loaded it in and the help files are now working again. If anybodys interested I'll attach the file here or you can get it directly from Rigol in Ohio.
 

Offline wd5gnr

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #48 on: July 05, 2010, 08:55:41 pm »
I'd be interested... is there a link or did you have to ask for it? Is there any indication of what is "new" in the 2.04 other than the mod lock out?
 

Offline beerhunter

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Re: changing the rigol DS1052E to DS1102E using USB , the dummy guide
« Reply #49 on: July 06, 2010, 12:37:52 am »
I'd be interested... is there a link or did you have to ask for it? Is there any indication of what is "new" in the 2.04 other than the mod lock out?

I sent an email to one of the Apps Engineers, Houssam, and he sent it to me. I'll attach it to a post tonite or tommorow for you. No indication of whats new or different other than the upgrade cripple.
 


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