Author Topic: How to EEVblog  (Read 18696 times)

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Offline Brumby

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #25 on: November 11, 2016, 06:29:36 am »
Only a fool would record video separately from video and sync it up later. Great for a hollywood movie, useless for anything else. When you make videos regularly then anything that reduces your editing time will keep you from going insane.
yeah, probably youre right.

I guarantee you I'm right!

What Dave said!!

Syncing up a separate audio track is just nuts - especially if you have multiple clips.  Aside from spending a lot of time, you'll go insane before you get half way and be ready to shoot someone (and I don't mean with a camera) before you're finished.

As with ANY photographic exercise - be it still photography or video - aim to do as little post-production work as possible.
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #26 on: November 11, 2016, 07:44:40 am »
If, however, you want to try syncing up an audio track - you'll soon understand why they use these things......
 
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Offline EEVblog

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #27 on: November 11, 2016, 07:45:35 am »
Syncing up a separate audio track is just nuts - especially if you have multiple clips.  Aside from spending a lot of time, you'll go insane before you get half way and be ready to shoot someone (and I don't mean with a camera) before you're finished.

Multiple that by 1000+ videos.

Quote
As with ANY photographic exercise - be it still photography or video - aim to do as little post-production work as possible.

Yep, the only thing I really do in editing is trim the clip start/end, maybe the odd clip volume here and there (just eyeballing based on waveform level. See my screen shot, it's why I have the audio waveform view big), add the odd overlay text or image, and occasionally a tweak or two like a fancy zoom or scroll.
White balance, framing, audio etc etc is done in-camera.

With the audio view I don't even have to listen to the audio, as I can usually remember what I said, and if I see a clip like this I know to simply trim out the first two bits with the pauses because I know they were gibberish. And I never watch the entire video when it's done, I simply trust myself that I've edited it correctly step-by-step (I avoid missing steps and "go back to it later"). Very occasionally an editing error will slip through using this process but it's the reason I'm still doing this after 7 1/2 years and 1000+ videos.


 
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Offline Mafex

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #28 on: November 11, 2016, 02:08:25 pm »
A typical video for me is maybe 50-100 clips.
I prefer to think of something to say and then record a clip of that. It just breaks up the flow and gives your subconscious time to think about what's next.
I usually know kinda what I want to talk about when I hit record, but I usually have no idea exactly what to say when I hit record, I just wing it. So maybe 10% of the time there will be a false start because I what came out didn't make sense. You can see see that on my timeline below, with a small pause on clip 42 for example.

Other golden rule is I shoot everything in sequence, even if I have to change my macro lens 10 times. Makes editing infinitely easier. You'll go nuts otherwise. So I just drag all my clips into the timeline, trim the smart and the end, and delete the occasional dumb clip and that's it.

So you shoot short clips and put them together? till now i thought you would shoot it in a very few clips (like only one per camera) and cut that in smaller clips later. this tip with many short clips and everything in sequence is a extremely useful tip in my opinion and by comparing both techniques (many short clips/few long clips) in mind, the short clips are by far the better opinion! thanks for that! :)

and another question to you, dave: is it okay for you, when i mention videos from you in my clips, with link on screen or in description of course?
 

Offline imidis

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #29 on: November 11, 2016, 08:48:01 pm »
No shaky camera, background music or stupid intro please.

Agree with this. I was browsing some videos and there was a fancy intro with music which then went to a shaky cell phone screen, bad lighting along with horrible audio. I was thinking they may have put their effort in the wrong place. 
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Offline Richard Crowley

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #30 on: November 11, 2016, 08:56:35 pm »
BigClive shoots on an iPad with the built in microphone and both video and audio quality are fine.
Really?! Well that just goes to show. If you work within the limitations of your equipment you can entertain and educate effectively.
He probably uses additional lighting.
The internal microphone works because it is probably less than 12 inches from his mouth in his normal configuration and he has a strong voice.
He certainly uses additional lighting and quite often you can see him changing or adjusting and/or commenting on the lighting in the video.
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #31 on: November 11, 2016, 10:45:40 pm »
The internal microphone works because it is probably less than 12 inches from his mouth in his normal configuration and he has a strong voice.
He certainly uses additional lighting and quite often you can see him changing or adjusting and/or commenting on the lighting in the video.

For camera phone/tablet etc to give decent quality video indoors like this you'd need 500W-1000W of direct studio lighting.
Normal indoor lighting, regardless of how much you have, is "low light", and even my proper $$$$ cameras are limited in this level of lighting.
Even with my studio ceiling LED lights all on and 1000lux on the bench, it's still not enough to get noise free images with a large depth of field (that you need for teardowns etc) with a camera that has a DSLR APS-C sized sensor.
Thsoe that do boast about how wonderful their DSLR is a ta shooting videos indoor are using shallow depth of field.
 
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Offline ez24

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #32 on: November 12, 2016, 02:56:26 am »
what about not recording the sound directly to the video, i own a pretty good sound recorder and a nice mic. so i could just clap in the viewing range of the camera, to line up the sound of the clap to the movement of the clap later on..

I did this once and it worked well.  I used a dog clicker for endings (cuts) and I could see the audio peaks from the clicker in the editor.  I just held it off camera, so when I wanted to stop I would click then turn off the video. 
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Offline EEVblog

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #33 on: November 12, 2016, 03:03:45 am »
So you shoot short clips and put them together?

Yes, rarely does a video have less than say 50 clips.

Quote
many short clips/few long clips) in mind, the short clips are by far the better opinion! thanks for that! :)

I think short clips leads to less waffe. I could shoot a single take video if I really wanted (and I used to do this right at the start), but I like being able to give my mind a few 10's of seconds pause to decide what to talk about next.

Quote
and another question to you, dave: is it okay for you, when i mention videos from you in my clips, with link on screen or in description of course?

Sure.
 
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Offline amirm

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #34 on: November 12, 2016, 05:34:33 am »
what about not recording the sound directly to the video, i own a pretty good sound recorder and a nice mic. so i could just clap in the viewing range of the camera, to line up the sound of the clap to the movement of the clap later on..
Hopefully you have been dissuaded of this idea already.  But just in case :), if the clock between the audio recorder and video are not sync'ed (which won't be in the scenario you describe) they would start to drift from each other and you quickly lose lip sync.  Software can resample the audio to stretch or compress it but then you have to spend time doing that processing.  Best to use the audio in the camcorder if at all possible.
 
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Offline Mafex

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #35 on: November 12, 2016, 03:59:04 pm »
Hopefully you have been dissuaded of this idea already.  But just in case :), if the clock between the audio recorder and video are not sync'ed (which won't be in the scenario you describe) they would start to drift from each other and you quickly lose lip sync.  Software can resample the audio to stretch or compress it but then you have to spend time doing that processing.  Best to use the audio in the camcorder if at all possible.
yeah, this idea is crap for my purpose, but i dont think the clock drift would be big enough to bring the footages out of sync noticably..
 

Offline Richard Crowley

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #36 on: November 12, 2016, 04:13:33 pm »
what about not recording the sound directly to the video, i own a pretty good sound recorder and a nice mic. so i could just clap in the viewing range of the camera, to line up the sound of the clap to the movement of the clap later on..
Yes, if you were doing a feature film with a separate sound crew and a big budget to cover an editor's assistant to sync all the audio tracks with the video clips.
Otherwise, for something like "video blogging" on YouTube, there is ZERO benefit and MASSIVE downside to recording "double-system" (separate picture and sound). You can find video cameras with proper microphone inputs at very sensible prices. And even cheap cameras will produce remarkably good pictures if you give them GOOD lighting. NOT just average/typical light you find in a room.

Over on a couple of audio and production-related forums I also frequent (CreativeCOW, GearSlutz, DVinfo, DVXuser, etc.) we have rank amateurs coming through with the notion that they have to spend $3K on a large-diaphragm condenser mic with a big articulated arm and a silly pop filter, followed by 4-5 rack units full of audio processing gear, none of which they actually need, much less even understand what they do.  And trying to get studio quality sound in their untreated garage with major highway noise coming through the window and an interior like an echo chamber with none of the reflections handled.  Some dilettante out there has made a YouTube video selling people on needing an enormous stack of expensive audio gear when a $5 clip-on "computer mic" would probably perform as well (or better).   :palm:

As far as video/audio sync, apparently @Mafex has no experience in the industry. For 100 years (and even to this day) high-end production gear (both film and video) uses genlock to sync camera and audio recorder together. Else you are relying on the accuracy of the little 89 cent crystals in the camera and in the audio recorder to be accurate and track with temperature.  To be sure, modern consumer gear has gotten much better as materials and manufacturing quality of even the cheapest commodity crystals has improved over time.  To the point where you can probably depend on going for at least 10 minutes without slipping out of sync for more than a few frames. And that kind of sync is perfectly adequate for casual videos on YouTube. But it would get you thrown out of a film festival.
 
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Offline Mafex

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #37 on: November 12, 2016, 06:25:16 pm »
how much should i spend on lighting and what should i use? maybe DC stuff to get rid of that flicker? what should i do to improve the sound experience even with cheap mics? absorber mats maybe?
 

Offline Richard Crowley

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #38 on: November 12, 2016, 07:01:32 pm »
Lighting (fluorescent or LED) that uses switch-mode power supply (SMPS) runs at a high frequency and won't cause flicker.  And, as you have observed, lighting powered with DC will not flicker, either.  I found some surplus white LED panels (used for illuminating large outdoor signs) which are great for video lighting.

The closer you can get your microphone to your mouth, the less influence you will get from ambient noise and room acoustic flaws.  Headset (or "earset") microphones will hold the mic just a few mm from your mouth.  Something like this costs US$15...


https://www.amazon.com/Pyle-Pro-PMEM1-Headworn-Omni-Directional-Microphone/dp/B003D2S7HA
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #39 on: November 13, 2016, 01:14:37 am »
The closer you can get your microphone to your mouth, the less influence you will get from ambient noise and room acoustic flaws.  Headset (or "earset") microphones will hold the mic just a few mm from your mouth.  Something like this costs US$15...


https://www.amazon.com/Pyle-Pro-PMEM1-Headworn-Omni-Directional-Microphone/dp/B003D2S7HA

+1 for the headset/ear microphone approach.  Whether wired or wireless, they ensure the microphone maintains a consistent position with respect to your mouth - so you don't have to worry about losing commentary when you turn your head.  Using a fixed microphone properly requires a continuous awareness of exactly where the microphone is.

Wired is cheap and you can get more for your money with less hassles than wireless - so long as being tied to one spot isn't a problem for you.
 

Offline vk3yedotcom

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #40 on: November 13, 2016, 04:10:15 am »
Also it's amazing how small change in mic position relative to your mouth can significantly change voice characteristics - and it's not just loudness.   Bass components of your voice propagate differently to treble so if you move the mic around the sound changes.   Even if you're using a lapel mic as in my first link in the previous page.  At the start I'm slightly overdriving and the bass is a bit boomy.  You don't want popping Ps and hissing Ssss but a bit of brightness cuts muffle and improves intelligibility.  There's a bit less overdriving at 3:10 but it lacks highs.  Whereas a slightly different position at 3:20 gives more highs.  Something that's a constant position should greatly lessen these variations.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2016, 04:22:47 am by vk3yedotcom »
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Offline Mafex

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #41 on: November 13, 2016, 11:40:57 am »
You don't want popping Ps and hissing Ssss but a bit of brightness cuts muffle and improves intelligibility.

what should i do, to avoid that popping hint hissing?
and i didnt find a link to a microphone from you on the first side..  :-\
 

Offline Richard Crowley

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #42 on: November 13, 2016, 02:56:27 pm »
To prevent plosive sounds (P-popping) from hitting the microphone, you prevent the very low-frequency sound wave away from the mic. You can do this with:
  • DISTANCE. Simply move the mic "out of range" of the low-frequency blast zone.  However this has the disadvantage of also making the sound more distant and opening yourself up to picking up ambient noise and undesirable acoustics.
  • FILTERING. Some microphones (and some microphone preamps) have low-frequency cut switches to roll off low frequencies which are not useful for speech pickup.  However severe cases will cause distortion INSIDE the microphone BEFORE you reach any low-frequency cut filtering.
  • POSITION. You can simply move the microphone "off-axis" so that it is not in direct line with the sound out of your mouth. When done properly, this will not affect the higher frequencies (which contribute to speech intelligibility), but it will move the microphone out of the "blast zone".  A headset mic is particularly useful because it positions the sensitive mic capsule to the SIDE of the mouth and out of the "blast zone".

If your microphone is picking up excessive ssss hissing, you can typically use notch filters and/or high-frequency rolloff to remove the offending frequencies from the audio signal.  However the same kind of positioning to the side of the mouth from #3 above is also useful for reducing ssss hissing.
 
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Offline Brumby

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #43 on: November 14, 2016, 02:40:55 am »
What Richard said.

My order of priority would be:
1. Position - Keep the mic close - but out of the 'blast zone'.  I would try to sort out the problem using this alone, if at all possible.

2. Distance - If you can't avoid the 'blast zone', they add distance bit by bit until you're OK.  You don't want to get too far away or you'll start having other problems, as Richard has said.

3. Filtering - For me, a last ditch course of action for dealing with 'blast zone' problems.  The simple mechanical overload can, in itself, create distortion - and filtering won't be able to clean that up.  Better to avoid it altogether, but if you have to deal with it this way, then try the above techniques first to minimise how much work the filtering has to do.

There is another argument where filtering may be necessary - and that is if the low end is still too strong and can result in a booming sound or overload of other elements down the audio chain.  This would normally be part of the EQ process on any half-decent mixing desk or audio software.  Just remember, that if you do find this problem, the earlier in the audio chain it is dealt with, the better.
 

Offline IanB

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #44 on: November 14, 2016, 03:22:33 am »
Here's an example of a simple speaking to camera with a clip-on microphone. The sound seems pretty clear to me. Possibly there is a bit of sibilance, but that might just be accurate reproduction. Sometimes you don't want excessive accuracy.

https://youtu.be/Aa_ro7osD_o
I'm not an EE--what am I doing here?
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #45 on: November 14, 2016, 03:35:48 am »
I just screen captured my video editing process, so will upload that soon.
 
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Offline Fungus

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #46 on: November 14, 2016, 04:10:39 pm »
You don't want popping Ps and hissing Ssss but a bit of brightness cuts muffle and improves intelligibility.
what should i do, to avoid that popping hint hissing?

Don't put the microphone in front of your mouth.
 

Offline ez24

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #47 on: November 14, 2016, 09:10:48 pm »

.... See my screen shot, it's why I have the audio waveform view big....
If you want to find a place in the video, a dog clicker will put a spike in the audio waveform and it is very easy to see (it has a very sharp spike).  You would not have to find pauses or watch the video to find the editing spots.  It can be held off screen and it puts a marker in the video that is easy to find by using the audio waveform.  Best tool I came across.

this is what I use:
https://www.amazon.com/Gmilk-Clicker-training-click-train/dp/B00Q86R47W/ref=sr_1_17?s=pet-supplies&ie=UTF8&qid=1479157722&sr=1-17&keywords=dog+clicker

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Offline Fungus

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #48 on: November 14, 2016, 09:19:12 pm »
If you want to find a place in the video, a dog clicker will put a spike in the audio waveform and it is very easy to see (it has a very sharp spike).

It can be held off screen and it puts a marker in the video that is easy to find by using the audio waveform.

Isn't it best to see something on screen and have a spike in the audio waveform - so you can line the two things up in the editor?  :-//
 

Offline ez24

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Re: How to EEVblog
« Reply #49 on: November 14, 2016, 09:26:42 pm »
Isn't it best to see something on screen and have a spike in the audio waveform - so you can line the two things up in the editor?  :-//

For me no, the spike occurs where I want and it is very visible, much more than anything in the video.  I never came across a sync problem.  So I never look at the video to find the spot I am looking for.  I may have to move a few frames to cut out the spike and may "watch" the video to fine tune it.
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