EEVblog #587 - Tektronix MDO3000 Mixed Domain Oscilloscope Teardown

[Hydrawerk]

I am looking forward to a review of MDO3000. BTW I like it's big and durable rotary handle. It is much better than that little one at many Agilent scopes like DSOX2000

[Hydrawerk]

A short video with random playing with this new scope.

[xenxen]

Is it possible to blow up the spectrum analyser by using the wrong reference level in this particular case? As an example, if the input of the spectrum analyser is 0 dBm and the ref level is set to -40 dBm?

[w2aew]

Is it possible to blow up the spectrum analyser by using the wrong reference level in this particular case? As an example, if the input of the spectrum analyser is 0 dBm and the ref level is set to -40 dBm?

In this case, 0dBm input won't cause damage at any reference level setting.

[David Hess]

They use Windows because it is FAR easier to build up a UI on Windows than it is to come up with an operating system or an embedded platform on those scopes.

Windows isn't used for acquisition, or math or anything else, just UI.  ASICs do all the work.

As a bonus, the instrument will come with all of the Windows GUI bugs we have come to expect like units scrolling off the right side of the numeric entry box where we cannot see them, strobe effects do to interface updates, variable interface latency, and drop down lists with just a couple entries and a scroll bar which take up more space and time than the whole list would have taken if all of it had been displayed to start with.  Oh, and crashes requiring a hard reboot by removing power.  Now we can feel right at home.

[Rigby]

Windows CE/Windows Embedded Compact is not Windows 95/98/ME/2000/XP/7/8/8.1.

The GUI bugs you're familiar with are almost always going to be developer foul-ups where they aren't considering different DPI settings, or they've really got a silly way to update the UI while work is going on.  As UI toolkits go, the Windows desktop/server stuff is pretty effin' solid compared to others that are available (closed or open source.)  you may not like the OS they're bound to, or you may not like the look, but they do work when they're used correctly.

[David Hess]

Windows CE/Windows Embedded Compact is not Windows 95/98/ME/2000/XP/7/8/8.1.

The GUI bugs you're familiar with are almost always going to be developer foul-ups where they aren't considering different DPI settings, or they've really got a silly way to update the UI while work is going on.  As UI toolkits go, the Windows desktop/server stuff is pretty effin' solid compared to others that are available (closed or open source.)  you may not like the OS they're bound to, or you may not like the look, but they do work when they're used correctly.

The last Tektronix oscilloscope I evaluated runs Windows 7 and displayed all of the problems I listed.

[Rigby]

The last Tektronix oscilloscope I evaluated runs Windows 7 and displayed all of the problems I listed.

ah, ok.  I was speaking of not-that-highend scopes like the MDO3000.

My employer has several tek scopes that run Windows 7 as well, and they have unpatched bug-infested dungpiles for operating systems.  And, because the thing is calibrated, you're not supposed to go patching the OS.  I draw the line at using operating systems that aren't at least somewhat real-time for things above the 1GHz range.

[David Hess]

The last Tektronix oscilloscope I evaluated runs Windows 7 and displayed all of the problems I listed.

ah, ok.  I was speaking of not-that-highend scopes like the MDO3000.

It was an MSO/DPO5000 series that I evaluated.  I certainly would not turn down using one but my preference would be for a lower performance but better working instrument.

My employer has several tek scopes that run Windows 7 as well, and they have unpatched bug-infested dungpiles for operating systems.  And, because the thing is calibrated, you're not supposed to go patching the OS.  I draw the line at using operating systems that aren't at least somewhat real-time for things above the 1GHz range.

My understanding is that Tektronix replaced Windows XP with Windows 7 in their newer instruments.

[David Hess]

I just received a Tektronix marketing email recommending that since support for Windows XP is now deprecated, I should protect my investment by buying a new oscilloscope running Windows 7.  I am a little confused about how that would protect my expensive investment in an older oscilloscope and what happens when Windows 7 is no longer supported?

[Rigby]

They'll want you to protect that investment by chucking it in the bin and buying a fresh, new investment. 

So we're clear, what I think they're saying is that "protect your investment" means "get rid of your valuable investment and replace it with a new valuable investment."

I think I know why they use desktop operating systems now, rather than the longer supported embedded operating systems.

[w2aew]

The reality is that for the DPO7000 and 70000 series scopes, there is an upgrade program to bring *that scope* to Win7.  For older generations of scope, there are trade-in programs...

[David Hess]

The tone of the email just struck me as nefariously mercenary.

[echen1024]

Now when is this review coming? Would love to see all the features.

[TVman]

Now when is this review coming? Would love to see all the features.

I don't he's going to do it...................

[dexters_lab]

I just received a Tektronix marketing email recommending that since support for Windows XP is now deprecated, I should protect my investment by buying a new oscilloscope running Windows 7.  I am a little confused about how that would protect my expensive investment in an older oscilloscope and what happens when Windows 7 is no longer supported?

surely in a scope the underlying OS is going to have so little interaction with the internet it would mean any new exploits would be rendered almost useless on such a device

[EEVblog]

Now when is this review coming? Would love to see all the features.

I don't he's going to do it...................

A full review showing "all the features" is not a trivial thing to shoot. It can take more than a full day, and end up with 150-200 clips. Probably two full days work by the time you stuff around and setup test and comparisons etc and then edit the thing. So it has not been easy to slot this into the schedule.

[Hydrawerk]

I am looking forward to it.

[David Hess]

I just received a Tektronix marketing email recommending that since support for Windows XP is now deprecated, I should protect my investment by buying a new oscilloscope running Windows 7.  I am a little confused about how that would protect my expensive investment in an older oscilloscope and what happens when Windows 7 is no longer supported?

surely in a scope the underlying OS is going to have so little interaction with the internet it would mean any new exploits would be rendered almost useless on such a device

There is also the problem of USB carried malware.  Hopefully Windows in these instruments is configured to disable Autoplay by default on external USB media but I think there is a recovery CD for reimaging the internal hard drive which could preclude that.  I was told that there is reimaging media for the oscilloscopes which use Windows 7.

Segregation will help a lot but unfortunately one of the big draws for test instruments that use Windows are the ability to directly share files over the network with other systems and remote network access.  As long as there is a reimaging procedure available, I would not care.  Just blow the system software away if it gets infected and start over.

I wonder which instruments use Windows XP or any desktop OS.  Currently it looks like the MSO5000 series and above.

[elektronchika]

Does anybody have any information about the AWG? It is constructed with one, let's say, FPGA. But where is the analog back-end? Waveform DAC, amplitude and offset DAC, etc.? Or maybe there are any other ICs on the bottom of this board. It can't be seen in the video.

Regards!

[kilohercas]

Does anybody have any information about the AWG? It is constructed with one, let's say, FPGA. But where is the analog back-end? Waveform DAC, amplitude and offset DAC, etc.? Or maybe there are any other ICs on the bottom of this board. It can't be seen in the video.

Regards!

In some pdf file about MDO3000 series i found pictures of ADC and DAC wafer , and they brag that they developed some new technology. If you look tear down, that huge bga have common mode choke, that ,means it is generating differential signal directly from chip, and later r converted to single end 50R constant output (50R output just rescales AWG to 2x lower amplitude compared to High Z output)