Author Topic: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering  (Read 28447 times)

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Online EEVblogTopic starter

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EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« on: August 20, 2015, 11:35:06 am »
Dave shows why reflow soldering in a DIY oven can be tricky business for connectors and other parts, particularly ones designed only for through-hole soldering.
Reflowing an existing board (and even new boards) can be fraught with danger.

Phoenix Contact Connectors for SMT Production Through Hole Reflow:
https://www.phoenixcontact.com/local_content_pdf/pdf_eng/52004352_EN_DE_LR.pdf

Lead Free Solder Paste Datasheet:
http://www.aimsolder.com/sites/default/files/nc254_sac305_solder_paste_rev_17_0.pdf

Hirose connector datasheet: http://www.hirose.co.jp/cataloge_hp/en_DF13_20130411.pdf

 

Offline Godzil

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2015, 11:58:26 am »
Oops  >:D

But I'm happy to see that even a not so young player as you can make some mistake like this, I feel as a "young player" much confortable with my own mistakes ;)
« Last Edit: August 20, 2015, 12:10:27 pm by Godzil »
When you make hardware without taking into account the needs of the eventual software developers, you end up with bloated hardware full of pointless excess. From the outset one must consider design from both a hardware and software perspective.
-- Yokoi Gunpei
 

Offline TheAmmoniacal

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2015, 12:06:46 pm »
No 2-row 90 degree pin headers in your lab? Looks like standard pitch.
 

Offline McBryce

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2015, 12:15:18 pm »
Reporting serious under-use of your Fail button.

McBryce.
30 Years making cars more difficult to repair.
 

Offline Fungus

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2015, 12:15:36 pm »
Even a "cheap-ass DIY oven" could have an Arduino-controlled alarm system with a few temperature sensors dotted around.

When the alarm goes off you could open the door and point a fan at the board. It'll cool down real fast.

 

Offline Jfcarrer

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #5 on: August 20, 2015, 12:27:14 pm »
Still better than what this guy did to his graphics card:





 :-DD
 

Offline dmg

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2015, 12:38:35 pm »
Still better than what this guy did to his graphics card:


What the hell happened in there? Did he try to reflow the board in a glass melting oven or something? Source?
 

Offline TheAmmoniacal

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2015, 12:46:40 pm »
Still better than what this guy did to his graphics card:

That guy either left it in for a month or used a kiln!
 

Offline McBryce

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #8 on: August 20, 2015, 01:04:28 pm »
Looks like he left the heatsink attached?

McBryce.
30 Years making cars more difficult to repair.
 

Offline amyk

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #9 on: August 20, 2015, 01:15:40 pm »
:o Probably left it in the oven and forgot about it until the smell got noticed...

I think it's a regular oven (not on cleaning cycle), as anything higher and the plastic would've been burned instead of just melted.

Incidentally there's this recent thread about the same problem, although there the peak was much higher and faster, and burnt the plastic instead of melting it first:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/reflow-oven-burning-part/msg732691/
 

Offline AF6LJ

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #10 on: August 20, 2015, 01:39:23 pm »
Still better than what this guy did to his graphics card:


What the hell happened in there? Did he try to reflow the board in a glass melting oven or something? Source?
It looks like it was hit with blow torch.
Sue AF6LJ
 

Offline Ampere

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #11 on: August 20, 2015, 02:50:17 pm »
Still better than what this guy did to his graphics card:

 :-DD

It looks more like it survived being chucked into his fireplace.

I've never done any reflow soldering, but I think that I'll start off doing it by hand. I don't trust my toaster oven to not bake my PCBs to a crisp like his did.
 

Offline Protonus

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #12 on: August 20, 2015, 03:12:15 pm »
Please don't give up on this TV!  I mentioned in the other thread that I'm working on one with a near identical issue (also a Samsung from '09, this one is a much thicker, 55", without the low profile cuts in the board, etc).  I found bad Sam Young filter caps on the supply board and until I watched your videos was sure that those were the problem (replacements arrive today... I'll know tonight!).  If it's not those caps I'm not sure where I'll go next for the repair ugh!
 

Offline zapta

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #13 on: August 20, 2015, 03:15:40 pm »
Dave, in retrospect, what would you do?  Protect the connectors somehow?  Localized hot air?  Remove the connectors?
 

Offline 6581

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #14 on: August 20, 2015, 03:58:48 pm »
I love the smell of molten plastic in the morning.
 

Offline AF6LJ

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #15 on: August 20, 2015, 04:10:44 pm »
Dave, in retrospect, what would you do?  Protect the connectors somehow?  Localized hot air?  Remove the connectors?
You would desolder them and set them aside.
The only thing you can do if you are going to use a reflow oven.
Sue AF6LJ
 

Online Rasz

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #16 on: August 20, 2015, 04:11:00 pm »
Dave, in retrospect, what would you do?  Protect the connectors somehow?  Localized hot air?  Remove the connectors?

not reflow whole board in the first place, there is only few chips that would need it (bga)
whacking whole thing into the oven is a quick shot from the hip hack, good for troubleshooting, but not exactly by the book :)
Who logs in to gdm? Not I, said the duck.
My fireplace is on fire, but in all the wrong places.
 

Offline SundayProgrammer

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #17 on: August 20, 2015, 07:36:36 pm »
Still better than what this guy did to his graphics card:
clip
 :-DD

It must be burned on purpose...

Axel.
 

Offline AF6LJ

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #18 on: August 20, 2015, 08:48:00 pm »
Still better than what this guy did to his graphics card:
clip
 :-DD

It must be burned on purpose...

Axel.
I have a couple I would like to have done that to....

Oh wait....
There was this cheapo frequency counter I picked up for 5 bucks at the swap meet, I couldn't get it to work reliably so one day in a fit of anger I took a blow torch to it. Never seen so many crispy 74XX series logic chips...
Sue AF6LJ
 

Offline Tothwolf

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #19 on: August 21, 2015, 10:27:09 am »
If you go to look for replacement connectors, check JAE and Foxconn as well. Both Hirose and JAE are very popular in Japanese electronics. Those connectors look somewhat like JAE to me, but hard to tell without really digging into the datasheets.
 

Offline amyk

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #20 on: August 21, 2015, 01:01:11 pm »
If you go to look for replacement connectors, check JAE and Foxconn as well. Both Hirose and JAE are very popular in Japanese electronics. Those connectors look somewhat like JAE to me, but hard to tell without really digging into the datasheets.
JST too, but those look generic enough that I think there'll be matches from several manufacturers.
 

Online EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #21 on: August 21, 2015, 01:35:51 pm »
Dave, in retrospect, what would you do?  Protect the connectors somehow?  Localized hot air?  Remove the connectors?

If I wasn't so gung-ho I would have used a pre-heater on the bottom and then selective hot air on top of suspect chips.
 

Offline coppice

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #22 on: August 21, 2015, 04:37:02 pm »
Dave, in retrospect, what would you do?  Protect the connectors somehow?  Localized hot air?  Remove the connectors?
Put an ice pack on the connectors, of course. :-)
 

Offline senso

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #23 on: August 21, 2015, 09:07:08 pm »
Dave, in retrospect, what would you do?  Protect the connectors somehow?  Localized hot air?  Remove the connectors?

not reflow whole board in the first place, there is only few chips that would need it (bga)
whacking whole thing into the oven is a quick shot from the hip hack, good for troubleshooting, but not exactly by the book :)

Grab one of this babies:
http://www.kurtzersa.com/electronics-production-equipment/rework-inspection-systems/rework-systems/produkt-details/ir-pl-650-1.html

Never melted a single connector be it laptops, desktop, cellphone, any pcb, well just one time when I tried to crank it to 300ºC just to see how the pcb would react having true 300ºC in it.
 

Offline f4eru

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Re: EEVblog #782 - The Dangers Of Reflow Soldering
« Reply #24 on: August 22, 2015, 09:54:10 pm »
Hello,

Also beware of through hole caps !
I once re-reflowed a board like you did to attempt a repair, and the (small) through hole caps i should have removed exploded, peppering the floor of the oven with smd parts and cap remains....


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