Author Topic: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters  (Read 22629 times)

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Online bd139

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #75 on: March 28, 2018, 12:36:30 pm »
Avometers are fucking dangerous. I'm surprised to see people defending them here. The cut outs are notoriously sticky after a couple of overload events which causes total incendiary destruction the next time, they give false indications if you drop them even once and they're bloody unreliable to start with, especially the 8 mk 5 / 6. Why the hell you'd want to rely on one I don't know. They're fun I suppose but that's about it.

Company I worked for eviscerated them by force from the fanboys because people actually had got hurt using them. I wish I had a copy of the PDF they sent around. "anyone with an Avo on their bench will be stuck on assembly for a week". They were giving out HP 34401A's from equipment storage and people were still using Avos...?!?

There is no place for them in a professional setting now. What you do in your own time is your business but if you burn someone's facility down because your Avo was misreading or damaged or you fucked up then... ugh I don't know but just don't go there.

As for stupid, you can't fix stupid. Test procedures are as important as kit but the objective is to minimise all aspects of risk in any environment so start with the easy wins:

1. Training.
2. Stop people from walking around with loaded guns.

Incidentally I actually do use an analogue meter, but I built it myself, the top range is 150V, it does DC only, FET input and only gets used on anything after a transformer secondary at most. I built this because it's difficult peaking RF PAs with a DMM due to the noise. Everything else, I have a nice Keysight handheld :)
« Last Edit: March 28, 2018, 12:42:23 pm by bd139 »
 
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Offline oldway

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #76 on: March 28, 2018, 02:35:53 pm »
Quote
Avometers are fucking dangerous.
Not only Avometers, but all analog multimeters are fucking dangerous and SHOULD NEVER BE USED ON HIGH ENERGY CIRCUITS.....

They are even not cat rated..... :scared:
 
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Online bd139

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #77 on: March 28, 2018, 02:40:10 pm »
One reason they aren't around any more is there is no way you could get a CAT approval or rating for the things.

Definitely agree. Some of the generic ones and even semi-professional "service" ones are bloody awful even from a physical design:



Look at the banana sockets. Yeah I'm going to stick my fingers near those unshrouded terminals. Good show. Bzzt. Thud, shovel shovel.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2018, 02:42:13 pm by bd139 »
 

Offline Bud

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #78 on: March 28, 2018, 02:45:06 pm »
High energy circuits is just one isolated use case. There are gazilions use cases anc people still love using analog multimeters.

And no need to post in such agressive tone by the way.
Facebook-free life and Rigol-free shack.
 

Offline tzok

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #79 on: March 28, 2018, 02:56:32 pm »
One likes to dive with sharks, another one likes base jumping, and another one likes to use analog multimeters. Why do you want to forbid them doing so? I'm driving a 12 year old car without all these modern safety systems like ESP, ASR, TPMS, BLIS etc. - do you also think it should be forbidden?
 

Online bd139

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #80 on: March 28, 2018, 02:57:42 pm »
I'm not sure if you read the last line where I said I use an analogue multimeter I built myself :) ... even look how shonky it is:



In a professional setting, it's not about choice or opinion though, it's about responsibility and safety. Not just you but of all the people relying on you not using a piece of crap for your testing and leaving them with something dangerous on their hands.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2018, 03:03:19 pm by bd139 »
 

Offline oldway

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #81 on: March 28, 2018, 03:04:20 pm »
I'm not sure if you read the last line where I said I use an analogue multimeter I built myself :)

In a professional setting, it's not about choice or opinion, it's about responsibility and safety.
What is your goal? To help those who deny all the work Dave and Joeqsmith have been doing for years to improve multimeter safety?...None of these analog multimeters could be approved to be used safely.
I'am not against analog multimeters but they have no place in high voltage and high energy circuits....more or less the same as a DT830 crap dmm.
 

Online bd139

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #82 on: March 28, 2018, 03:08:30 pm »
I'm not sure if you read the last line where I said I use an analogue multimeter I built myself :)

In a professional setting, it's not about choice or opinion, it's about responsibility and safety.
What is your goal? To help those who deny all the work Dave and Joeqsmith have been doing for years to improve multimeter safety?...None of these analog multimeters could be approved to be used safely.
I'am not against analog multimeters but they have no place in high voltage and high energy circuits....more or less the same as a DT830 crap dmm.

I am agreeing with you, Dave and Joeqsmith.

I'm merely stating that this isn't some personal hate campaign or echo chamber against analogue multimeters, otherwise why the hell would I have built one?

Safety first always. CAT rating first, not some Chinese one either.

I usually drive a Keysight U1241 and GW Instek GDM-8341 for ref because I value safety first.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2018, 03:10:08 pm by bd139 »
 

Offline oldway

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #83 on: March 28, 2018, 03:14:27 pm »
One likes to dive with sharks, another one likes base jumping, and another one likes to use analog multimeters. Why do you want to forbid them doing so? I'm driving a 12 year old car without all these modern safety systems like ESP, ASR, TPMS, BLIS etc. - do you also think it should be forbidden?
To forbid something, you have to have the corresponding authority, the means to control and to sanction ..... Nobody has such power on a forum .... So what I write on a forum does not forbid anything.
 
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Offline oldway

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #84 on: March 28, 2018, 03:19:17 pm »
I'm not sure if you read the last line where I said I use an analogue multimeter I built myself :)

In a professional setting, it's not about choice or opinion, it's about responsibility and safety.
What is your goal? To help those who deny all the work Dave and Joeqsmith have been doing for years to improve multimeter safety?...None of these analog multimeters could be approved to be used safely.
I'am not against analog multimeters but they have no place in high voltage and high energy circuits....more or less the same as a DT830 crap dmm.

I am agreeing with you, Dave and Joeqsmith.

I'm merely stating that this isn't some personal hate campaign or echo chamber against analogue multimeters, otherwise why the hell would I have built one?

Safety first always. CAT rating first, not some Chinese one either.

I usually drive a Keysight U1241 and GW Instek GDM-8341 for ref because I value safety first.
I apologize, I quote the wrong post.....I was answering to tzok.....sorry....
 
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Online bd139

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #85 on: March 28, 2018, 03:19:41 pm »
Gotcha - makes sense  :-+
 

Offline tzok

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #86 on: March 28, 2018, 03:39:50 pm »
Personally I don't care about the CAT ratings, but I have no contact with high energy circuits. Also, I see no point why an analog multimeter couldn't meet CAT rating standards. I mean if it was a modern project. Actually there are modern analog multimeters which have the CAT rating, e.g. Voltcraft VC-5080 or VC-2020 (both are CAT III 500V) or KYORITSU 1110 (CAT II 600V). From the logical point of view you are against using old multimeters, not meeting CAT standards, in high energy circuits. It has nothing to do whether they are analog or digital.
 

Online bd139

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #87 on: March 28, 2018, 03:45:18 pm »
VC-5080 is bollocks. It's the same as the early MT-2017 meters which I've seen inside and there's no way that could get a CAT rating. Doesn't even have HRC fuses or any provision for any protection at all!?!?
« Last Edit: March 28, 2018, 03:47:03 pm by bd139 »
 

Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #88 on: March 28, 2018, 03:49:17 pm »
One likes to dive with sharks, another one likes base jumping, and another one likes to use analog multimeters. Why do you want to forbid them doing so? I'm driving a 12 year old car without all these modern safety systems like ESP, ASR, TPMS, BLIS etc. - do you also think it should be forbidden?
Where do you get a 12 year old car without all of those? They have been commonplace longer.
 

Offline tzok

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #89 on: March 28, 2018, 05:13:10 pm »
Where do you get a 12 year old car without all of those? They have been commonplace longer.
They were available as an optional (and expensive) equipment, but not obligatory.
 
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Offline oldway

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #90 on: March 28, 2018, 05:44:45 pm »
Lada driver ?  :palm:
 

Offline tzok

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #91 on: March 28, 2018, 05:57:09 pm »
 

Offline G7PSK

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #92 on: March 28, 2018, 09:44:06 pm »
« Last Edit: March 29, 2018, 08:38:39 am by G7PSK »
 

Offline finom1

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #93 on: March 28, 2018, 11:25:29 pm »
Help!!!

Where can I buy a 121GW EEV Blog Multimeter??

Thank you!
 

Offline Chris-IP5

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #94 on: March 28, 2018, 11:42:55 pm »
121GW is for sale on EEVBlog store. Follow link to main site at bottom of this page.

(No I am not affiliated, etc...)
 

Offline finom1

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #95 on: March 28, 2018, 11:57:14 pm »
 

Online Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #96 on: March 29, 2018, 12:04:12 am »
121GW is for sale on EEVBlog store. Follow link to main site at bottom of this page.

EXCEPT that it will be "Out of Stock" for a while yet!

Dave still has around 2,000 units to deliver to his Kickstarter backers before he can even think about stocking his store.
 
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Offline Chris-IP5

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #97 on: March 29, 2018, 01:32:09 am »
Oops! Sorry I wasn't aware of that. Thanks for pointing it out.
 

Online vk6zgo

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #98 on: March 29, 2018, 07:32:46 am »
High energy circuits is just one isolated use case. There are gazilions use cases anc people still love using analog multimeters.

And no need to post in such agressive tone by the way.

I think it's his normal mode of posting----he is right & everybody else is an idiot!
 

Online bd139

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Re: EEVblog #1067 - Analog vs Digital Multimeters
« Reply #99 on: March 29, 2018, 07:34:59 am »
Nope some of us just don't run like this

 


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