Author Topic: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant  (Read 25773 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Online EEVblog

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 30122
  • Country: au
    • EEVblog
EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« on: February 09, 2014, 04:33:33 am »
Dave hates products with built in charging that don't use a standard Micro USB connector.
In this case the Panasonic Lumix LF1 with its stupid proprietary connector.
Why in this day and age of attempted standardisation are companies still doing this?

 

Offline ishelly404

  • Contributor
  • Posts: 10
  • Country: us
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #1 on: February 09, 2014, 04:52:06 am »
I have a Sony camera (Don't remember the model off the top of my head) with a micro USB connector and internal battery charger and everything, but it won't charge with any cable but the Sony one.  It gives an error about a non genuine cable when I try to use any other.

Sony... :palm:
 

Offline neotesla

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 31
  • Country: au
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #2 on: February 09, 2014, 05:08:10 am »
One would have thought that the "Universal" (in USB) would give them a clue... :-//
 

Offline mariush

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3835
  • Country: ro
  • .
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2014, 06:03:27 am »
Quote
I have a Sony camera (Don't remember the model off the top of my head) with a micro USB connector and internal battery charger and everything, but it won't charge with any cable but the Sony one.  It gives an error about a non genuine cable when I try to use any other.

Sony... :palm:

The Sony CX410VE hd camera I bought last Black Friday came with standard microHDMI, standard USB (cable that hides in the strip which goes around you hand) , standard sdhc/sdxc and charges from usb or external adapter. Really, the only proprietary stuff is the memory stick support.

The old camera I had - a Sony HDR-SR5E - was not charging from usb at all, had to use the external adapter to charge it.
 

Offline Alan Liefting

  • Newbie
  • Posts: 2
  • Country: nz
    • Ecotech Services
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2014, 06:07:02 am »
Yep, I agree.  It is not just cameras of course.  Remember when DC connectors were only 2.5 and 3.5 mm.  Then along came 2.1 mm and now look at all of the different sizes! Laptops, inkjet printers, and mobile phones have a huge range of sizes and styles.  Some variation is understandable for the range of current consumption but the wide variety of connectors now out there is just going too far!

Note that the mobile phone manufacturers that sell in the EU countries have decided on the micro USB-B standard for phone chargers.

Now don't get me started on the lack of lithium battery size standardisation!  >:(
Alan from NZ
 

Online timelessbeing

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 798
  • Country: 00
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2014, 06:11:17 am »
Dave makes in-camera charging sound like big feature. I thought it was pretty common.  :-//

Funny he should exemplify Sony, though. My Sony camera had a USB lookalike proprietary connector. Not only that, but when it was plugged in, it blocked you from opening the battery/SD card hatch. The motorized lens stopped working after about a year and a half. What a POS that was.
 

Offline orion242

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 744
  • Country: us
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2014, 06:21:55 am »
I almost spit my drink out when Dave tossed the bird at the camera.

Nice!!  F special connectors!
 

Online timelessbeing

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 798
  • Country: 00
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2014, 06:36:45 am »
Now don't get me started on the lack of lithium battery size standardisation!  >:(
Yeah like the batteries which only fit ONE particular model of camera.  :palm:
 

Online EEVblog

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 30122
  • Country: au
    • EEVblog
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2014, 07:54:51 am »
Dave makes in-camera charging sound like big feature. I thought it was pretty common.  :-//

Nope, the majority of cameras I looked at do not charge in-camera.
 

Online timelessbeing

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 798
  • Country: 00
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2014, 08:10:25 am »
Fair enough. All my previous ones did, but I haven't done any research lately. Perhaps they're doing so they can shrink the cameras in the race to one-up the competition. In-camera charging is a must have feature if you ask me (in addition to standard connectors of course).
 

Offline rollatorwieltje

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 571
  • Country: nl
  • I brick your boards.
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2014, 08:18:28 am »
My old HTC phone had a proprietary USB port that also accepted standard mini-USB cables. I guess micro-USB is too small for a trick like that.
 

Offline Jon86

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 518
  • Country: gb
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2014, 08:23:08 am »
Come on Dave, let's see you fit a real Micro USB connector in it ;)
Death, taxes and diode losses.
 

Offline moemoe

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 105
  • Country: de
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2014, 08:58:56 am »
And even the combined A/V-Output is no reason for this proprietary shit.

Some old phone had an A/V-Out on the Mini-USB-Connector, and as Micro-USB has even one pin more (5+shield), there is no good reason at all for not using it. Even if you use one of these lines for sensing purposes, there are still 3+GND left.
https://github.com/maugsburger/
Breadboard Adapters featured in EEVBlog #573 on Tindie
 

Offline Ondre

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 41
  • Country: de
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2014, 09:10:58 am »
Dave, please show us how you go medieval on the camera's connector using a pair of pliers and a blow torch!  >:D
 

Offline iloveelectronics

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 937
  • Country: hk
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #14 on: February 09, 2014, 09:18:52 am »
Would something like this be compatible with that connector?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/USB-Data-Cable-for-Nikon-UC-E6-8P-S200di-S220-S230-S560-S620-S630-S710-S10-S200-/261391662695

This kind of 8-pin connector is actually quite common on devices like music/video players and some cameras.
My email address: franky @ 99centHobbies . com
My eBay store: http://stores.ebay.com/99centhobbies
 

Offline headwes

  • Contributor
  • Posts: 9
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #15 on: February 09, 2014, 09:25:51 am »
I have the same complaint about my Sony DSC-TX20. Unfortunately the TX series is the only one I could find that is small and waterproof with an integrated lens cover so I'm stuck with it (and thus carrying around a special cable).
 

Offline Bored@Work

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3932
  • Country: 00
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #16 on: February 09, 2014, 09:26:06 am »
The following screen shot might come handy in the future

I delete PMs unread. If you have something to say, say it in public.
For all else: Profile->[Modify Profile]Buddies/Ignore List->Edit Ignore List
 

Offline firewalker

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2330
  • Country: gr
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #17 on: February 09, 2014, 09:57:06 am »
"Dave on a quiet weekend.png"  :-DD :-DD :-DD

Alexander.
Become a realist, stay a dreamer.

 

Offline nitro2k01

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 844
  • Country: 00
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #18 on: February 09, 2014, 10:34:48 am »
Dave, congratulations, what you have there is the closest thing I've found to a standard in camera USB connectors. It appears on at least TWO brands of cameras, namely Panasonic, and Nikon. At least Nikon's point and shoots, don't know about their DSLRs. Panasonic and Nikon share the same factory? :p
(Yes, this is the same connector as in iloveelectronics's post.)

And no, "digital" doesn't mean HDMI. It simply means USB. The only AV signals coming out of that connector are analog audio and composite video. My Panasonic Lumix DMC-LS2, which was my first digital camera, has this connector and was released in 2006, which means it predates the release of micro-USB by a year. And to be precise, this camera doesn't use the USB logo anywhere on its case, on the cable plugs, in the camera's user interface, or in the manual. This makes me think that maybe there was something (that connector? :P ) that was not USB compliant which forced them to leave out the logo, and maybe also use the word "digital" instead of USB on the case.

I don't mind this connector per se. At least it actually fills a purpose (or did back when composite was the preferred video standard anyway.) Having three RCA sockets (composite+stereo audio) on a compact camera would be unthinkably large, so might as well integrate it into another port. If only the manufacturers would have gotten their act together and standardized on a single connector for the purpose!
I have a Sony camera (Don't remember the model off the top of my head) with a micro USB connector and internal battery charger and everything, but it won't charge with any cable but the Sony one.  It gives an error about a non genuine cable when I try to use any other.

Sony... :palm:
I have a few questions about that. How many different ones have you tried? Are you talking about a cable or a wall charger with a micro USB on the end? If you're talking about a cable, is this a data cable or a cheap-arse "charge only" cable with only two wires in it? Are you sure that this message means what it's saying? I could totally believe that Sony and their likes would display such a self-righteous message if, say, the cable has a too high voltage drop, or it's missing the otherwise common resistors used to present two constant voltages on the data line in order to indicate the charge current that a charger supports.

Dave makes in-camera charging sound like big feature. I thought it was pretty common.  :-//

Nope, the majority of cameras I looked at do not charge in-camera.
Just to be clear, does this refer to cameras that use AA batteries or similar, or system cameras with chunkier batteries and an external charger? In the former case, well that's just cheap crap where the batteries are the least of the reasons for avoiding them. In the latter case I can understand not wanting to be limited be the current limit of USB, if the battery has any significant capacity.
Whoa! How the hell did Dave know that Bob is my uncle? Amazing!
 

Offline woox2k

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 54
  • Country: ee
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #19 on: February 09, 2014, 10:42:37 am »
My old HTC phone had a proprietary USB port that also accepted standard mini-USB cables. I guess micro-USB is too small for a trick like that.
My old phone had the same connector and it worked quite well, it was back of these days they tried to standardize mini-USB. To be honest i always liked mini-USB more than micro, because micro connectors are quite fragile and it's bit too easy to break them off the pcb by accident (dropping the phone while cable is connected and so on). Right now i have phone with microUSB and i havent abused it in any way, the microUSB port has worn out and disconnects every time i move the cable.
I don't get it why they didn't just stay with mini-USB, i know devices are getting smaller and smaller but the mini port isn't so big and it has options to expand the connector with more pins. (USB3? Even HTC custom mini had 11pins so it would have been possible to use USB3 in it without making that weird looking dual connector thingie like with micro-USB)
« Last Edit: February 09, 2014, 10:46:10 am by woox2k »
 

Offline VK5RC

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 2292
  • Country: au
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #20 on: February 09, 2014, 11:10:50 am »
Have you tried cleaning the rubbish out of the micro USB socket? I had a phone that collected lint in the micro USB (from my pocket) Cleaning it out with a very fine tooth pick under magnification worked a treat.
Whoah! Watch where that landed we might need it later.
 

Offline ResR

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 149
  • Country: ee
  • -Artificial_Intelligent-
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #21 on: February 09, 2014, 11:18:57 am »
All the apple.inc garbage has also those proprietary connectors with too many pins.
About the camera, I have a Pentax Optio E30, been with me for 7 years, it's proprietary connector resembling USB has seen a lot of heavy use and moisture because the port has no cover but it is still operational, has two removable AA batteries, but no in-camera charging option though, but I can use built-for-purpose Duracell charger that works like a charm with any rechargeable so far.
 

Offline JoannaK

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 337
  • Country: fi
    • Diytao making blog
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #22 on: February 09, 2014, 11:37:26 am »
Dave.. just wait untill you want to purchase a spare/replavement Battery to your Camera. Companies like Panasonic (and sony?) have all batteries Chipped, and allmost all cameras have their unique battery type. And belive me, those are **** expesive.


 

Offline george graves

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1259
  • Country: us
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #23 on: February 09, 2014, 11:38:53 am »
Nope, the majority of cameras I looked at do not charge in-camera.

I know - WHAT THE HECK!  You're sucking on a UBS connection, at least trickle charge the darn battery.

And Dave - I love the stuff you do, but you need to rant harder if you want a video like this to go "viral"!!!!!

Online EEVblog

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 30122
  • Country: au
    • EEVblog
Re: EEVblog #578 - Proprietary Connector Rant
« Reply #24 on: February 09, 2014, 11:39:25 am »
Dave.. just wait untill you want to purchase a spare/replavement Battery to your Camera. Companies like Panasonic (and sony?) have all batteries Chipped, and allmost all cameras have their unique battery type. And belive me, those are **** expesive.

My canon camcorders used chipped batteries, so I simply buy chipped replacement ones on Amazon.
 


Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf