In light of some of the more "Click Bait" video titles....

[EEVblog]

As I said - in my case it's just personal taste  and I was not accusing you of clickbait - that was the OP.
I also understand that you do it because on average it probably attracts more views than it repels.  If I didn't already know that your content was mostly very good, it would in my case,  lead me to avoid your videos.   I'm just voicing my view as one of your subscribers and Patreon supporters. Is that not allowed?

I was just using your post as a general talking point.
I would not engage you or anyone else if it "was not allowed".
I like to think I'm one of the most engaging youtubers out there who goes to a lot of effort to listen and also goes to a lot of effort to try to explain how and why I do things when questioned.

And BTW - I didn't mean to imply that you never did it in the past - only that it has now seems to be very frequent.

I'm less lazy now and spend more time on thumbnails, even to the point of often setting up a deliberate bench shot just for that. Or at least thinking about that when shooting the video.
Before I simply chose a thumbnail from the time, or more often than not just ran with one of the three choices Youtube gives.

[EEVblog]

That's because it makes the thumbnail standout from the noise when a user scrolls through their YouTube feed. The problem comes when *everyone* starts adding bright colors and big fonts to their thumbnails. When that happens it loses effectiveness and becomes noise again.
So then you'll have to start adding boobs to the thumbnail, to make it standout. Before you know it, all YouTube thumbnails will be filled with 72pt neon fonts and hardcore pornography. It's a slippery slope man, a slippery slope. *Shakes head.*

Yeah I'm doing it all the time, I should stop that

[timb]

That's because it makes the thumbnail standout from the noise when a user scrolls through their YouTube feed. The problem comes when *everyone* starts adding bright colors and big fonts to their thumbnails. When that happens it loses effectiveness and becomes noise again.
So then you'll have to start adding boobs to the thumbnail, to make it standout. Before you know it, all YouTube thumbnails will be filled with 72pt neon fonts and hardcore pornography. It's a slippery slope man, a slippery slope. *Shakes head.*

Yeah I'm doing it all the time, I should stop that

Needs more tits IMO. XD

[Brumby]

There you go.   

[MK14]

There you go.   

You are RIGHT!
I think many men are click Baited, when the video thumbnail, shows "birds". (Chicks in US slang, I think).
https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/118736/is-it-offensive-to-refer-to-someone-as-a-bird

[vinicius.jlantunes]

Personally, I find the use of large font bright color titles splashed across the screen distasteful. I associate that with clickbait and low quality content.  I've been dissappointed to see Dave adopt it since, in general, I don't think his content falls into that category. Just my view of course.

Any Youtuber content producer with half a brain knows that the thumbnail makes a HUGE difference to the number of views, often double or more.
They also know that big bright bold colours work and help attract people's attention in search results, hence the common green or yellow text and big font.

That's because it makes the thumbnail standout from the noise when a user scrolls through their YouTube feed. The problem comes when *everyone* starts adding bright colors and big fonts to their thumbnails. When that happens it loses effectiveness and becomes noise again.

So then you'll have to start adding boobs to the thumbnail, to make it standout. Before you know it, all YouTube thumbnails will be filled with 72pt neon fonts and hardcore pornography. It's a slippery slope man, a slippery slope. *Shakes head.*

@timb, don't worry, the trend loops around: https://xkcd.com/993/

[sietseage@ziggo.nl]

(Sorry Dave, but someone needs to call you out on a few of your recent video titles - just say what it's about!  For the love of Pete!)

I found this!  It's a "Linkbait Title Generator" - And the results are funny enough I thought even Dave might get a kick out of them.

http://www.contentrow.com/tools/link-bait-title-generator

8 unbelievable things you never knew about the eevblog
the most boring article about the eevblog you'll ever read
the rise of the eevblog and how to make it stop
the most incredible article about the eevblog you'll ever read
the eevblog die/s every minute you don't read this article
13 amazing facts about the eevblog
why you should give up sex and devote your life to the eevblog
the connection between the eevblog and sex
6 reasons to be addicted to the eevblog
12 reasons the eevblog is/are the end of the world as we know it
why you should forget everything you learned about the eevblog
10 ways the eevblog can suck the life out of you
9 reasons you can blame the recession on the eevblog
why the eevblog suck/s
8 deadly uses for the eevblog
7 things lady gaga has in common with the eevblog
guns don't kill people -- the eevblog kills people
10 ways marketers are making you addicted to the eevblog
8 things the media hasn't told you about the eevblog
101 unusual uses of the eevblog
11 ways investing in the eevblog can make you a millionaire
why the eevblog is/are destroying america
10 ways the eevblog can help you live to 100
what the government doesn't want you to know about the eevblog
8 reasons the eevblog will change the way you think about everything

[emoji99] [emoji112] [emoji107]

Verstuurd vanaf mijn SM-N910F met Tapatalk

[sietseage@ziggo.nl]

(Sorry Dave, but someone needs to call you out on a few of your recent video titles - just say what it's about!  For the love of Pete!)

I found this!  It's a "Linkbait Title Generator" - And the results are funny enough I thought even Dave might get a kick out of them.

http://www.contentrow.com/tools/link-bait-title-generator

8 unbelievable things you never knew about the eevblog
the most boring article about the eevblog you'll ever read
the rise of the eevblog and how to make it stop
the most incredible article about the eevblog you'll ever read
the eevblog die/s every minute you don't read this article
13 amazing facts about the eevblog
why you should give up sex and devote your life to the eevblog
the connection between the eevblog and sex
6 reasons to be addicted to the eevblog
12 reasons the eevblog is/are the end of the world as we know it
why you should forget everything you learned about the eevblog
10 ways the eevblog can suck the life out of you
9 reasons you can blame the recession on the eevblog
why the eevblog suck/s
8 deadly uses for the eevblog
7 things lady gaga has in common with the eevblog
guns don't kill people -- the eevblog kills people
10 ways marketers are making you addicted to the eevblog
8 things the media hasn't told you about the eevblog
101 unusual uses of the eevblog
11 ways investing in the eevblog can make you a millionaire
why the eevblog is/are destroying america
10 ways the eevblog can help you live to 100
what the government doesn't want you to know about the eevblog
8 reasons the eevblog will change the way you think about everything

[emoji99] [emoji112] [emoji107]

Verstuurd vanaf mijn SM-N910F met Tapatalk

Hé is a fool  thums  up for dave

Verstuurd vanaf mijn SM-N910F met Tapatalk

[james_s]

LOL! My other half might accuse me of that already.

"why you should give up sex and devote your life to the eevblog"

[steverino]

LOL! My other half might accuse me of that already.

"why you should give up sex and devote your life to the eevblog"

Congratulations!  You are a bonafide nerd!

[lacek]

Good keyword/title selection is a must these days, and while EEVBlog titles are slightly optimized, this is done within reason. "near-death multimeter experience" is a good example - it has the "shocking" spirit, but at the same time it reflects the content of that material. So its honest.

Dave, with so many psychofans I would lock the door

[brainwash]

As vinicius.jlantunes tells above, it's just a trend, it will go away, only to be replaced with something worse.
Most (90%) of my friends click first the titles with boobs, "fail" or click-bait caps on YouTube. The red overlay is just 'gilding the lilly'.
Really, there is a strong line between doing this for a hobby and for a living. Before you think that you are above this, think about all the stupid compliance documents you have to write every day at work - same thing. Everyone would wish to be above that, but you rarely can.
Also, the voice of majority is what really matters. See all the developments: Trump, Brexit, ... Being able to judge for yourself is a fringe skill, that's why [failed] crowdfunding is so successful. Just to close the circle on the recent solar panels development...
Trying to say: don't worry about the titles and thumbnails so much, think about the content. IMHO the content quality mostly went up.

[brainwash]

Also, viewership engagement is a direct measure of knowledge. That's why less involved channels like ElectroBoom and AvE have a lot more subscribers, but that's the reason they also have to resort to 'giveaway to patreons' and similar stuff. On the other hand, you have TheSignalPath, w2aew and Robrenz (and many others) that have an almost insignificant subscriber count. Their approach requires knowledgeable people looking to expand on it.

Highly generalizing, but for example I would rather watch a guy that teaches me how to play piano fast and cool, rather someone that goes through all the fingerings. We can all relate to instant gratification.

As a side-note, I like the approach that Clickspring has taken: all high-quality videos available, newest stuff only for Patreons. No begging, no strong suggestions, no artificial limits. Not implying anything here, EEVBlog does not fall under that category. But a lot of other youtubers do depend on the video income. At some point, both YouTube and Patreon will dry out, the first one has started already, this will force content creators to seek new sources. wonder how that will go. Hopefully not the way of commercial TV...

[EEVblog]

At some point, both YouTube and Patreon will dry out

If anyone thinks Youtube is dying out, they are wrong. Both in terms of being the video platform, and the place that advertisers want to spend their money.
The whole adpocolypse will die out, advertisers will come to their senses.
But any Youtuber who relies on either for their only income is at extremely high risk, especially the smaller channels who are just scraping by.

[brainwash]

Not DIE but DRY, it's a bit different. Video platforms are here to stay and they will replace traditional media. I quit watching TV 10 years ago and don't regret it. However, as advertisers become more conscientious with their 'social advertisement' spending, the revenue will decrease on average for most youtubers. Targeted advertisement is always getting stronger as a platform defines is direction.
EEVBlog is fine in that direction, is the 'undefined' video makers that are at risk.

Anecdotal story: one of my acquaintances has a furniture saleship. He has received an offer (application) for a full-time position for a facebook 'platform manager'. The supposed employee proposed to increase the subscribers and 'likes' count. This would be fine, if it ever increased the real sales ('conversion'). This however never translated into sales or even showroom visits.

Again, not arguing with the social media impact, it works, across most of the consumer/prosumer spectrum. Just saying that, blindly applying social media to anything, does not work, for now. However, the future is very near. Fidget spinners are a thing now, as were powerballs 7 years ago.

[thm_w]

Also, viewership engagement is a direct measure of knowledge. That's why less involved channels like ElectroBoom and AvE have a lot more subscribers, but that's the reason they also have to resort to 'giveaway to patreons' and similar stuff. On the other hand, you have TheSignalPath, w2aew and Robrenz (and many others) that have an almost insignificant subscriber count. Their approach requires knowledgeable people looking to expand on it.

Highly generalizing, but for example I would rather watch a guy that teaches me how to play piano fast and cool, rather someone that goes through all the fingerings. We can all relate to instant gratification.

As a side-note, I like the approach that Clickspring has taken: all high-quality videos available, newest stuff only for Patreons. No begging, no strong suggestions, no artificial limits. Not implying anything here, EEVBlog does not fall under that category. But a lot of other youtubers do depend on the video income. At some point, both YouTube and Patreon will dry out, the first one has started already, this will force content creators to seek new sources. wonder how that will go. Hopefully not the way of commercial TV...

Patreon dry out? That is a bit of a wild statement, maybe you can explain why you think people will stop donating. If the person is producing content their audience enjoys it, the donations will continue to come in.
You can find examples of Patreon-ish groups that had the same idea, before patreon was a thing, and they've been running for 10+ years now.

I don't think AvE has to resort to giving anything away, plus the stuff he gives away is not worth much. He is just ridiculously popular in general. But for sure, random giveaways do increase popularity.

[P90]

I don't think AvE has to resort to giving anything away, plus the stuff he gives away is not worth much. He is just ridiculously popular in general. But for sure, random giveaways do increase popularity.

...ridiculously popular and extremely obnoxious!

[brainwash]

Sorry, I think my posts have been taken too literally.
Before Patreon there was PayPal. Without significant data I assume, from a subscriber base, more have switched to the former. People think they are getting more for their money with Patreon.
Before YouTube Red there was plain YouTube. Take a guess why the content producers on 'plain' YouTube are earning less.
All advertisement revenue works in cycles. Historically, an average platform content producer (music, TV, newspaper, internet) earned less per content viewer, as the platform matured and competition stiffened up.
Patreon is still an outlier, but as soon as corporate marketing comes into play and 'packages' are introduced, as well as competition arrives, people will decide more carefully where their money is spent. Or they will just go for a package that promises '20%+ savings' and 'fair share'.

Sorry, I may have been in this marketing whirlwind to understand that I'm making a wrong prediction. But at least I know, that in the end, people will always choose cost saving if they are promised better value. The packaged deals work as well, or even better, than bold thumbnail titles. That was the point I was trying to make. Corporations love packages as much as they love swallowing smaller businesses.


PS: regarding AvE, I was under the impression that all the promising projects are under the Patreon paywall. Like the EDM machine. ElectroBoom has the expensive giveaways only to patreons. TSP did something similar and was quite scolded. On the other side, there are always people that buy something from Amazon just for the vacation, only to return it used and in a terrible condition. The same with some viewers, they always demand more for their 'money'.

[thm_w]

Sorry, I think my posts have been taken too literally.
Before Patreon there was PayPal. Without significant data I assume, from a subscriber base, more have switched to the former. People think they are getting more for their money with Patreon.
Before YouTube Red there was plain YouTube. Take a guess why the content producers on 'plain' YouTube are earning less.
All advertisement revenue works in cycles. Historically, an average platform content producer (music, TV, newspaper, internet) earned less per content viewer, as the platform matured and competition stiffened up.
Patreon is still an outlier, but as soon as corporate marketing comes into play and 'packages' are introduced, as well as competition arrives, people will decide more carefully where their money is spent. Or they will just go for a package that promises '20%+ savings' and 'fair share'.

Sorry, I may have been in this marketing whirlwind to understand that I'm making a wrong prediction. But at least I know, that in the end, people will always choose cost saving if they are promised better value. The packaged deals work as well, or even better, than bold thumbnail titles. That was the point I was trying to make. Corporations love packages as much as they love swallowing smaller businesses.


PS: regarding AvE, I was under the impression that all the promising projects are under the Patreon paywall. Like the EDM machine. ElectroBoom has the expensive giveaways only to patreons. TSP did something similar and was quite scolded. On the other side, there are always people that buy something from Amazon just for the vacation, only to return it used and in a terrible condition. The same with some viewers, they always demand more for their 'money'.

I'm not going to disagree with your youtube comments, don't know enough about it.
But it feels like you are missing some of the point of patreon, I am pledging $1 per video, because I wan't the content creator to get $1 per video. If it was done via paypal or patreon, it doesn't matter to the creator (although patreon is more convenient). There won't be any "20% off" deal with patreon, because I chose to give $1 not 80c.

Right now, any sort of patreon exclusive content I get is quite minimal, and not polished. Most of the people I pledge to don't do anything special on there. But I can see if you think people will start to paywall more of their content. Its certainly possible, with the risk that their popularity will decrease.

For AvE, I don't think there is much content on his Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/AvE/posts
"There’s more! If you become a patron to AvE, you’ll immediately get access to as many as 14 patron-only posts."

[brainwash]

I applaud any things similar to patreon that allows the viewers to directly funnel their money to the creators.
Paywalling might win in the end, or might not, if I were to bet, I would say it wouldn't. I would say it depends on whether you are addressing your own community (always a win) versus a general public (my point in the posts above).

Not sure about AvE, was just an example, but through him I found more enjoyable channels. And perhaps that's the power of YouTube. The new word is now 'influencer'.

Regarding money, there are certainly more lucrative deals, like Twitch or the other site where people donate money live. But I think that other one is triple-x rated. So patreon is a breath of fresh air, I wish it would stay this way.
I don't think, apart from YouTube, there is any other high-quality video content site available. Counting TV as well, but on the opposing side.

Regarding 1$ per video - that is fine, as long as you are supporting 10-25 channels. My 'package' and 'competition' forecast does not come into play at that point. Nor at the point where the most prolific supporters are earning 1st-world money.

[Brumby]

What irritates me is that Patreon charge in USD - so every $1 pledged will hit you up for $1.35 AUD (or thereabouts, depending on the exchange rate.  But what ticks me off is that I get charged a foreign currency conversion fee - to support Dave who is only 2 suburbs away from me!

It's not a lot - but it's the principle of the thing.

[thm_w]

Don't Patreon take a cut of the donations? I wouldn't give them too much applause because they are just another business making a buck.

Sure they are just another business, but they are getting more money into the creators pockets. Their fee is very reasonable:
5% patreon fee + CC processing fee + $3-20 payout fee.

This is less than you would pay selling on Ebay (10%), youtube (45%), or getting a subscription on Twitch (50% cut).

[gudenau]

I just read all of this, I kind of assumed people who made accounts here would know some basic psychology. Oh well, shame on me. I don't mind the thumbnails or titles, they are always related and often have funny little jokes.

Keep up the good work Dave. I subscribed to you because you where making videos with content I found valuable, it was a nice bonus that you're funny.👍