Author Topic: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review  (Read 9754 times)

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Online EEVblog

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EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« on: August 07, 2014, 11:21:40 am »
Dave reviews the Canon HF G10 Camcorder and compares it with his HF G10 for his blogging purposes.
This is practically an identical video camera to the XA20 and X25 models.
Extended video is here:

 

Offline mariush

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Re: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2014, 01:05:28 pm »
Change the Youtube description, you wrote HF G10 twice.

The wifi remote thing is cool, especially since it's browser based.
Yes, really dirty move with the camera battery. It will be hacked in weeks if it's not already hacked, just hurting genuine consumers.

Sad to see lots of features advertised are somewhat useless (for example recording on second card only at 4mbps or 3mbps).   
 

Offline firewalker

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Re: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2014, 01:22:49 pm »
Did you try to hack the battery already? Maybe just a string in a 24c08 EEPROM?  >:D >:D >:D

Alexander.
Become a realist, stay a dreamer.

 

Offline RyanAMT

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Re: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2014, 01:37:41 pm »
I can shed some light on why the dual record mode option to record a high res file and a low res MP4 is there as well as the goofy FTP thing.  Higher end compact cameras like the G30 are great for video journalists working in remote locations where carrying a large camera kit is not feasible as well as access to good high speed internet might not be available.  So what they do is shoot dual record a high quality and a low quality version that is commonly referred to as a "proxy".  When the shoot is over they pull out their mobile WiFi hotspot or WiFi tether it to their smart phone and upload the low quality proxy version to the FTP server at the production house or news station.  The editors will then begin to cut the story using the proxies in what's known as an "offline edit" and when the reporter returns from the field or is able to transfer the full resolution footage the editor will take full res footage and relink the video files in the editing suite (replacing the proxies with the full res).  The FTP thing just facilitates getting the 4Mbps proxy files to the server without the need for the field crew to pull out a laptop which is sometimes not viable if they are outdoors.

A lot of editors, especially feature film makers, will still do this today as you can speed up the editing process and render dallies and proofs more quickly dealing with low res files.  Once picture and sound "lock" is declared then the full res footage is brought online and the final cut is exported or printed.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2014, 01:41:58 pm by RyanAMT »
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2014, 01:50:49 pm »
 Did you try an old original Canon battery ? i.e have they actually changed the battery, or just started checking an ID?
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Offline bronson

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Re: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2014, 03:52:41 pm »
Are you sure it's actually the same battery specs?

I have a saw that takes what looks to be an identical battery to my drill -- same output voltage but newer and more expensive.  The drill takes the saw's battery, the saw won't use the drill's battery.  Some people called shenanigans when the saw came out.

Naw, just a different battery chemistry that supplies a lot higher peak current.

If it were Sony then yea, it's almost certain to be an asshole maneuver.  But Canon?

That said, if this is indeed a pure customer gouge, I'll be the first to light a torch and march on Tokyo.  Rreally looking forward to the investigation.
 

Offline Dr. Frank

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Re: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2014, 08:33:05 pm »
WHAT??    >:( >:( >:( No complete teardown of the old camera?   :( :( :(

Catch that up immediately, please!

Btw.: On still cameras, Canon often changes the compatibility of the battery pack, also.
One good reason is a better built-in capacity monitoring, for example.
Sooner or later, cheap compatible clones show up on the market.
Don't upset yourself, the clones will be pretty cheap again, compared to the original Canon ones.  :-+

Frank
 

Offline open loop

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Re: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2014, 08:40:12 pm »
If Dave hacked the battery it may have "Mr fusion" written on the back of it.

Great quick review, very different camera to the one I use to use, a sony dx7 with a separate u-matic recorder. We couldn't afford Betacam at the time ;-)
 

Offline RobB

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Re: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« Reply #8 on: August 07, 2014, 09:47:17 pm »
Are you sure it's actually the same battery specs?

I have a saw that takes what looks to be an identical battery to my drill -- same output voltage but newer and more expensive.  The drill takes the saw's battery, the saw won't use the drill's battery.  Some people called shenanigans when the saw came out.

Naw, just a different battery chemistry that supplies a lot higher peak current.

If it were Sony then yea, it's almost certain to be an asshole maneuver.  But Canon?

That said, if this is indeed a pure customer gouge, I'll be the first to light a torch and march on Tokyo.  Rreally looking forward to the investigation.

It really does not matter which brand you choose they all play silly buggers when it comes to new models Canon included.

What really got my goat was the blatent crippling of the software to limit functionality without even covering their tracks. I like to see the best possible configuration for a product as the designer intended rather than what the marketing types want to offer at the particular price point or at least be oblivious of the crippling.
 

Offline dentaku

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Re: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« Reply #9 on: August 07, 2014, 11:40:31 pm »
I hate when things are APPS just so that they can advertise the word APP. Doing it through a browser is a very smart move.

So many things have been made into apps that have no reason to. The web was developed to be universally accessible to anyone on any device not just to people running iOS!
 

Offline Legit-Design

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Re: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« Reply #10 on: August 08, 2014, 01:27:26 am »
Btw.: On still cameras, Canon often changes the compatibility of the battery pack, also.
One good reason is a better built-in capacity monitoring, for example.
Sooner or later, cheap compatible clones show up on the market.
Don't upset yourself, the clones will be pretty cheap again, compared to the original Canon ones.  :-+

Frank
Canon camcorder clone batteries I have don't show how much time is remaining and no indication how much charge is left in the battery. Also on boot camera waits few seconds and then displays message about incompatible battery user has to select ok or cancel and shut down the camera. So yes the clone batteries work but they might be PITA to use since camera might shutdown at any time.
 

Online EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« Reply #11 on: August 08, 2014, 01:40:15 am »
Did you try an old original Canon battery ? i.e have they actually changed the battery, or just started checking an ID?

Yep, tried it, doesn't work. The batteries are obviously chipped with different ID's.
 

Offline zyga

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Re: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« Reply #12 on: August 08, 2014, 04:50:13 pm »
Hey Dave, thanks for the video. It is, as always, very fun to watch.

I'd like to let you know about a problem with the configuration of your web server.

The link: http://www.eevblog.com/podpress_trac/web/3859/0/EEVblog650-CanonHFG30reviewShort-640x360.m4v points to a video file but the web server claims it to be text/html.
Please reconfigure your web server to return appropriate mime information instead. Otherwise anyone that wants to download or watch that movie has to resort to tricks or rely on a non-standard behaviour of the particular browser they may be using.

To replicate the test I did use the following command (you will need an access to a Linux distribution or you will need to find a copy of curl for windows).
There are other tools that can obtain the same information but this one was the easiest for me to use:

$ curl -I http://www.eevblog.com/podpress_trac/web/3859/0/EEVblog650-CanonHFG30reviewShort-640x360.m4v
HTTP/1.1 302 Found
Date: Fri, 08 Aug 2014 16:47:29 GMT
Content-Type: text/html
Connection: keep-alive
Set-Cookie: __cfduid=d164c85e5ab6c0248f359fd3e5b0f6d881407516449334; expires=Mon, 23-Dec-2019 23:50:00 GMT; path=/; domain=.eevblog.com; HttpOnly
X-PodPress-Location: http://www.eevblog.org/video/EEVblog650-CanonHFG30reviewShort-640x360.m4v
Location: http://www.eevblog.org/video/EEVblog650-CanonHFG30reviewShort-640x360.m4v
Server: cloudflare-nginx
CF-RAY: 156d323054870610-LHR


Thanks for your time
Zygmunt
 

Offline Hieronymus

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Re: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2014, 07:25:09 pm »
Hi Dave! Nice review. Could you investigate more about a possible HD-SDI hack? That would be huge.

I do volunteerwork at a technology promotion event for kids. We Always try to boost the production value and started using video (on the cheap, with a Black Magic Television Studio as live mixer) and we rent the camera's. Having SDI available on a camera that is useable for every one, would be rather epic. These HDMI-SDI converters are quite expensive and still leave you with that crappy (mini) HDMI connection. These converters also need power or bateries... Not at all practical in a 'production' environment.

Maybe you can spend an episode on the difference or similarities between HDMI signals and SDI signals. Looking at the BMD television studio I Always wandered how they converted between these in and outputs (it has both SDI and HDMI). The only constraint is that EVERYTHING connected to it should use the same format (1080i50, 720p25, etc). That leaves me wandering why a converter should cost 300 dollar or so.

 

Online EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #650 - Canon HF G30 / XA20 / XA25 Camcorder Review
« Reply #14 on: August 14, 2014, 10:12:49 pm »
The link: http://www.eevblog.com/podpress_trac/web/3859/0/EEVblog650-CanonHFG30reviewShort-640x360.m4v points to a video file but the web server claims it to be text/html.
Please reconfigure your web server to return appropriate mime information instead. Otherwise anyone that wants to download or watch that movie has to resort to tricks or rely on a non-standard behaviour of the particular browser they may be using.

I've been using that same way for 5 years now and can't recall any complaints about that?  :-//
 


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