Author Topic: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope  (Read 86115 times)

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Offline EEVblog

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #100 on: November 12, 2018, 09:18:10 am »
OMG !!! Should I open one now? I will be fired lol

Show us another photo at the end of the month and we'll see how well it sells  ;D
I've heard the 7000 has been a really tough sell
 
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Offline simone.pignatti

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #101 on: November 12, 2018, 09:23:08 am »
OMG !!! Should I open one now? I will be fired lol

Show us another photo at the end of the month and we'll see how well it sells  ;D
I've heard the 7000 has been a really tough sell
ahahah I almost spit my coffee while reading :)
someone will be gone, they or me ... better them  :-+
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Online Fungus

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #102 on: November 12, 2018, 10:43:22 am »
OMG !!! Should I open one now? I will be fired lol

What versions are they? Low end, high end? Do you unlock them on demand?

 

Offline simone.pignatti

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #103 on: November 12, 2018, 10:45:01 am »
OMG !!! Should I open one now? I will be fired lol

What versions are they? Low end, high end? Do you unlock them on demand?
they are all models in the mix. yes we also took the 2 channels   :-DD
just for more info, logic probe and front cover panel are not available yet.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2018, 10:50:24 am by simone.pignatti »
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Offline timgiles

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #104 on: November 12, 2018, 11:15:43 am »
Whats wrong with a passive heatsink per channel?

If it was placed because its needed - then what negative effect is it going to have?

I would rather than my electronics well cooled than have random lockups.


If the 2ch 70 MHz model can be hacked to a fully optioned 4ch 350 MHz with decoders then it will sell, other then that it's a dog at retail pricing.

It's competitive with competing models at the low end, but absolutely not at the higher end.

Hah, you replied to my post twice now with the same message(more or less).

I dunno, $900 for a 70 MHz 2 ch scope still seems pretty blah to me. The fact that it needs heatsinks on the front end ASIC's is also pretty lame for a newly developed chip.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2018, 11:23:37 am by timgiles »
 

Online nctnico

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #105 on: November 12, 2018, 12:57:18 pm »
OMG !!! Should I open one now? I will be fired lol
Find the one in the picture which should have been delivered to Australia  >:D
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 
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Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #106 on: November 12, 2018, 01:54:04 pm »
With the flexibility of software updates it seems crazy that manufacturers are still shipping physically different boxes.


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Offline ali_asadzadeh

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #107 on: November 12, 2018, 02:27:36 pm »
Dave ask them for free giveaways for this from. ^-^ ^-^ ^-^
You can order parts from www.ASiDesigner.com
we are a wire-based company
 

Online TK

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #108 on: November 12, 2018, 02:32:24 pm »
Dave ask them for free giveaways for this from. ^-^ ^-^ ^-^
Dave got the scope from a friend (loan), not Rigol... so I guess no give away this time
 

Online Fungus

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #109 on: November 12, 2018, 02:52:39 pm »
With the flexibility of software updates it seems crazy that manufacturers are still shipping physically different boxes.

Why? It's what customers expect.

(ie. It works right out of the box and has the correct sticker on it)
 
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Online Fungus

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #110 on: November 12, 2018, 02:54:27 pm »
I've heard the 7000 has been a really tough sell

It's expensive. People who are used to paying those prices are used to other brands.

The DS1054Z entered a mostly-new market where people don't have so much brand-bias.
 
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Online Fungus

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #111 on: November 12, 2018, 03:01:39 pm »
Oh and one more comment on the video... Dave... the MSO5000 has a friggin' touch screen! Use it! Don't use the select knob and buttons at the side of the screen.  :box:

Yep, If Dave wants to do a review it should contain that sort of thing. Use the touch screen, connect up an HDMI monitor, use the remote web interface, etc.

ie. The stuff that would distinguish it from other 'scopes in that price range.
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #112 on: November 12, 2018, 03:02:58 pm »
With the flexibility of software updates it seems crazy that manufacturers are still shipping physically different boxes.

Why? It's what customers expect.

(ie. It works right out of the box and has the correct sticker on it)
I doubt many customers would have a big proiblem with that.
Or it could be done by the dealer, instead of having to stock lots of options.
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Online NivagSwerdna

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #113 on: November 12, 2018, 03:12:24 pm »
https://www.instrumentcenter.se/sv/50-150-mhz-bandbredd/rigol-mso5074-blandsignalsoscilloskop-70-mhz-8-gsas-200-mpts-4-analoga-16-digitala-kanaler-7-instrument-i-1.php

So the Digital breakout is around another 30%

So how does that compare?  If it is hackable to say 100MHz and is then CH4 + 16 digital channels... What is the competition at that level?
 

Offline simone.pignatti

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #114 on: November 12, 2018, 03:58:04 pm »
I opened one unit to shoot an unboxing video. It looks really nice, the mat black fits good. Pretty heavy unit.
Booting time is decent, navigation between functions and menu is pretty fast.
No time to test it more since I have to leave the office and travel to Munich for the show, when back will do some more videos also back to back with R&S RTB2000.
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Offline nixfu

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #115 on: November 12, 2018, 04:06:14 pm »
No Hack == No Sale to the hobbyist market.
 

Offline simone.pignatti

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #116 on: November 12, 2018, 04:37:20 pm »
No Hack == No Sale to the hobbyist market.
To be fair and without making comparison right now, this is probably not true.
Many RTB2000 and SDS2000X have been sold to private/hobby users.
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Online nctnico

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #117 on: November 12, 2018, 04:42:03 pm »
With the flexibility of software updates it seems crazy that manufacturers are still shipping physically different boxes.
Why? It's what customers expect.

(ie. It works right out of the box and has the correct sticker on it)
I doubt many customers would have a big proiblem with that.
Or it could be done by the dealer, instead of having to stock lots of options.
In my experience it is a hassle having to install license keys. Small distributors like the ones for B-brands are typically not setup to deal with spreading licenses.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #118 on: November 12, 2018, 04:44:51 pm »
With the flexibility of software updates it seems crazy that manufacturers are still shipping physically different boxes.
Why? It's what customers expect.

(ie. It works right out of the box and has the correct sticker on it)
I doubt many customers would have a big proiblem with that.
Or it could be done by the dealer, instead of having to stock lots of options.
In my experience it is a hassle having to install license keys. Small distributors like the ones for B-brands are typically not setup to deal with spreading licenses.
Even if it means lower cost, as the manufacture & supply chain doesn't need to deal with all the different version ?
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Offline supercilious

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #119 on: November 12, 2018, 04:46:02 pm »
I would wait to see if Rigol commit to fix issues that crop up in the firmware before committing that kind of money, even for the base model. They completely abandoned the 4000 scopes and they left the 2000 series abandoned for ages before eventually patching some stuff.  |O

Who knows how they'll treat this one.  :-//
 
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Offline cpuerror

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #120 on: November 12, 2018, 04:48:31 pm »
Rigol isn't interested in the hobby market with this model, they are trying to aim for Keysight's and Tek's throats.. Keyword is trying. The hardware seems very good and the scope functionality has always delivered with Rigol although its too early to tell for sure. What is killing Rigol is the lack of industrial design and pricing. The layout of the 5000, while nowhere near as bad as the hatchet job they did on 7000, still looks like it was just slapped together by an engineer and meant to go to an industrial designer to actually make it look and function well but they decided to go to production. The 7000 and partly the 5000 reek of an incomplete design rushed to production.

The other thing is taking a page of out Tek's play book and charging a small fortune for every little feature. If the 70Mhz and 350Mhz versions are essentially the same hardware, why is the price difference thousands? If Rigol wants to take a good stab at the old giants, they need to fix their design process and then do a massive undercut. Also, drop the loser 70Mhz version for a scope of this class. For the time being, they simply can't compete on a purely product basis while they have some fool choosing 5 different fonts for the front panel and other things that turn off customers.
 

Online ataradov

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #121 on: November 12, 2018, 06:22:31 pm »
Keyword is trying.
Yes, and what would help to recoup some of that R&D money is to sell the same chipset to a lot of people fast -> hobby market :)

I would definitely upgrade from 1054 provided the hacks  are in place. I wold even accept their stupid industrial design. Without hacks, the value is not there at all. For the price of a well upgraded Rigol scope, there are a lot of options out there that are more attractive.
Alex
 

Online imo

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #122 on: November 12, 2018, 06:22:58 pm »
MSO5074 $999 fully hacked will be the winner in 2019.. They will sell it [Edit: kilo-]tons per day..
« Last Edit: November 12, 2018, 06:25:04 pm by imo »
 

Online blueskull

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #123 on: November 12, 2018, 06:44:55 pm »
The one thing that I don't understand the most is the lack of 50R input. Say, you have an 8Gsps scope with custom ADC, custom ASIC and custom AFE. All are very nicely done and if it's hackable, for $999.
It looks super attractive, but the 50R killed it.
Has anyone ever measured more than 200MHz without 50R? Sure, a good 1MR 10x or 100x probe can do it, but it comes with excessive capacitive loading on probe point, as well as signal quality issues due to the lossy coax (limits slew rate) and the ground loop (limits flatness).

And FFS, give us the smart probe interface. It costs nothing -- you already have the hexagonal probe socket, just add a few pins for power and I2C. Even a passive resistive smart probe interface for 10x/100x/1x/50R identification is better than nothing.
The same rant goes to Keysight DSOX2000 series too.
 
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Online Pinkus

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Re: EEVblog #1146 - New Low Cost Rigol MSO5000 Oscilloscope
« Reply #124 on: November 12, 2018, 06:53:13 pm »
MSO5074 $999 fully hacked will be the winner in 2019.. They will sell it [Edit: kilo-]tons per day..
If they have to decide between selling 100.000 scopes for $100 profit each or only 5.000 units with $3.000 profit each, guess what they will do.
And then, IF after a year sales is dropping, they can still leak some hacking information to sell another 50.000 units for $100 profit each.
 


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