Author Topic: 4K Video Editing PC Build  (Read 19196 times)

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Offline Monkeh

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Re: EEVblog #1098 - 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #75 on: June 25, 2018, 01:03:33 am »
Then why in the world would you use the X299 platform, if you don't need or want the I/O? Why would you choose a 4-channel RAM system, and then put a processor in it that doesn't even have enough cores to utilize all of that RAM bandwidth?

Because it was available in stock, and was one of the cheapest LGA2066 motherboards they had.

He asked why you went with the platform, not the board.
 

Offline AmericanLocomotive

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Re: EEVblog #1098 - 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #76 on: June 25, 2018, 01:10:08 am »
Because it was available in stock, and was one of the cheapest LGA2066 motherboards they had.
You're dancing around the question. I didn't ask why you bought that specific motherboard, I asked why you chose the X299 platform. Why chose an expensive platform who's primary benefits are Massive I/O, High-Core-Count Processors and 4-Channel RAM if you're not going to utilize a single one of those features?

The far less expensive Intel Z370 or AMD X370 platforms have processors that allow you to achieve essentially the exact same performance at a much lower cost.
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I didn't have the time nor inclination to research teardowns of a dozen different PSU's.
You don't have to. TomHardware and JonnyGuru have already done all the legwork. TomsHardware even has a handy ranking guide for their PSUs. You should have made the time, because the PSU is one of the most important parts of a PC. I've seen many computers killed by cheap power supplies that grenaded.
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You seem deeply offended by this entire thing, too bad for you.
Ah, ad hominem attacks. Why bother addressing my points in this argument, when you can just attack me personally instead?
« Last Edit: June 25, 2018, 01:19:01 am by AmericanLocomotive »
 

Online Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #1098 - 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #77 on: June 25, 2018, 01:19:10 am »

Because it was available in stock, and was one of the cheapest LGA2066 motherboards they had.

I didn't have the time nor inclination to research teardowns of a dozen different PSU's.

This should answer a number of the critics - but I fear there will be some who are far too high and mighty to concede some fundamental practicalities.

Some people have limited time that they wish to throw at a project and 'optimal' solutions can take far more time than they can justify.  What's available "here and now" has value that offsets the "optimal".  The MOBO allows for future upgrades, if necessary.  That's something I would do.


Dave has a practical solution that does what he needs.  While he did get some relevant detail, he didn't spend weeks chasing down every last little nuance and tweak.  And even if he did - by how much more would the performance improve?  Considering some opinions strongly expressed are based on erroneous understanding, I don't imagine there would be much, if anything, in it.

I may be speaking out of turn, but I would think Dave has better things to do with his time.
 

Online Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #1098 - 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #78 on: June 25, 2018, 01:20:55 am »
And even if he did - by how much more would the performance improve?

To my mind, this is the key question.
 

Offline Monkeh

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Re: EEVblog #1098 - 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #79 on: June 25, 2018, 01:23:24 am »
And even if he did - by how much more would the performance improve?

To my mind, this is the key question.

Probably not by much.

How much would the price improve? How much would the reliability improve?

Is a half hour of research worth saving a couple hundred dollars? Is it worth saving several hours of lost productivity because the power supply decided to crap itself early?

But none of these questions matter and there is nothing to be learned, apparently.
 

Offline AmericanLocomotive

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Re: EEVblog #1098 - 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #80 on: June 25, 2018, 01:35:43 am »
Probably not by much.

How much would the price improve? How much would the reliability improve?

Is a half hour of research worth saving a couple hundred dollars? Is it worth saving several hours of lost productivity because the power supply decided to crap itself early?

But none of these questions matter and there is nothing to be learned, apparently.
Exactly. Dave and Brumby are acting like it takes some kind of monumental effort to do basic research for building a PC. It took me less than a minute to find a power supply within $30 of the one Dave bought, that's 80 Plus platinum with good capacitors and independent regulation.

A 5 minute search shows that the Ryzen 2700 and Intel I7-8700 (and motherboards to match) are in stock at many different Australian retailers - including UMart, CPL, MegaBuy, Aus PC Market, mWave, PC Case Gear, and even Amazon Australia.

« Last Edit: June 25, 2018, 01:38:50 am by AmericanLocomotive »
 

Offline mariush

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Re: 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #81 on: June 25, 2018, 01:56:43 am »
I didn't comment much on the power supply because honestly, I don't think it's so big of an issue.

Yes, it's a "budget" psu, with not so great components, but at the same time it's not going to be heavily used, so it's gonna last a long time anyway.

For example, while he's editing the videos in Vegas, basically just the cpu will be used a bit, so the power consumption will probably idle at around 50-80 watts. When he's rendering for a few hours, maybe the system's gonna use 2-300 watts.

So basically the power supply will barely warm up at those 50-100w of power consumption (10-20% out of those 650w) during most of the time it runs, and then it will "sweat" a little for a few hours every 2-3 days or so, when a video is actually rendered.

Could you do better? Yeah. It would only take maybe 10-20$ more, to go with a Gold efficiency psu from a good brand ( Seasonic, EVGA, Corsair etc) but if the use of the computer is like I say above, it really won't make much of a difference.

I agree with what others say about the platform though.  x299 is not a great choice. It's practically already outdated, whatever Intel's gonna release is probably going to require new chipsets, so not much upgrade choices other than what's now... you'll find cpus on eBay.

Then all the exploits for Intel and the ton of Windows updates to fix various exploits in Intel cpus, and patching some of those exploits requires microcode updates, which must be performed by updating the bios - and if that motherboard is on the cheaper end of x299 boards the board maker may be slow at releasing bios updates...

Ryzen processors and the Zen cores don't suffer from so many exploits as the Intel cpus and whatever was found to be vulnerable was fixed through simpler Windows updates, without much stress. With AM4 socket from AMD you'd also have future upgrade choices

Right now I also have to agree with everyone, this x299 board with that cpu is like pairing a Threadripper motherboard with a 8 core 1900x, a shame... the 1900x is available as a choice in case user needs lots of memory (8 slots) or lots of pci-e slots (since cpu has 64 lanes if i remember correctly)
 

Online EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #1098 - 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #82 on: June 25, 2018, 02:20:41 am »
Because it was available in stock, and was one of the cheapest LGA2066 motherboards they had.
You're dancing around the question. I didn't ask why you bought that specific motherboard, I asked why you chose the X299 platform. Why chose an expensive platform who's primary benefits are Massive I/O, High-Core-Count Processors and 4-Channel RAM if you're not going to utilize a single one of those features?

Because when I searched the local suppliers website for LGA2066 motherboards, the X299 was literally the only option.
Are you done now?

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The far less expensive Intel Z370 or AMD X370 platforms have processors that allow you to achieve essentially the exact same performance at a much lower cost.

Again, you seem personally offended by all this. Must be really hard being on the Internet?
« Last Edit: June 25, 2018, 02:22:50 am by EEVblog »
 
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Online EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #1098 - 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #83 on: June 25, 2018, 02:26:36 am »
Ah, ad hominem attacks. Why bother addressing my points in this argument, when you can just attack me personally instead?

Not an attack, an observation. You do seem genuinely deeply offended that about choices I made.

Do you want me to say you are right? Ok, you are right. You win the internet, congratulations.
 

Offline Monkeh

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Re: EEVblog #1098 - 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #84 on: June 25, 2018, 02:27:22 am »
Because it was available in stock, and was one of the cheapest LGA2066 motherboards they had.
You're dancing around the question. I didn't ask why you bought that specific motherboard, I asked why you chose the X299 platform. Why chose an expensive platform who's primary benefits are Massive I/O, High-Core-Count Processors and 4-Channel RAM if you're not going to utilize a single one of those features?

Because when I searched the local suppliers website for LGA2066 motherboards, the X299 was literally the only option.
Are you done now?

You're still failing to understand the question.

Why did you pick the silly 7820X over say, an 8700K, which has two fewer cores (boohoo, you've already said you're dealing with single threaded loads), a higher clock, more L3, lower power consumption, a lower price, and goes on a lower cost motherboard?

Hell, you could've gone with an 8086K if you can find one and gone even faster.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2018, 02:29:03 am by Monkeh »
 

Offline AmericanLocomotive

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Re: EEVblog #1098 - 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #85 on: June 25, 2018, 02:36:32 am »
Because when I searched the local suppliers website for LGA2066 motherboards, the X299 was literally the only option.
Are you done now?
The LGA2066 socket is part of the X299 platform by definition. Why would you chose the LGA2066/X299/Intel HPC platform if you're not going to use any of the features of benefits it provides?

Once again, you constantly criticize other companies and people's projects in your videos for not doing basic research, for wasting money on unnecessary features, etc... And here you go, doing exactly the thing you criticize. You did zero research,  used expensive components you're not even going to use the features of, that do not provide any performance benefit over much cheaper components and then cheaped on important things you shouldn't have.

You constantly criticize the power supplies of products you look at it, and yet you didn't even do 1 minute of research to chose a decent PSU for your own system. Literally 1 minute and an extra $30 would have made you go from an 85% efficient PSU with no-name caps, to a 92% efficient premium PSU with Japanese capacitors. 
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Again, you seem personally offended by all this. Must be really hard being on the Internet?
More ad hominem personal attacks against me, Dave? For someone who criticizes so many others on the internet and strives to be professional, I really expected you to be able to take more criticism yourself without resulting to personal attacks.

What gets me is that you strive to be professional, you always emphasize doing research and speccing out good components for a given budget projects, and openly criticize other people's and companies products. Yet, you then do this PC build with no research, no forethought, and get all bent out of shape when people rightfully criticize it. Instead of actually addressing mine (and other people's) points, you just reply with snide remarks or just straight up ignore them. It's really unprofessional and off-putting.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2018, 02:41:48 am by AmericanLocomotive »
 

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Re: 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #86 on: June 25, 2018, 02:38:34 am »
Right now I also have to agree with everyone, this x299 board with that cpu is like pairing a Threadripper motherboard with a 8 core 1900x, a shame... the 1900x is available as a choice in case user needs lots of memory (8 slots) or lots of pci-e slots (since cpu has 64 lanes if i remember correctly)

Again, here goes the merry-go-round.
On one had people are "sad" that my powerful X299 chipset is being "crippled" by this "low end" CPU.
Yet they also say the X299 is outdated.
 ::)

Look, this is really bloody easy - I decided to go with the i7 7820X (rightly or wrongly), that uses an LGA2066 socket, ergo I had to chose an LGA2066 motherboard, and the only option available was the X299 chipset. I needed a cheap and available PSU to go with that so I chose a reasonable priced option that was in stock and had a known low noise fan. I have used "cheap" PSU's before and never had a problem. In 5 years time you either get to say "I don't you so", or I get the say it, until then get so emotional about it?

People seem so deeply deeply offended that I didn't consider every single thing, and that I didn't go with a less powerful system that was slightly better "bang-per-buck". Seriously  ::)
 

Online EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #1098 - 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #87 on: June 25, 2018, 02:40:05 am »
More ad hominem personal attacks against me, Dave? For someone who criticizes so many others on the internet and strives to be professional, I really expected you to be able to take more criticism yourself without resulting to personal attacks.

They are not personal attacks, it's an observation.
Saying someone "seems deeply offended" is so far from a personal attack it's not funny. If you don't understand why it's not then I don't know what more to say.
I could have ignored you entirely, yet here I am answering your questions, yeah, so unprofessional...
But I won't engage with you again on this, I'm done.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2018, 02:42:07 am by EEVblog »
 

Offline Monkeh

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Re: 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #88 on: June 25, 2018, 02:40:15 am »
Or perhaps some of us are just trying to understand your thought process and perhaps in the process everyone can learn something.

So far you seem to be the only one upset.
 

Online EEVblog

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Re: 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #89 on: June 25, 2018, 02:43:42 am »
Or perhaps some of us are just trying to understand your thought process and perhaps in the process everyone can learn something.

I just explained it.
This was not some deeply researched system design exercise, please try and understand that. I had PC problems and needed a new PC literally that day. I ordered the stuff, went and picked it up, and had my system up and running that afternoon.
 

Offline AmericanLocomotive

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Re: 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #90 on: June 25, 2018, 02:46:43 am »
People seem so deeply deeply offended that I didn't consider every single thing, and that I didn't go with a less powerful system that was slightly better "bang-per-buck".
Here you go again, with snide and rude remarks. No one is offended by anything Dave. We questioned why you went with the hardware you did, when it made no apparent sense. Instead of answering the questions and responding to the criticism, you either avoided the questions entirely, replied with non-answers, or just replied with snide and rude remarks.
This was not some deeply researched system design exercise, please try and understand that. I had PC problems and needed a new PC literally that day. I ordered the stuff, went and picked it up, and had my system up and running that afternoon.
Alright, You didn't do any research at all and just went out and bought whatever. Gotcha. Fair enough. You should still be more open to criticism though.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2018, 02:49:12 am by AmericanLocomotive »
 

Offline Monkeh

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Re: 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #91 on: June 25, 2018, 02:47:50 am »
Or perhaps some of us are just trying to understand your thought process and perhaps in the process everyone can learn something.

I just explained it.
This was not some deeply researched system design exercise, please try and understand that. I had PC problems and needed a new PC literally that day. I ordered the stuff, went and picked it up, and had my system up and running that afternoon.

So you just pulled the most expensive i7 you could see out of a hat and went with it.

Fine. Okay. 10 minutes research would've saved you some money - and four pages of this.
 

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Re: 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #92 on: June 25, 2018, 03:01:14 am »
So far you seem to be the only one upset.

Not at all.
But let me explain something to you about what happens with videos like this. I get countless emails, comments, messages and whatnot all telling me *something different*. I could literally spend the rest of this week as a full time job responding to people's questions about this and explaining every little thing.
There is no best decision on something like this, as much as many people think there is, it's an unwinnable game.

So I spent a bit more money than I could have, the world isn't going to end.
 

Offline Monkeh

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Re: 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #93 on: June 25, 2018, 03:08:40 am »
So far you seem to be the only one upset.

Not at all.
But let me explain something to you about what happens with videos like this. I get countless emails, comments, messages and whatnot all telling me *something different*. I could literally spend the rest of this week as a full time job responding to people's questions about this and explaining every little thing.

I'm well aware. I can see a large portion of them you know. But you only seem to reply to comments which push your buttons.
 

Offline AmericanLocomotive

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Re: 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #94 on: June 25, 2018, 03:23:04 am »
Not at all.
But let me explain something to you about what happens with videos like this. I get countless emails, comments, messages and whatnot all telling me *something different*. I could literally spend the rest of this week as a full time job responding to people's questions about this and explaining every little thing.
There is no best decision on something like this, as much as many people think there is, it's an unwinnable game.

So I spent a bit more money than I could have, the world isn't going to end.
Yeah, that's fine and I get that. I get that there's no "right" build, and I don't particularly care as long as you have some justification for what you purchased and why you purchased it. I was getting frustrated with your non-answers of my questions (apparently unintentional, do to a misunderstand of the term "x299 platform" - fair enough). Like I said, there were many different ways you could have skinned this cat, but the way you chose was very bizarre to me, and I could not understand why. As an educational content creator, I feel that you more than anyone should explain the reasons behind your decisions and choices as it relates to electronics.

But if the answer is, there is no real reason behind the choices - it was just a bunch of parts thrown in a cart quickly and checked out - that's fair and adequate enough explanation.
Quote
They are not personal attacks, it's an observation.
The snide & rude remarks you made like: "Must be hard being on the internet?" and "too bad for you." are attacks on my character Dave. They're completely irrelevant & unnecessary to the topic at hand, and were meant as an attempt to get under my skin, aggravate me and start a flame war. But I don't bite for stuff like that anymore. Argue the points the person makes - not the person himself.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2018, 03:35:41 am by AmericanLocomotive »
 

Online EEVblog

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Re: 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #95 on: June 25, 2018, 03:39:52 am »
So you just pulled the most expensive i7 you could see out of a hat and went with it.

Not quite.
It was faster than the 8700K, not nearly as expensive as the i9's and others, it was on special at my local store, and by all accounts I could find is a pretty decent CPU and had good benchmark results.

 

Online EEVblog

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Re: 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #96 on: June 25, 2018, 03:41:49 am »
I'm well aware. I can see a large portion of them you know. But you only seem to reply to comments which push your buttons.

It only seems that way, but that's not true.
I'll let you in on another Youtuber secret and why a Youtuber might respond to question or comment in what might seem like a harsh way;
When you ask a question, you are often not aware that a dozen or a hundred other people might have asked the same question, or made the same comment. So it's often not the first time the Youtuber has seen that question or comment, it could be the 10th time, or even the 100th time. That can be kinda frustrating sometimes.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2018, 03:48:35 am by EEVblog »
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #97 on: June 25, 2018, 04:21:57 am »
8 core 8 thread processor

https://www.itwire.com/security/83347-openbsd-chief-de-raadt-says-no-easy-fix-for-new-intel-cpu-bug.html


TLBleed means every OS will have to disable HT on pretty much every Intel CPU, because Intel decided 0.5% more IPC was more important than security, at a time they had pretty much 40% IPC lead over AMD, bravo!
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Online Brumby

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Re: 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #98 on: June 25, 2018, 04:27:26 am »
As I said earlier, time is a factor in these decisions for some people - and it turns out it was more of a factor than I had anticipated.

How about we just say that Dave may not have made the best choice, but he didn't make a bad choice (especially considering the circumstances) ... and move on.

Please.
 

Offline Fungus

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Re: EEVblog #1098 - 4K Video Editing PC Build
« Reply #99 on: June 25, 2018, 04:33:19 am »
Exactly. Dave and Brumby are acting like it takes some kind of monumental effort to do basic research for building a PC. It took me less than a minute to find a power supply within $30 of the one Dave bought, that's 80 Plus platinum with good capacitors and independent regulation.

I often do that, too, but whenever I go to a power supply shop they never have that one in stock and I end up getting something worse.
 


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