Author Topic: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply  (Read 94244 times)

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Offline MasterOfNone

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #100 on: August 18, 2013, 12:31:00 pm »
Just saw the video. Not impressed. I fall into the camp of those who think the front panel display and control pad stinks. The update speed on the output voltage indication is what I would expect of a $50 piece of junk. What were Rigol thinking ?

Sorry, in my book a total fail.

I recently purchased three GWInstek PSP-603 programmable power supplies. They may not have the spec of the Rigol but at GBP80 ($120) each they were great value. I can use them independently in a neat vertical stack or as separate units around the lab. Up to 60V at 3.5A output, so pretty versatile. The lower voltage PSP-405 was also available. That had greater voltage resolution. Mine were Brand New Old boxed Stock from a company that was being shut down and selling off its inventory. The PSP-xxx series have a more friendly user interface and a nice large display. The KISS principal has been applied well.

http://www.gwinstek.com/en/product/productdetail.aspx?pid=38&mid=75&id=164

http://uk.farnell.com/gw-instek/psp-603/psu-programmable-60v-3-5a/dp/4911751?Ntt=psp-603


And finally, what's with Rigol trying to make their kit look like it came off the Starship Enterprise ? Don't get me wrong, I am a Trekkie, but I need a power supply that is quick and easy to use. I thought the days of trying to impress with flashy displays and lit buttons died in the 1980's ? I remember Alan Sugar (AMSTRAD) having lots of flashy lights put on his AV equipment to sell it to those who were impressed by 'technology' Basically bragging rights but the kit was still a pile of cheap junk behind the flashy front panel.
I’m confused, the normal retail price of three PSP-603’s isn’t in the same range as a single DP832, and if someone doesn’t like PSU having displays, then they’ll have three rather than one with three PSP-603‘s. But as with the Amstrad systems of the 80s, you are always going to get better quality if you decided to pay for a system built from reasonably good separates, rather than an all-in-one system. But I don’t think Rigol is quite as bad as Amstrad yet.
And O.K the PSP-603 is a nice looking PSU, but with the DP832 if you squint  your eyes whilst standing on one leg, it really doesn’t look as bad it does in the photo’s. And as Dave has shown in his video, Rigol realised that some people wont like the looks of the thing, so they designed it so you can stand in on its back and hide it out of sight under your desk/workbench.
The usability of my PD832 is worse than Dave’s because I currently have an older version of the firmware that defaults to adjusting 10 units rather the 10 millivolt/milliamp units when the knob is turned, so maybe other aspects of the usability will improve with time, but apart of the default units I don’t think it's really that bad.  For the same price I’m not really sure, which other triple output PSU is actually better.
 

Offline Zbig

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #101 on: August 18, 2013, 12:39:01 pm »
Just one hint from my side to people currently in the market for a new PSU: don't overlook the Siglent SPD3303 series. There are some pros as well as some cons comparing it to the Rigol, chances are you'll like it better.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2013, 12:41:42 pm by Zbig »
 

Offline ElectroIrradiator

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #102 on: August 18, 2013, 12:48:21 pm »
Just one hint from my side to people currently in the market for a new PSU: don't overlook the Siglent SPD3303 series. There are some pros as well as some cons comparing it to the Rigol, chances are you'll like it better.

I refuse to even consider an electronics product, where you have to register just to download the user manual. They couldn't even bother to tell on their homepage whether it has linear or switching regulators.
 

Offline Zbig

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #103 on: August 18, 2013, 01:09:34 pm »
I refuse to even consider an electronics product, where you have to register just to download the user manual. They couldn't even bother to tell on their homepage whether it has linear or switching regulators.

Go to www.siglent.com, choose "English", then "Service", "Download Center" and "User Manual". You don't have to register to download anything from there, only when you try to do so from the product page. Stupid, I know.

It's linear, powered by quite beefy toroidal transformer.
 

Offline nitro2k01

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #104 on: August 18, 2013, 01:36:31 pm »
I remain confident that if Dave opened up a Rigol product that reeked of oversight, bad design, or dangerous flaws, he'd have a field day showing them in all their glory and ask the manufacturer to respond.
Of course he would. If he can spend 10 minutes discussing a little rust on an instrument  casing, there's no way in hell he's going to let a little rust go unnoticed. And yes, he would and he has pointed out flaws. From the top of my head:
  • Handheld multimeter exploding in his hand. (Result: The manufacturer changed the design.)
  • Fluke multimeter 87 multimeter affected by GSM. (Result: Firmware update fixing the problem and free USB adapter for anyone affected.)
  • PICKit 3. (Result: Reponse video about Mr Head.)
  • That Korad PSU he managed to blow. (Result: Hmm, did Trio Smartcal stop carrying the item?)
Anything I've missed?
Whoa! How the hell did Dave know that Bob is my uncle? Amazing!
 

Offline jancumps

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #105 on: August 18, 2013, 01:44:46 pm »
Quote
...

...
  • That Korad PSU he managed to blow. (Result: Hmm, did Trio Smartcal stop carrying the item?)
Anything I've missed?
Didn't they review the design and send new PCBs to Trio Smartcal? I thought that I saw Charles welding something with it.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2013, 01:46:36 pm by jancumps »
 

Offline firewalker

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #106 on: August 18, 2013, 01:46:13 pm »
Arbitrary option to the function gen of the  Agillent scope.

Alexander.
Become a realist, stay a dreamer.

 

Offline saturation

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #107 on: August 18, 2013, 01:52:31 pm »
Wow, $120 each??  :-+ That's a great price.  They are ~ $300 +/- $50 each depending on seller, in the USA.  If anyone in the EU still wants a PSU that can't be beat for a programmable linear PSU.


Just saw the video. Not impressed. I fall into the camp of those who think the front panel display and control pad stinks. The update speed on the output voltage indication is what I would expect of a $50 piece of junk. What were Rigol thinking ?

Sorry, in my book a total fail.

I recently purchased three GWInstek PSP-603 programmable power supplies. They may not have the spec of the Rigol but at GBP80 ($120) each they were great value. ..
Best Wishes,

 Saturation
 

Offline JoeO

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #108 on: August 18, 2013, 02:05:37 pm »
One thing I noticed: Don't most supplies have the Black (Negative) connector on the left and the Red (Positive) connector on the right?
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Today, only 26,000 remain.
 

Offline kayvee

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #109 on: August 18, 2013, 02:18:18 pm »
One thing I noticed: Don't most supplies have the Black (Negative) connector on the left and the Red (Positive) connector on the right?

Yeah I noticed that one too.

That said my ITT/Metrix AX322 also has the positive terminals to the left of the negative.
 

Offline nitro2k01

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #110 on: August 18, 2013, 02:39:54 pm »
Maybe a political stance? :D

Whoa! How the hell did Dave know that Bob is my uncle? Amazing!
 

Offline saturation

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #111 on: August 18, 2013, 02:56:44 pm »
Slightly of topic, speaking of standards  :palm:

 RED right of "black" was Japanese way, not sure this is the world standard now, IEC.  Also Japanese negative terminals are white, earth ground is black, vs green.  The color scheme is different from the USA.

http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_5/chpt_2/2.html



TTI supplies are one of the few stil made in the UK



Gossen Metrawatt PSU actually made in Germany, use blue as negative terminals:



RED left of black was HPs and USA way:





Very confusing if you start thinking about it  :scared:


One thing I noticed: Don't most supplies have the Black (Negative) connector on the left and the Red (Positive) connector on the right?

Yeah I noticed that one too.

That said my ITT/Metrix AX322 also has the positive terminals to the left of the negative.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2013, 02:58:23 pm by saturation »
Best Wishes,

 Saturation
 

Offline saturation

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #112 on: August 18, 2013, 03:26:13 pm »
Nice review as always.  Strange some folks really took offense at some comments, I guess PSU is a popular item.

I think the Rigol PSU interface is unique and well designed, and between 3 similar linear programmable supplies in this price range, $400: Rigol, Atten and Siglent, Rigol is a better bet long term; support and firmware updates and likely hardware build quality; so its bang for buck except for the 2V switch on issue; it could be fixable via firmware.  The rotary dial layout is strange, but not a deal breaker.

That said, they are fairly close to each other with the new Siglent looking fairly competitive, and a lot simpler in layout.



The Atten is sold as Tenma house brand in the USA:




The interface has to be spotless because its all the operator has to go on and if its not idiot proof, the operator can make errors setting one or all the supplies; the Atten glitches doesn't build confidence that the output will behave later on, I'd still be checking it manually with a DMM.  The risk of blowing an expensive IC or test board is one reason I still prefer, for lab work, all manual switches and no programmability.

If I were to buy a programmable supply I'd prefer a continuous output monitor like Shariar showed in the more costly Rigol model, so I can track issues.  Getting a graph over time, as the 34461a DMM shows, is great timesaver particularly if a glitch occurs beyond the capacity of the PSU to regulate:



That said, I still prefer 3 single output supplies for redundancy and reliability; if one output dies, I still have the other two whereas a 3 in 1, the whole supply is taken out for repair should one supply go even if the other 2 are working, or worse a single output failure could take out all outputs.
Best Wishes,

 Saturation
 

Offline tinhead

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #113 on: August 18, 2013, 03:29:47 pm »
Slightly of topic, speaking of standards  :palm:

the best is Xantrex/Sorensen/Ametek, no need to think what is on right on left ^^

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Offline JoeO

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #114 on: August 18, 2013, 03:53:35 pm »
Slightly of topic, speaking of standards  :palm:

the best is Xantrex/Sorensen/Ametek, no need to think what is on right on left ^^


When I was looking in ebay, I did notice that the "standard" by far is Red on top, Black on the bottom.
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Today, only 26,000 remain.
 

Offline robrenz

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #115 on: August 18, 2013, 04:03:52 pm »
  The risk of blowing an expensive IC or test board is one reason I still prefer, for lab work, all manual switches and no programmability.

I still prefer 3 single output supplies for redundancy and reliability; if one output dies, I still have the other two whereas a 3 in 1, the whole supply is taken out for repair should one supply go even if the other 2 are working, or worse a single output failure could take out all outputs.

+1 :-+  That $420.00 for the Rigol would buy 4 or 5 PD precisions including shipping. Yeah there are a lot of features you are not getting on the PD's but I still love them.  Wait a minute.... I am preaching to the choir ;D

Offline senso

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #116 on: August 18, 2013, 04:19:33 pm »
It also don't think that the extra digit license is of any use, it is just for bragging rights.
Waiting for the teardown  :-/O

Robrenz, in USA maybe, not anywhere in the world, lucky you  :rant:
 

Offline mariush

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #117 on: August 18, 2013, 04:27:09 pm »

+1 :-+  That $420.00 for the Rigol would buy 4 or 5 PD precisions including shipping. Yeah there are a lot of features you are not getting on the PD's but I still love them.  Wait a minute.... I am preaching to the choir ;D

When you find someone who won't ask for $200 to ship one of those to Romania (or any country in Europe) let me know.
 

Offline robrenz

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #118 on: August 18, 2013, 04:27:19 pm »
Robrenz, in USA maybe, not anywhere in the world, lucky you  :rant:

Sorry :-[ I was not trying to make anyone feel bad.  As messed up as many aspects of the US are, it certainly has many more benefits.

Offline Fraser

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #119 on: August 18, 2013, 04:29:24 pm »
For anyone interested in a GW Instek PSP-603, the UK seller is still offering them for GBP80 each and I believe he has a lot of stock, so there should be more available if you ask him. He also had stock of the PSP-405 at the same price. I purchased a GW Instek DSO off of him direct for GBP150. He is a good chap to deal with, nothing dodgy. He has switched from Selling Test equipment to selling Caravans !

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-AND-STILL-IN-BOX-G-W-INSTEK-PSP-603-PSU-PROGRAMMABLE-60V-3-5A-/271257510711?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Test_Measurement_Equipment_ET&hash=item3f28352337

As someone has already stated, it is a SMPSU. This may effect some peoples buying decision but the PSU is very well built and performs well during my use for the past year. It is alos loght enough to be stacked on the bench without issues.

I did buy a Digimess (Grundig) PN300 programmable Linear Power supply and that is used for any work that requires a linear supply. I have yet to need it though ! That unit came direct from Digimess for GBP50 as it had a mains fuse blowing fault...simple fix, one of the Toroid transformer wires was damaged and touching chassis due to transit movement. That's is a problem with centre mounted large Toroid transformers.

There are some very good power supplies that use the KISS principle. If you are patient you may find one at a great price as in my two examples. I used a couple of very old Thurlby Thandar (TTi) PL320 Linear PSU's before the new units but they had a nasty habit of going to full output voltage when the Volts pot was adjusted  :scared: That killed at least two pieces of equipment so they got dumped....crap design.

« Last Edit: August 18, 2013, 04:50:57 pm by Aurora »
 

Offline robrenz

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #120 on: August 18, 2013, 04:33:47 pm »

+1 :-+  That $420.00 for the Rigol would buy 4 or 5 PD precisions including shipping. Yeah there are a lot of features you are not getting on the PD's but I still love them.  Wait a minute.... I am preaching to the choir ;D

When you find someone who won't ask for $200 to ship one of those to Romania (or any country in Europe) let me know.

The HP 6114A and 6115A are even better than the PD's and may be available in the EU

Offline olsenn

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #121 on: August 18, 2013, 05:03:51 pm »
Just in case it wasn't obvious, the benefit of the higher resolution is in the ability to increase/decrease the voltage/current by 1mV/1mA intervals, and not just the readout showing an extra digit. This can be very useful for doing things like measuring the small-signal gain of transistors etc.
 

Offline MasterOfNone

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #122 on: August 18, 2013, 05:24:01 pm »
Just in case it wasn't obvious, the benefit of the higher resolution is in the ability to increase/decrease the voltage/current by 1mV/1mA intervals, and not just the readout showing an extra digit. This can be very useful for doing things like measuring the small-signal gain of transistors etc.

Sorry but without Hi-Res you can actually increase/decrease the set current at a resolution of 1mA, you just can’t see on the big readout digits. But the voltage is 10mV for set and readout without Hi-Res.
 

Offline g3org3

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #123 on: August 18, 2013, 06:43:26 pm »
Hi Guys,

First post here. Excuse my English, not my native language.

Hi Dave,

In the user manual for DP832 Rigol has a TIP:
 When powering on the Instrument after powering off it, make sure that the time interval between the two operations is greater than 5s.

Would it be possible for you to make another test and see if that spike is still there after 5s?

Thanks for the great reviews and info.
 

Offline senso

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Re: EEVblog #509 - Rigol 832 Lab Power Supply
« Reply #124 on: August 18, 2013, 06:45:05 pm »
Robrenz, in USA maybe, not anywhere in the world, lucky you  :rant:

Sorry :-[ I was not trying to make anyone feel bad.  As messed up as many aspects of the US are, it certainly has many more benefits.

Not making me feel bad at all, just jealous, and when you restore them, drool worthy masterpieces.
In Europe the cheapest nice supplies that I know are the HP6632B that KJDS is selling on eBay, sadly only 1 channel per PSU.
 


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