Mailbag - reading the letters or not

[Tooms]

Hi

seems that there is some there dont like the mailbag style where Dave open one packages at the time and reading the letters and Dave is talking about giving in and change it.

I like the style as it is, where Dave open the packages and read the letters as i think that the letters is as much a part of it as the packages because it is telling the story of why someone has sent this item and their history about eletronics.

[LEECH666]

I agree. The letter belongs to the package. But I voted for the third option: Dave is in control of this!

[mariush]

Well, I would like to see what people write, but I don't care to have the letter dictated to me, especially when dave's not good with speaking/messing up  people's names or the name of various towns. 

To some people, it may even be a bit offensive that Dave can't spend a few seconds to look up on Wikipedia or something how a town's name or the guy/girl's name is spoken. 

A good compromise imho would be to keep the letter on the screen for something like 5 seconds so if people want to read it, they could pause the video and read.... or Dave could just read the letter before then cut the reading in editing and just repeat the most important segments/paragraphs from the letter in those 5-10 seconds when the letter is shown.

(going a bit on a tangent)

And honestly, some of the last videos with the mail sucked. The initial idea was fine.. have people send stuff and Dave shows them and so on... but go back to the latest videos and the point is almost completely gone. Why would people send kits or their personal projects for example, if Dave can't be bothered to build them and show them? Why would they send stuff if Dave opens the packages 4-6 months later...

Some people may actually spend quite a lot of money (for how much they earn) to ship what they built to Australia ... shipping stuff across continents isn't cheap... and then what they send is just rushed over. It may be a kit they put their heart into and Dave says as usual that he may put it together but never happens, or just reads the letter and he's done with it.

Right now, it seems to me that this type of video is considered by Dave like a chore, something to go through quickly and be done with.  You can see it in every video where he shows the stack of packages and how he talks about it.
Yeah, I understand he was sick, I understand that he wants to spend time with his family and the kid but still...

[dr.diesel]

I like to see what people spend the time to send, for the most part.  Interesting hardware is interesting and might have a good story to go along.  I suppose the letters could be skimmed by Dave and highlighted to speed the process up and keep up-2-date.

To be honest - I don't care much for the Postcards.

[alm]

Some people may actually spend quite a lot of money (for how much they earn) to ship what they built to Australia ... shipping stuff across continents isn't cheap... and then what they send is just rushed over. It may be a kit they put their heart into and Dave says as usual that he may put it together but never happens, or just reads the letter and he's done with it.

I agree. But the problem is both that Dave often rushes through items that deserve more attention, and that the delay is way too long. The wedding request thing was particularly embarrassing. Should he go through the mail first and select the most interesting ones? Should he reduce the volume of incoming mail somehow?

Is the current incoming volume at least low enough to keep up? If so, then he could consider continuing with the recent arrivals, and only spend one or two video showing highlights from the packages from the past months. Many people will probably have given up hope by now anyhow.

I feel that at this point people should probably send suitable items to someone like Connor Wolf (does a good job on teardowns), Martin Lorton or Mike (assuming Mike has time and wants people to send him random stuff). They will be able to spend more time on the item, and you actually might get to see it in within a few months .

[Stonent]

I like mailbag just the way it is.

I'd also be down for some user submitted teardowns for Mike as well if he was up to it. They have different perspectives and I appreciate the different styles. I don't really see Dave buying a second hand airport xray machine and spending a few weeks hacking on it. I'm not saying he wouldn't but just doesn't seem like he'd hold on to something that big for that long.

I don't know why but I almost imagine Mike going out of town for a few days and then do a teardown on a North Korean missile guidance system when he came back.

[Corporate666]

A good compromise imho would be to keep the letter on the screen for something like 5 seconds so if people want to read it, they could pause the video and read.... or Dave could just read the letter before then cut the reading in editing and just repeat the most important segments/paragraphs from the letter in those 5-10 seconds when the letter is shown.

I think that is a great idea.  Dave always says Mailbag Monday is the most popular "bit" he does, but dictating someone's letter about how they work in such and such and always liked such and such - I am sure it's great for Dave to hear the stories but IMHO it doesn't make for great content.  The stuff itself is the content, so it would be a great way to get more content in if he shows the letter for a few seconds and then dug into the package.

Another inevitable result will be that some day Dave will need to make it known that only a portion of the received items will make it onto Mailbag... all TV shows end up doing this.  That would allow him to pick and choose the most interesting content, but also cut down on the # of people sending him stuff for possibly selfish reasons (like the guy who wanted his IGG project featured so he could get more $$$). 

[David_AVD]

Personally I find the full letter reading a bit dull so I try to skip over those bits.

That said I voted "Don't care Dave's in control" as it's his choice ultimately.

[EEVblog]

I cannot open the packages before hand to find out what's in them, and what is worthwhile opening when etc, that would ruin the whole idea of the surprise opening.
And what if I think it's lame and a waste of time (and others would agree), but some poor kid spent his time and money on it and though it would be cool to see it on my channel.
At least I will open everyone's mail, eventually.
Sometimes I just don't have the time to do these videos, it's a simple fact, just like all the others bloggers get behind on stuff, no one is immune to this.
Show me a blogger who's not behind on videos they want to do, and I'll show you a liar 

But the problem is both that Dave often rushes through items that deserve more attention

According to whom? That is the biggest trap of all time. Don't think that your own interest in something speaks for those of others.
In the end, I can only go more in depth into the stuff that I find interesting, or have the time to do etc.

I don't really see Dave buying a second hand airport xray machine and spending a few weeks hacking on it. I'm not saying he wouldn't but just doesn't seem like he'd hold on to something that big for that long.

Why do people try and compare different bloggers?
I'm a family guy who mostly works 8 hours a day, 4 days a week in the lab. Mike is a single guy who has the luxury of living and working at home at any hour he pleases.
I physically couldn't bring something like that home, it would literally be impossible.
Here is one example I'd love to do:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Automatic-teller-machine-ATM-ex-bendigo-bank-brookvale-NCR-Brand-with-keys-/271261862389
Please tell me how I'd get a 500kg machine back to home or the lab, and how I would dispose of it when done?
Take Martin for example in his recent video. He was doing close to one video a day, but has now said it was consuming his life and he will be cutting that back to 2 videos a week now to spend time with his family. Good on him 

[Stonent]

Why do people try and compare different bloggers?

Because people compare things? DaVinci gets compared to Michelangelo. So what?

I'm subscribed to both of your channels and I watch both of your videos. I also watch Martin's videos.

I like your tear downs and I like Mikes as well. Mike seems to end up with a lot of strange stuff. I know he's single and you're not.  It wasn't meant as a slight against you.  There's a few items like the MP3 Player DSO that you both tore down and I liked watching both takes on the same device.

You do this for a living, and Mike does it more for fun. This is your personal income and Mike has his own business.

In fact if you and Mike only tore town the same exact items, I'd happily watch both videos.

I also watch Ashens on youtube. He buys crap at dollar stores and reviews it, smashes it, burns it or keeps it. And there's even times where I wish he'd take something apart, but he doesn't because that's not his thing.

I say keep reading the letters. It adds a personal touch.  I like the "Hi to all my viewers in %country%"

If people say your videos are too slow and they are getting distracted, maybe they should take an Adderall.   

[c4757p]

If people say your videos are too slow and they are getting distracted, maybe they should take an Adderall.   

QFT. God, people need to quit bitching about their free entertainment....

And yeah, I'll compare different bloggers too. I like Dave's instructional videos. Mike's teardowns are often more comprehensive and tend to be more about things in which I am interested. Dave's rants are funnier. Mike's jokes are funnier. Dave's videos are more regular. Mike is more brief. Dave interacts with viewers more.

Pissed off yet, Dave?

And you're both awesome alternatives to cat videos

[EEVblog]

Why do people try and compare different bloggers?

Because people compare things? DaVinci gets compared to Michelangelo. So what?

That was exactly my point.
It's not the comparison as such, it's that many people seem to somehow expect that because I did something, or Martin did something, or Mike did something, or Photonic Induction did something, or *insert blogger here* did something, that the others should somehow do something similar as well
If we all did identical stuff, the world would be just a little bit more boring.

[EEVblog]

You do this for a living, and Mike does it more for fun.

No, I do it for fun too.
It just happens to now be my living.

This is your personal income

Correct. Which does technically put me under more pressure to produce more varied content for more people, more often, in an ever maddening unwinnable upward spiral 
This is the life, I tells'ya! 

[Stonent]

Why do people try and compare different bloggers?

Because people compare things? DaVinci gets compared to Michelangelo. So what?

That was exactly my point.
It's not the comparison as such, it's that many people seem to somehow expect that because I did something, or Martin did something, or Mike did something, or Photonic Induction did something, or *insert blogger here* did something, that the others should somehow do something similar as well
If we all did identical stuff, the world would be just a little bit more boring.

Sometimes I want a Big Mac, sometimes I want a Whopper, sometimes I want to shell out $10 and get a non-assembly line burger. By definition, they are all hamburgers but they're a bit different. I like having my choices.

You guys are all a bunch of foreigners that don't speak proper 'merican.

If you and Mike should ever be in the same country at the same time, I think you should try to recreate the Office Space printer teardown.

[lgbeno]

I think the overall hit rate on the mail bag videos mean that the majority of viewers like it as it is and that is great.

I will say that it seems that stuff falls into a few different categories in mailbag

1) post cards

2) old stuff to do tear downs on

3) kits to assemble

4) other functional products/projects

Personally I think category 1 can be a video on its own just like the latest altzone video.  Category 2 goes into the queue for tear down videos and the letter gets read at that time.  Category 3, maybe the same approach as #1 honestly I can see doing more than looking at the pcb would take a tremendous amount of time to build up.

Category 4 is what I like in mailbag.  I always considered to send in one of my projects when it was ready but I haven't because it should be plug and play.  I think this was the case with the plasma speaker and it was one of the better mailbags...

Regardless, it's all good stuff and I'll continue to watch.

[Bored@Work]

Mike seems to end up with a lot of strange stuff.

I thought it was his missus who "motivated" him to quickly remove the x-ray machine from the premises, because the space in the garage was needed. Ah well, whatever.

Regarding the mailbag. If I watch the videos I watch them with my hand on the mouse to jump forward when letter reading comes up. I manage to finish watching a 45 min mailbag video in 15 min.  More time spend with the gadgets than the letters would be fun.

[EEVblog]

I thought it was his missus who "motivated" him to quickly remove the x-ray machine from the premises, because the space in the garage was needed. Ah well, whatever.

When we had him on the Amp Hour I think he revealed he was single, also on a live show I think. So last I heard, ladies, start lining up 

Regarding the mailbag. If I watch the videos I watch them with my hand on the mouse to jump forward when letter reading comes up. I manage to finish watching a 45 min mailbag video in 15 min.  More time spend with the gadgets than the letters would be fun.

Yeah, I'm a bit more mindful of that now.
I wish there were more automated ways for people to skip bits of content they don't have any interest in.

[AndyC_772]

I like the letters, it's a little bit of human contact in an otherwise very technology oriented forum. I find it interesting to know what people are working on, what interests them, and why they felt each item was worth a little bit of exposure.

Take out that part, and the mailbag section loses a lot of context. Why exactly have people from all over the world conspired between them to send in an odd-looking board that somebody made, a broken gadget off Ebay and a tool that I've never felt the need for in 20 years of tinkering with electronics? To me, their context is much more interesting than many of the items themselves.

[FrankBuss]

I like the style of the last mailbag video: showing the letter for some seconds and Dave tells some highlights of it. Watching a letter while Dave reads it in full confuses me, because I can read faster than listen, if I'm interested in the full letter, but not if someone reads it at the same time

[Orpheus]

Yeah, Dave, you keep telling everyone how hard it is. The forum-ites know how it really goes

Now look at that yo-yo, that's the way you do it
You solder circuits on the EEV
That ain't workin', that's the way you do it
Money for nothin' and your kicks for free

Naw that ain't workin', that's the way you do it
Lemme tell ya that guy ain't dumb
Maybe get a blister on your index finger
Maybe get a blister on your thumb

He gets to teardown microwave relays
High precision Agilents and old HPs
He gets to outwit Aussie eBayers
His trash room's filled with colour TV's

See the little maggot with matching Terahertz scopes
Yeah buddy that's not his only pair
That little maggot got his own YouTube show
That little maggot rides a C5 Sinclair

He gets to teardown Jedi lightsabers
Fight with customs for deliveries
He gets to fence with the YouTube nitwits
His trash room's filled with Maseratis

I shoulda learned to to do gate arrays
I shoulda learned to solder some
Look at that mailbag! Somebody sent an ICBM!
Man, wish I could have one!

And he's up there wearing ... Hawaiian flipflops?
Tarp across his carpet to catch whatever springs free
That ain't workin', that's the way you do it
Get your money for nothin' get your kicks for free

He gets to teardown nuclear footballs
He hires people to solder up his PCBs
He's never used an autorouter
His trash room's filled with Delorean debris

Now that ain't workin' that's the way you do it
You solder circuits on the EEV
That ain't workin' that's the way you do it
Money for nothin' and your kicks for free
Money for nothin' and your kicks for free

[FrankBuss]

He has never used an autorouter? Maybe Altium Designer crashes too frequently, so that the autorouting process would never finish But I use it all the time with Eagle, mostly for first revision prototypes where a good layout doesn't matter. One of my boards, with only minor manual routing:



Of course, if I have the time, and if I want it nice, I do route by hand: http://www.frank-buss.de/c64/pla/index.html

[alm]

Yeah, I'm a bit more mindful of that now.
I wish there were more automated ways for people to skip bits of content they don't have any interest in.

How about links in the description to the various items as a kind of table of contents, or 'click here to skip the letter' annotations? I think another video blogger (Martin?) did the TOC in the description thing at some point. Putting in annotations might be a fair bit of work, though.

In general navigation in videos is an unsolved problem in my opinion, and a definite disadvantage of video compared to text-based media like blogs or books. It's not very easy to skim a video. I would have expected the work experience students at Youtube to have come with a solution for that by now.

[kizzap]

I actually liked reading the letters in the parcels, as it quite often explained the whole project, and more importantly WHY the project was developed in the first place. That said, I do think some letters can have some fluff/padding that isn't really needed.

I would think that the best way that you could get around the letter issue is to possibly scan the letters and link to them in the description, so that if a particular project catches your eye, you can go read more about it, and track it back to the authors website if there is one available.

as to the amount of parcels you are receiving, could Dave possibly organise some online Queuing service that you have to register to to be able to send the parcel to Dave, so that he doesn't have a build-up of parcels on the shelves, and the sender would have some idea then when Dave is going to get to the parcel.

-kizzap

[Excavatoree]

I wonder how many people here are too young for the reference?

Our "safety guy" put up monitors playing some safety videos with characters that look like those of the Dire Straits video.  I thought it would be a funny joke to put an audio player up with the song, but then I realized that the 20 somethings we have working in the plant wouldn't have the slightest idea what it was.  Man, I'm old.

Yeah, Dave, you keep telling everyone how hard it is. The forum-ites know how it really goes

Now look at that yo-yo, that's the way you do it
You solder circuits on the EEV
That ain't workin', that's the way you do it
Money for nothin' and your kicks for free

Naw that ain't workin', that's the way you do it
Lemme tell ya that guy ain't dumb
Maybe get a blister on your index finger
Maybe get a blister on your thumb

He gets to teardown microwave relays
High precision Agilents and old HPs
He gets to outwit Aussie eBayers
His trash room's filled with colour TV's

See the little maggot with matching Terahertz scopes
Yeah buddy that's not his only pair
That little maggot got his own YouTube show
That little maggot rides a C5 Sinclair

He gets to teardown Jedi lightsabers
Fight with customs for deliveries
He gets to fence with the YouTube nitwits
His trash room's filled with Maseratis

I shoulda learned to to do gate arrays
I shoulda learned to solder some
Look at that mailbag! Somebody sent an ICBM!
Man, wish I could have one!

And he's up there wearing ... Hawaiian flipflops?
Tarp across his carpet to catch whatever springs free
That ain't workin', that's the way you do it
Get your money for nothin' get your kicks for free

He gets to teardown nuclear footballs
He hires people to solder up his PCBs
He's never used an autorouter
His trash room's filled with Delorean debris

Now that ain't workin' that's the way you do it
You solder circuits on the EEV
That ain't workin' that's the way you do it
Money for nothin' and your kicks for free
Money for nothin' and your kicks for free

[Citizen]

Maybe Dave can just summarise the letter with 2-5 sentences? That would be  a compromise....