Author Topic: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW  (Read 9687 times)

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Offline electr_peter

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #25 on: October 22, 2024, 08:22:30 pm »
At first glance iFixit soldering iron seemed interesting, but price is high and thermal performance seems to be lacking. At least it is usable.

IMO there is small issue with this station being "portable". Having USB cable attached to base station is limiting movement/workspace setup somewhat, meaning you need relatively big flat surface for soldering setup. Semi-portable - sure; portable - maybe, depends.

Besides many USB-C powered irons, I would consider MiniWare TS1C a potential (semi)portable alternative for less cost (just need to add powerbank for the cost difference). TS1C advantages - it is wireless (better usability in most cases) and has selection of tips (fits TS80/TS80P iron).
 

Offline thm_w

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #26 on: October 22, 2024, 09:25:40 pm »
IMO there is small issue with this station being "portable". Having USB cable attached to base station is limiting movement/workspace setup somewhat, meaning you need relatively big flat surface for soldering setup. Semi-portable - sure; portable - maybe, depends.

Its just a trade off, either have a base station, or have a fat heavy handle. Some people don't like the latter.
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Offline EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #27 on: October 23, 2024, 12:21:01 am »
FYI, I have been discussing this with the head designer of the iron at iFixit, and with regard to the 100W tip rating, they have shared some test data that shows it does indeed output the claimed 100W.
The problem of course is into a load, where tip design, thermocouple and feedback plays a role.
New firmware is in the works.
I've encouraged them to share the data on their site or post here.

As for the 100W marking on the tip, they said this:
Quote
For our UL-Safety Rating, we're required to label the tips with the maximum operating power and operating voltage, hence the 17V and 100W engraved on the tips.
 
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Offline showman

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #28 on: October 23, 2024, 03:02:22 am »
FYI, I have been discussing this with the head designer of the iron at iFixit, and with regard to the 100W tip rating, they have shared some test data that shows it does indeed output the claimed 100W.
There's no need for secret "test data". Output of what into what? If the power bank can output 100 W, but none of the current tips actually take that, i.e. their resistance is significantly more than (17 V)^2/100W = 2.9 ohm, I can see why people would be angry (ignoring the fact that according to a youtube commenter the datasheet recommended output voltage of the buck regulator supposedly goes up to 13 V instead of 17 V. I checked the datasheet of the part that the commenter gave and it was indeed 13 V, but not if/where it is used in the station). If the resistances are lower than 2.9 ohms when the tips are cold, there should be no issue. Several people have asked for it in the youtube comments, but I did not see any responses.

That said, in my opinion it is kind of irrelevant what either the marketing or the actual power is as long as people can use it for whatever their use cases are. And in a similar way the price or bang per buck are irrelevant. Who wants it will buy it and who does not, will not. I first bought an expensive JBC station with a bunch of expensive tips and later some cheap Chinese T12 stations which cost like tenth or less of the JBC and honestly, I can work with and like all of those for different reasons.

Of course if the design or manufacturing of the tips is for some reason fundamentally flawed, for example the thermocouple is too far/decoupled from the surface of the tip, they'll have to fix that. Depending on the problem it may or may not be fixable by firmware alone.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2024, 03:16:13 am by showman »
 
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Offline EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #29 on: October 23, 2024, 03:22:43 am »
There's no need for secret "test data". Output of what into what? If the power bank can output 100 W, but none of the current tips actually take that, i.e. their resistance is significantly more than (17 V)^2/100W = 2.9 ohm, I can see why people would be angry (ignoring the fact that according to a youtube commenter the datasheet recommended output voltage of the buck regulator supposedly goes up to 13 V instead of 17 V.

They told me the tip is 3 ohms.
And that the control algorithm is optimized for small-to-medium thermal loads.
 

Offline showman

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #30 on: October 23, 2024, 03:44:11 am »
There's no need for secret "test data". Output of what into what? If the power bank can output 100 W, but none of the current tips actually take that, i.e. their resistance is significantly more than (17 V)^2/100W = 2.9 ohm, I can see why people would be angry (ignoring the fact that according to a youtube commenter the datasheet recommended output voltage of the buck regulator supposedly goes up to 13 V instead of 17 V.

They told me the tip is 3 ohms.
And that the control algorithm is optimized for small-to-medium thermal loads.
So given 3 ohms, it is close to 100 W max into the tip. When it heats up, depending on the heater/thermocouple metals (not sure of the exact tip construction), the resistance will go up and power down correspondigly by some amount. Also, given the optimization for small tips, it also makes sense that the measured power is less than 100 W since too much power would overheat the tip. And of course the larger the thermal mass and the further the measurement is from the surface, the harder the control becomes, especially when you want to do it well for both small and large tips. But I'm sure they will fix/improve it one way or another.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2024, 03:46:31 am by showman »
 

Offline EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #31 on: October 23, 2024, 04:53:20 am »
So given 3 ohms, it is close to 100 W max into the tip. When it heats up, depending on the heater/thermocouple metals (not sure of the exact tip construction), the resistance will go up and power down correspondigly by some amount. Also, given the optimization for small tips, it also makes sense that the measured power is less than 100 W since too much power would overheat the tip. And of course the larger the thermal mass and the further the measurement is from the surface, the harder the control becomes, especially when you want to do it well for both small and large tips. But I'm sure they will fix/improve it one way or another.

Yes, that's basically what they have told me. I have seen data where they disabled the thermocouple feedback and got a constant 82-85W into water.

So what it looks like happened, it's possible to get 100W into no/small load and they had to mark the tip with that maximum figure for some UL requirement, and then of course marketing ran with the 100W figure and plastered it everywhere else.
And their current firmware is optimised for the intended market of small/mid loads (hence also the tips), so it doesn't do well on the water test or other big loads.
With a firmware tweak they will be able to improve this, but I suspect that barring a tip redesign, they won't ever get the full 100W into a big load.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2024, 04:56:57 am by EEVblog »
 
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Offline SteveyG

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #32 on: October 23, 2024, 08:02:49 pm »
I'm not surprised there's some difficulties giving the 'true' 100W performance. We see the same thing from various manufacturers which is why the JBC clones have become so popular.
In all my discussions with Metcal, good cartridge/tip design is a real art and a trade-off between thermal mass, response time, and position of thermocouple and heater. They introduced the variable temperature stations which introduced huge capital expenditure for the new topology to get the performance customers expect. What hope do smaller companies really have?
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Offline Greg J

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #33 on: November 17, 2024, 07:48:29 pm »
So I preordered it, was told I'll get it next year - but it arrived about 3 weeks ago.
I was very excited, I need and tend to use a lot of USB-C power banks that can do higher voltage output. Main one I use all the time Sherpa 100PD . Was hoping that on top of being battery powered - actually usable around soldering iron, I can use this as a generic USB-C power bank. Boy, was up in for a ride

Let me get one thing out of the way. It's an excellent battery powered soldering iron. Better than any I've used before.

For some reason I couldn't upgrade to firmware version 1.0.4 - dunno why, 1.0.5 works. Having to use a web-browser , of the "horrible" kind (chrome based) - not ideal, but let's not get distracted.

I started testing it with random USB-C powered devices, higher power (voltage) required devices. In the end, I wanted to discharge it fully, so I plugged in an Ikea (so not cheap chinese crap) USB-C powered, with all PD negotiation circuitry inside Air Quality monitor. Boy, I've never seen so much smoke coming out of a device! Cracking noises and smoke. This iFix IT power bank just basically obliterated it.

To say that I don't trust it, would be an understatement.
I have no problems with battery powered devices. Being driving an EV for 8+ years, know lots of people working in the industry, I even run a podcast about EVs (take-it-ev podcast). But iFix it - don't trust them anymore.

Device came with firmware 1.0.3, so I tried upgrading to 1.0.4. That bricked it. I had to force it into DFU and downgrade to 1.0.3.

Contacted support, they told me they would accept a return, but otherwise can't send me a replacement due to high demand (gulp).

Now, given their attitude towards fruity company - imagine apple released this device, and I had this experience. Or better yet, someone working for iFix It had that experience ..

Honestly, I feel like I can't trust them anymore..



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Offline thm_w

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #34 on: November 18, 2024, 09:55:06 pm »
Shame they can't send preproduction units to Dave and others, well ahead of production, to work out these issues.

I started testing it with random USB-C powered devices, higher power (voltage) required devices. In the end, I wanted to discharge it fully, so I plugged in an Ikea (so not cheap chinese crap) USB-C powered, with all PD negotiation circuitry inside Air Quality monitor. Boy, I've never seen so much smoke coming out of a device! Cracking noises and smoke. This iFix IT power bank just basically obliterated it.

Do you have a USB C tester or meter that can measure the voltage out of this thing while its plugged in?

That is insane if it negotiated the wrong voltage. Feel like they should refund you the cost of the air quality monitor and hold production until they figure out what went wrong here.
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Offline EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #35 on: November 18, 2024, 10:01:15 pm »
Shame they can't send preproduction units to Dave and others, well ahead of production, to work out these issues.

Reviewers aren't a free design review service!
I do actually get this quite a lot, companies will contact me and say they have a product in development and want me to help them iron out the design. "Let's work together!", "Let's schedule a conference call with the design team!" etc as if it's worth my time to help them design their product that I'm nto going to make a cent from.
 
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Offline thm_w

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #36 on: November 18, 2024, 11:55:20 pm »
Shame they can't send preproduction units to Dave and others, well ahead of production, to work out these issues.

Reviewers aren't a free design review service!
I do actually get this quite a lot, companies will contact me and say they have a product in development and want me to help them iron out the design. "Let's work together!", "Let's schedule a conference call with the design team!" etc as if it's worth my time to help them design their product that I'm nto going to make a cent from.

Absolutely. But you'll do it anyway to a degree, if its interesting enough to take a brief look at.
If they want true engineering feedback, then they should pay up. But no one seems to care to that point.

There is a mechanical engineer that reviews chinese bike parts and constantly complains about the same thing (peak torque). But he gets free shit and it makes for interesting content, so I don't expect it to ever end.
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Offline Ranayna

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #37 on: November 19, 2024, 11:22:59 am »
My assumption would be that the companies, if they really want you to do a critique on a pre-production unit, that you need to sign an NDA.
So you can't make a video about it, maybe even can't talk about it at all.

If you get sent a device for review/teardowns, especially if you buy it yourself, all bets are off and theres nothing stopping you from making a video.
 

Offline thm_w

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #38 on: November 19, 2024, 10:09:07 pm »
My assumption would be that the companies, if they really want you to do a critique on a pre-production unit, that you need to sign an NDA.
So you can't make a video about it, maybe even can't talk about it at all.

If you get sent a device for review/teardowns, especially if you buy it yourself, all bets are off and theres nothing stopping you from making a video.

Western companies, yes, this is a big deal if you pre-empt their official release. And if the initial product run has major flaws, they'll fix them but only 6-12 months later and give it a different model number.

Chinese companies, they dgaf, they'll send out preproduction units with the full branding on them to reviewers, or sell within china only to start. If there is a major flaw with the initial batch, which is often, they might fix it a month later and just continue to sell it under the same model number.
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Offline SuperSVGA

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #39 on: November 19, 2024, 11:54:36 pm »
So I preordered it, was told I'll get it next year - but it arrived about 3 weeks ago.

You had better luck than me it seems, I pre-ordered on September 13th, it said it would start shipping October 15th, and here I am still waiting for any sign of it even shipping...

I already have far too many soldering irons so it's not like I'm stuck without it, but I was hoping to have a hands on experience with it if only to form my own opinion of it.
 

Offline Greg J

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #40 on: January 23, 2025, 10:38:30 am »
Do you have a USB C tester or meter that can measure the voltage out of this thing while its plugged in?

That is insane if it negotiated the wrong voltage. Feel like they should refund you the cost of the air quality monitor and hold production until they figure out what went wrong here.

They sent me a replacement unit now - I am scared to test it. I don't have fancy USB-C testers, just little cheap Chinese ones. I still got another two of those Ikea sensors - so I will add extra protection inside and try again at some point.
But yeah, either Dave and other reviewers didn't stress test this device - or I truly got a lemon
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Offline EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #41 on: January 23, 2025, 11:34:17 pm »
Shame they can't send preproduction units to Dave and others, well ahead of production, to work out these issues.

Reviewers aren't a free design review service!
I do actually get this quite a lot, companies will contact me and say they have a product in development and want me to help them iron out the design. "Let's work together!", "Let's schedule a conference call with the design team!" etc as if it's worth my time to help them design their product that I'm nto going to make a cent from.

Absolutely. But you'll do it anyway to a degree, if its interesting enough to take a brief look at.
If they want true engineering feedback, then they should pay up. But no one seems to care to that point.

Sometimes, if it interests me, because I'm a nerd and I can't help myself.
But when they start scheduling conference calls with design teams, I'm out, that's paid work.
 
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Offline EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: EEVblog 1646 - iFixIt FixHub Portable USB Soldering Station REVIEW
« Reply #42 on: January 23, 2025, 11:41:27 pm »
My assumption would be that the companies, if they really want you to do a critique on a pre-production unit, that you need to sign an NDA.
So you can't make a video about it, maybe even can't talk about it at all.
If you get sent a device for review/teardowns, especially if you buy it yourself, all bets are off and theres nothing stopping you from making a video.

It's usually just a professional trust arrangement, no legal NDA used. They'll send us a pre-production unit and we'll promise not to do a video until release.
And if we do find something wrong pre-release we tell them about it and let them fix it, and often won't even mention it happened. Because as engineers ourselves we understand "shit happens".
Of course if it's something funny like say Agilent's new pre-release scope blowing up and releasing the magic smoke, that's gonna make the final video cut because it too funny not to share.

 


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