Author Topic: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation  (Read 255623 times)

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alm

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #425 on: October 07, 2013, 03:10:33 pm »
Either that, or (once they fix everything) the best vetted supply in the industry?
Best vetted by a few dozen users? Compared something like the HP 6632B that was used in thousands of test setups across the world for many years?

But I would indeed prefer this power supply over the affordable competition from brands like Korad, Owon and Atten. At least the flaws in this power supply are well documented and for most of the part not deal killers. There's no guarantee that the competition won't have any issues. I wouldn't spec either for critical applications, though. Who knows what other problems might turn up, since the designers have clearly shown lack of attention to detail.
 

Offline os40la

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #426 on: October 11, 2013, 05:31:39 am »
Got an email from TEquipment today that my DP832 was shipped. The email was sent at 10:00am saying they shipped it today 10/10/2013. The damn thing was delivered to my door step by noon the same day. Wow their shipping is just as fast as email.. :wtf: They told me it will be the one with the fixed overheating issue.

Does anyone know how to tell without cracking it open?
"No, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express"
 

Offline Sparky

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #427 on: October 11, 2013, 06:28:56 am »
Does anyone know how to tell without cracking it open?

Well, see this post from John South with images of the apparent fixed PCB with large heatsink.

 >> You should be able to see such a large heatsink through the side grill (where the carry strap is).

Also, see this post by Uup for the info below on how to display the full system information:

To display the full details press the following soft buttons in sequence, when in the system info screen.
1 – 3 – 4 – 2  where the soft buttons (buttons under the LCD) are numbered from left to right.


 >> That might tell us what the latest versions of the firmware etc are for the new build, which would be helpful for those of us (including myself) who need to return DP832's to Rigol for repair.

 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #428 on: October 11, 2013, 06:36:20 am »
Best vetted by a few dozen users?

Don't underestimate a few dozen nerds  :P
 

Offline TooOldForThis

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #429 on: October 11, 2013, 01:24:51 pm »
I got an email from them on Wednesday saying they were delaying my DP832 shipment another 6 days.  Then I got an email on Thursday saying it had shipped.  UPS says it was shipped 13 hours before TE sent the first email. 
 

Offline os40la

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #430 on: October 11, 2013, 02:40:54 pm »

I think it's more like their email system is really, really slow :-) They probably got an email from the courier saying "package out for delivery" and suddenly realized "oh crap, we didn't send the shipping mail!"

They informed me that they have a warehouse in my state when I asked about the tax charges. The warehouse if fairly close to me. :D So is guess the UPS guy was not on crack. >:D  The email did go out the same day. If only my ebay purchases from China came that fast  :-DD

I still give them 11 out of 10 for shipping for my order.... Only negative thing I can come up with is I was ticked for tax because they do business in my state. They have one of their warehouses in it.  |O My EEVblog discount was eaten up with by the tax. But the free shipping more than makes up for it.
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Offline con-f-use

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #431 on: October 11, 2013, 04:17:15 pm »
There's an EEVBlog discount at TE? How do you get that and how much is it?
 

Offline os40la

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #432 on: October 11, 2013, 04:25:33 pm »
There's an EEVBlog discount at TE? How do you get that and how much is it?

5% Discount. just enter EEVBLOG6 (I think if my memory is correct) I called and asked them for the code. You will enter at checkout in the discount column.

Update: 6% Discount not 5%
« Last Edit: October 11, 2013, 05:26:27 pm by os40la »
"No, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express"
 

Offline con-f-use

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #433 on: October 11, 2013, 04:39:11 pm »
Thanks, should've written a PM. Sorry @all. But ontopic, I was actually thinking of buying a DP832 from them. Is there a hack to unlock the higher precision?
 

Offline os40la

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #434 on: October 11, 2013, 04:55:09 pm »
Thanks, should've written a PM. Sorry @all. But ontopic, I was actually thinking of buying a DP832 from them. Is there a hack to unlock the higher precision?

No, I don't think a PM would have been needed it is known that they have an EEVBLOG discount and they will tell you what it is if you ask. There is a hack that turns on all the options.

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/sniffing-the-rigol's-internal-i2c-bus/1170/  ;D
"No, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express"
 

Offline os40la

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #435 on: October 11, 2013, 05:29:07 pm »
There's an EEVBlog discount at TE? How do you get that and how much is it?

5% Discount. just enter EEVBLOG6 (I think if my memory is correct) I called and asked them for the code. You will enter at checkout in the discount column.

Update: 6% Discount not 5%

I was wrong with the 5% discount. The correct discount is 6%
"No, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express"
 

Offline etc6849

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #436 on: October 11, 2013, 05:52:28 pm »
The DP832 I ordered from TE came today.  It has the version of the board pictured below.  It came with firmware 1.06 and the serial number is DP8C153101xxx.

What's weird is it was definitely repackaged, presumably by Rigol NA?  For example, the sticker over the IEC connector telling you to check the main voltage setting had already been removed and the box was double taped, with clear packing tape over the original Rigol tape that had been previously cut.  Kind of cheesy of Rigol to charge full price for a repackaged unit (IMO).

Still this is a lot better than the first version of the unit I had.  Through the vent holes, temperatures on the side of the heatsink were 104*F and and 130*F on the backside where the fins are.  This is much cooler than my previous version which was always above 200*F and had the heatsink right beside the caps.

The fan sounds louder to me though.  It stays on at full speed.  It's just been too long since I had the first version so I can't remember if this is different or not?

I have confirmation that the issue has already been fixed in a new board revision.
They changed the board to fit a larger heatsink, but it's not a huge amount bigger. See photo.
They measured the temp at 76C in a 28C ambient , but I'm not sure if this is free standing out of the case, or in the case with airflow.
They will be replacing all Australian units, I don't know about other countries.

I would not call this a proper belt'n'braces fix, as I think the heatsink still isn't big enough, but it probably now puts it into the (just) acceptable category.
They have also apparently made a few other fixes.



Do you know from what serial number done this new board revision?
« Last Edit: October 11, 2013, 05:56:13 pm by etc6849 »
 

Offline Sparky

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #437 on: October 11, 2013, 05:58:26 pm »
The DP832 I ordered from TE came today.  It has the version of the board pictured below.  It came with firmware 1.06 and the serial number is DP8C153101xxx.

Interesting that the heatsink is not the full-height that John South posted as the new boards.
 

Offline os40la

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #438 on: October 11, 2013, 06:01:49 pm »
My DP832 came with firmware 1.06 as well.
"No, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express"
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #439 on: October 11, 2013, 06:59:17 pm »
Oh no, not the full speed fan 'Mod' that many feared might be introduced.  :--

Placing the small (inefficient) heat-sinks in a virtual wind tunnel may cure the heat issue but that is serious bodgery IMHO.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2013, 07:02:04 pm by Aurora »
 

Offline etc6849

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #440 on: October 11, 2013, 07:09:54 pm »
I really don't remember how loud the old one was since it's been almost a month...  I don't have a large load to see for sure if the fan gets even louder or not.  I measured about 58 dBA (SPL A weighted) 6" from the fan with no load.

Did the fan speed up and then slow down when you turned on the revision 1 DP832?  The fan speed on mine stays constant as it powers up.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2013, 07:12:25 pm by etc6849 »
 

Offline Uup

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #441 on: October 11, 2013, 10:37:08 pm »
The fan on my DP832A briefly goes to high speed on power up then to an idle once the power up cycle is complete.
Ununpentium
 

Offline lemon

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #442 on: October 14, 2013, 02:16:41 pm »
The DP832 I ordered from TE came today.  It has the version of the board pictured below.  It came with firmware 1.06 and the serial number is DP8C153101xxx.

What's weird is it was definitely repackaged, presumably by Rigol NA?  For example, the sticker over the IEC connector telling you to check the main voltage setting had already been removed and the box was double taped, with clear packing tape over the original Rigol tape that had been previously cut.  Kind of cheesy of Rigol to charge full price for a repackaged unit (IMO).
....

It sure repackaged, mine is came on 5 September and the serial number was DP8C153301XXX.
 

Offline lemon

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #443 on: October 14, 2013, 03:31:43 pm »
The power-on spike on the Rigol DP832 Lab Power Supply, hasn't any stable behavior or pattern.

At the following videos I demonstrate some of these on channel I & II simultaneously.
Sometimes nothing is going there, everything is OK, the worst pattern is at the 4rd video.
Sorry I haven't any HD camera, this are SD resolution short videos.
The scope was horizontal set at 5msec/div and vertical to 500mV/div.




« Last Edit: October 14, 2013, 03:35:20 pm by lemon »
 

Offline olsenn

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #444 on: October 15, 2013, 01:47:29 pm »
How long do people here rekkon the rev. 2 board will hold up before overheating to death?
 

Offline etc6849

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #445 on: October 15, 2013, 10:56:16 pm »
I was afraid of that.  My "new" version stays at full speed all the time.

The fan on my DP832A briefly goes to high speed on power up then to an idle once the power up cycle is complete.
 

Offline lemon

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #446 on: October 16, 2013, 08:18:56 am »
I agree, the same happens to mine scope with DP8C1533014XX serial number, digital version 00.01.06 and Cal Time 2013-8-17.

It is a little noiser in silent environment!
 

Offline nack

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #447 on: October 16, 2013, 09:53:42 am »
I was afraid of that.  My "new" version stays at full speed all the time.

The fan on my DP832A briefly goes to high speed on power up then to an idle once the power up cycle is complete.

That's disappointing. What firmware version do you run on yours?
 

Offline TooOldForThis

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #448 on: October 16, 2013, 10:47:20 pm »
I have a DP832, delivered two days ago, with FW rev 00.01.06.    The fan stays on 'medium' most of the time then switches to high if you give the supply a large load.   The sound of the DP832 on high is still slightly quieter that the sound of the fan in my DS4024 scope.  The fan in the DS4024 never slows down. :(

Anyway, the 'usually medium' fan in the DP832 keeps the problem heat sink at about 64C  (measured in the middle of the back of the heat sink in a cool room)
 

Offline lemon

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Re: EEVblog #512 - Rigol DP832 Bad Design Investigation
« Reply #449 on: October 17, 2013, 05:43:41 pm »
General, the Rigol has a issue with the louder fans to all models...

Your result is almost identical with mine, here. I had measured 48-68°C according to the heatshink measurement point.
 


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