Author Topic: Paid Blog Offers  (Read 21358 times)

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Offline EEVblog

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Paid Blog Offers
« on: October 11, 2016, 03:55:43 am »
This is the kind of paid blog offers I get and turn down often.

 

Offline Mr.B

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2016, 03:58:00 am »
Was that from the Roo brothers...  >:D
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Offline EEVblog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2016, 04:09:58 am »
Was that from the Roo brothers...  >:D

It would be hilarious if they contracted one of these marketing agencies and they approached me!
 
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Offline Muttley Snickers

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2016, 04:23:59 am »
Personally I don't see a problem with you or anyone else taking on these types of arrangements providing it is clearly disclosed in advance that rewards either financial or otherwise were received in relation to the promotion of said products or equipment, at the end of the day you have a business to run, family to feed and an internet connection that costs money for the main benefit of others.

This particular one shown mentions nothing about giving it a favourable review or that a project which may incorporate the device in question has to work in any particular manner or at all, their statement of "we would be happy to provide you with any key massaging that you can incorporate into your video" could be interpreted as a paid script by some but I doubt very much if anybody with any dignity would follow their script to the letter, certainly not the Dave I know anyway, tell them you had to improvise and didn't have an any key handy. 
 

Offline zapta

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2016, 04:30:09 am »
$2000 is not much for what they ask.

Looking forward to see people here filling the blanks.
Drain the swamp.
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2016, 04:32:40 am »
$2000 is not much for what they ask.

The agency would be earning 10 times that.
 

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2016, 04:39:08 am »
This is the kind of paid blog offers I get and turn down often.
Just send stuff to mailbag, and you will get a free review. Now, if product actually sucks...
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Offline aargee

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2016, 05:09:55 am »
Seed you with a developer kit? the mind boggles. "Reach out" man. I do love the presumption at the end that you will be chasing them.

Seems to be written by marketing with no technical background, then again a job is a job, the viewing angle might be different if the dollars meant putting bread on the table.
Not easy, not hard, just need to be incentivised.
 

Offline ez24

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #8 on: October 11, 2016, 05:19:14 am »
Looks like a secret government document with all the blackouts.  Why?
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Offline Bud

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #9 on: October 11, 2016, 06:04:32 am »
Such a boring offer.  :)

Check out the offer Lous Rossmann received from a TV company. THAT one was hillarious  :box:
Sending this from my phone so cant provide a link , but google "Rossmann Viceland TV" and you"ll find it.
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Offline EEVblog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #10 on: October 11, 2016, 06:20:01 am »
I do love the presumption at the end that you will be chasing them.

It's always like that!
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #11 on: October 11, 2016, 06:20:27 am »
Looks like a secret government document with all the blackouts.  Why?

Why do you think?
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #12 on: October 11, 2016, 06:21:39 am »
Such a boring offer.  :)
Check out the offer Lous Rossmann received from a TV company. THAT one was hillarious  :box:

I watched that yesterday and that was hilarious!

 

Offline StuUK

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2016, 06:55:29 am »
Personally I don't see a problem with you or anyone else taking on these types of arrangements providing it is clearly disclosed in advance that rewards either financial or otherwise were received in relation to the promotion of said products or equipment, at the end of the day you have a business to run, family to feed and an internet connection that costs money for the main benefit of others.

This particular one shown mentions nothing about giving it a favourable review or that a project which may incorporate the device in question has to work in any particular manner or at all, their statement of "we would be happy to provide you with any key massaging that you can incorporate into your video" could be interpreted as a paid script by some but I doubt very much if anybody with any dignity would follow their script to the letter, certainly not the Dave I know anyway, tell them you had to improvise and didn't have an any key handy.

What! Wheres your integrity?  :scared:
 

Offline Muttley Snickers

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #14 on: October 11, 2016, 07:07:45 am »
What! Wheres your integrity?  :scared:

Like many others I lost it back when I was eighteen.   :) :-+
 

Offline StuUK

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #15 on: October 11, 2016, 07:12:32 am »
What! Wheres your integrity?  :scared:

Like many others I lost it back when I was eighteen.   :) :-+

Took you that long....  ::)
 

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #16 on: October 11, 2016, 07:15:27 am »
What! Wheres your integrity?  :scared:

Like many others I lost it back when I was eighteen.   :) :-+

Took you that long....  ::)
18 is only 2.57 of our years.  :)
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Offline StuUK

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #17 on: October 11, 2016, 07:20:01 am »
18 is only 2.57 of our years.  :)

Is this a case of Lycanthropy?
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #18 on: October 11, 2016, 07:37:21 am »
Such a boring offer.  :)
Check out the offer Lous Rossmann received from a TV company. THAT one was hillarious  :box:

I watched that yesterday and that was hilarious!



Very down to Earth - and a brilliant illumination on contractual bias.

I'll give him two thumbs up for entertainment value!!   :-+ :-+
 

Offline StuUK

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #19 on: October 11, 2016, 09:24:31 am »
Personally I don't see a problem with you or anyone else taking on these types of arrangements providing it is clearly disclosed in advance that rewards either financial or otherwise were received in relation to the promotion of said products or equipment, at the end of the day you have a business to run, family to feed and an internet connection that costs money for the main benefit of others.

This particular one shown mentions nothing about giving it a favourable review or that a project which may incorporate the device in question has to work in any particular manner or at all, their statement of "we would be happy to provide you with any key massaging that you can incorporate into your video" could be interpreted as a paid script by some but I doubt very much if anybody with any dignity would follow their script to the letter, certainly not the Dave I know anyway, tell them you had to improvise and didn't have an any key handy.

What! Wheres your integrity?  :scared:

If there was full disclosure there need be  no loss of integrity. Not every product is going to be worth Dave's time to bother with but there could be one that appeals to both Dave and the EEVBlog viewers. Dave doesn't really do projects anymore so on that level they show a lack of due diligence.

I avoid 'paid for' videos like the plague... I'd hate to see Dave become a 'paid shill'... unbiased (in the commercial sense), honest warts and all reviews/teardowns is what I like... any hint of sponsorship turns me off and devalues the whole video whether it's true or not...
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #20 on: October 11, 2016, 09:50:55 am »
I've had offers like that where the only payment was to keep their piece of crap product!
I also get occasional offers just to send random stuff with no strings but only  accept if it's something interesting or useful. 
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Offline Wilksey

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #21 on: October 11, 2016, 12:22:49 pm »
Reading between the lines it looks like they want Dave to basically not review it as such, but produce an end product that they can showcase to their potential buyers, and they would almost certainly use Dave as the "expert" for all support enquiries, all whilst trying to make it sound like they are doing you a favour by letting you in on the "next biggest craze".

Unfortunately I expect a lot of people fall for it.
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #22 on: October 11, 2016, 12:47:30 pm »
Reading between the lines it looks like they want Dave to basically not review it as such, but produce an end product that they can showcase to their potential buyers

Yes. And once you bite on this then comes the request to vet the material before you publish it.

Quote
, and they would almost certainly use Dave as the "expert" for all support enquiries, all whilst trying to make it sound like they are doing you a favour by letting you in on the "next biggest craze".
Unfortunately I expect a lot of people fall for it.

Element 14 did that big time, they tried to rope in every blogger in the industry, most of it unpaid, it was the "prestige" of being on their lame arse blog/forum/whatever  community platform with the fake view counts. And after spending millions of dollars and many years on it they still only get 1/10th the posts a day this forum gets  :-DD
 

Offline Wilksey

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #23 on: October 11, 2016, 03:44:04 pm »
they still only get 1/10th the posts a day this forum gets  :-DD

Well, for me at least, there is no comparison, E14 is commercial and they will recommend you buy their stuff or at least from them, where as the EEVBlog is impartial (to a certain extent, some members are particular fan boys!), non-commercial and mostly friendly / helpful.

I've seen posts not even get a hint of a reply, at least you are almost guaranteed to get one here, even if it is just to take the piss!  ;D
 

Offline Someone

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #24 on: October 11, 2016, 11:04:00 pm »
Such a boring offer.  :)
Check out the offer Lous Rossmann received from a TV company. THAT one was hillarious  :box:

I watched that yesterday and that was hilarious!



Very down to Earth - and a brilliant illumination on contractual bias.

I'll give him two thumbs up for entertainment value!!   :-+ :-+
He's refreshingly honest, happy to do whatever brings in the cash.
 

Offline Muttley Snickers

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #25 on: October 12, 2016, 03:24:14 am »
I don't mind some of Peter Oakes videos and tutorials but haven't watched any in a while, not sure what the hell happened here though, the entire video page is now just one big advertisement flyer.   :-// :(

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Offline Red Squirrel

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #26 on: October 12, 2016, 03:49:02 am »
I have to admit in your shoes I'd be tempted. 2k for one video is pretty decent.  That's basically one of my pay cheques.  I guess this is what some people refer to as "selling out" though, as the channel ends up being all these sponsored reviews and stuff as all these vendors come with these "offers". 
 

Offline bitseeker

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #27 on: October 12, 2016, 04:39:41 am »
Such a boring offer.  :)
Check out the offer Lous Rossmann received from a TV company. THAT one was hillarious  :box:

I watched that yesterday and that was hilarious!

It was a bit funny at first, but his rant, although understandable, isn't correct relative to business norms. He's addressing it as if the contract was written for or to him and for a project where he's the artist. It's not. Rather, it's a boilerplate contract that is sent to every artist to cover a variety of situations. It's not personal and he was taking it personally. Companies don't tailor every contract for every potential relationship because it costs too much. If someone naively signs it, no need to get a lawyer involved.

He's correct in that the company that initiates the contract has it tailored to their own benefit. (Sometimes a company will have a mutually beneficial contract.) As a result, the recipient of the contract is obligated to read it and has the option to rebut it. That's contract negotiation. If he wanted to pursue the opportunity, rather than compose a long reply to the organization about what he didn't like, he could have marked up the contract to his (or his lawyer's) satisfaction and sent it back. Thus begins the back-and-forth.

This also applies to engineering. If you have to visit other companies for meetings, presentations, interviews, etc., beware of what you sign. Often, large corporations require you to sign a non-disclosure agreement (NDA) before you can get past the lobby even if no confidential material is involved. Don't blindly sign it because it's often one-sided and may impose unexpected liability or intellectual property restrictions on you or your employer. Many times, I've had to cross out offending portions of an NDA before signing it.

tl;dr: Assume a contract is not in your best interest unless you or your attorney wrote it. Don't take the boilerplate content of a contract personally. Don't sign a contract without knowing what's in it and rebut/edit/refuse it if you don't like it.
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Offline EEVblog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #28 on: October 12, 2016, 05:07:49 am »
It was a bit funny at first, but his rant, although understandable, isn't correct relative to business norms. He's addressing it as if the contract was written for or to him and for a project where he's the artist. It's not. Rather, it's a boilerplate contract that is sent to every artist to cover a variety of situations. It's not personal and he was taking it personally.

Of course it's personal, it was his contract after all (and it was somewhat personalised for him) and they wanted him to sign it.
If they didn't want him to take it personally they shouldn't have written such a horrifically bad contract to begin with.

Quote
He's correct in that the company that initiates the contract has it tailored to their own benefit. (Sometimes a company will have a mutually beneficial contract.) As a result, the recipient of the contract is obligated to read it and has the option to rebut it. That's contract negotiation. If he wanted to pursue the opportunity, rather than compose a long reply to the organization about what he didn't like, he could have marked up the contract to his (or his lawyer's) satisfaction and sent it back. Thus begins the back-and-forth.

That contract was not salvageable, almost everything in it was bad.
 

Offline zapta

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #29 on: October 12, 2016, 05:32:14 am »


He's correct in that the company that initiates the contract has it tailored to their own benefit. (Sometimes a company will have a mutually beneficial contract.) As a result, the recipient of the contract is obligated to read it and has the option to rebut it. That's contract negotiation.

The side that authors the contract sets the tone and controls the negotiation process. It's like fixing a bad design, there is a limit how much you can change.

Drain the swamp.
 

Offline jancumps

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #30 on: October 12, 2016, 11:28:51 am »

The side that authors the contract sets the tone and controls the negotiation process. It's like fixing a bad design, there is a limit how much you can change.
Most contract proposals of businesses that want to make a deal and that have competition are balanced.
 

Offline rrinker

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #31 on: October 12, 2016, 12:27:06 pm »
 No matter how many disclosures you make, no matter how many upfront notices you make, there will always be that subset of people who assume something that's not. You can whack some people over their heads with a big sign saying the following is a paid review and they will STILL think that any favorable review is an unsolicited endorsement. It's just not worth it for the potential damage to an otherwise stellar reputation.
 We know what it really would cost - Dave revealed his price in that thread in the General section. After which he would be gonski and enjoying his retirement on his private island, so no more EEVBlog for the rest of us.

 

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #32 on: October 12, 2016, 01:49:42 pm »
There are some perfectly good opportunities for vendors to pay for totally ethical blogs. For example, applications blogs, or how to drive a peripheral blogs, that specifically highlight how well a device can perform a particular task. These types of blogs should contain mostly hard material, and should have very little which is merely opinion. I see no valid reason not to be paid to produce them.
 

Offline bitseeker

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #33 on: October 12, 2016, 04:40:44 pm »
It was a bit funny at first, but his rant, although understandable, isn't correct relative to business norms. He's addressing it as if the contract was written for or to him and for a project where he's the artist. It's not. Rather, it's a boilerplate contract that is sent to every artist to cover a variety of situations. It's not personal and he was taking it personally.

Of course it's personal, it was his contract after all (and it was somewhat personalised for him) and they wanted him to sign it.
If they didn't want him to take it personally they shouldn't have written such a horrifically bad contract to begin with.

I agree that companies shouldn't be that way, but they are. Hence, the old saying, "It's not personal, it's business." Unfortunate, but too often true.


Quote
Quote
He's correct in that the company that initiates the contract has it tailored to their own benefit. (Sometimes a company will have a mutually beneficial contract.) As a result, the recipient of the contract is obligated to read it and has the option to rebut it. That's contract negotiation. If he wanted to pursue the opportunity, rather than compose a long reply to the organization about what he didn't like, he could have marked up the contract to his (or his lawyer's) satisfaction and sent it back. Thus begins the back-and-forth.

That contract was not salvageable, almost everything in it was bad.

Agreed, and crossing out almost everything or simply saying that the contract is unacceptable is sufficient, rather than long explanations about each point. If a company really is interested in doing a deal, then after failing to get you to go for the ridiculous version of the contract, they'll pull out the mutually beneficial version or have one drafted.

Of course, I'd think twice about doing a deal with such a company. My point is that his experience is not unusual.
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Offline Brumby

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #34 on: October 13, 2016, 02:54:53 am »
I think Louis has provided an invaluable service with this video.

There are a lot of people out there who are good at doing a particular job, but really lacking in business skills.  This is a heads up for people who might be star-struck at the idea of getting paid for something they are already doing - and not realise they need to critically examine things like a contract... especially when they have had no formal input into its draughting.  In such a situation, they should expect the contract to be heavily weighted in favour of those who had it put together and to then identify and address the concerns.

Certainly, there are boilerplate documents out there - but when one is presented to a particular person, then it does become personal.  The issues about which Louis gets 'animated' are prime examples of the sort of thing ANY potential signatory to a contract should have a very great concern.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2016, 02:57:42 am by Brumby »
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #35 on: October 13, 2016, 04:27:48 am »
The side that authors the contract sets the tone and controls the negotiation process. It's like fixing a bad design, there is a limit how much you can change.
Most contract proposals of businesses that want to make a deal and that have competition are balanced.

Not in the entertainment business.
Their opinion is either you sign it or you can bugger off. There is little to no negotiation for Joe Bloggs.
If you don't want to sign the contract for Idol / X-factor / insert reality show here then there are 100 other people who will.
Also, they have no problem with canning a show idea, that happens more often than not.

I was approached once to co-host a kinda science based reality show (Derrick from Veritasium was he other host they approached), but it was some crap about science pranks or some such, terrible idea. But it was a huge name with National in the title who had contracted this production company to find people and develop the idea etc. It last a few emails before the whole thing flopped, money down the drain, but that's the business.
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #36 on: October 13, 2016, 04:30:24 am »
Agreed, and crossing out almost everything or simply saying that the contract is unacceptable is sufficient, rather than long explanations about each point. If a company really is interested in doing a deal, then after failing to get you to go for the ridiculous version of the contract, they'll pull out the mutually beneficial version or have one drafted.

And if it's "just business" as you say, then the company shouldn't take Louis's rant personally and would come back to him if they really wanted it.
 

Offline Muttley Snickers

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #37 on: October 13, 2016, 08:50:14 am »
I just found this related video on Youtube and might just leave it here for the time being.   ;)

 

Offline T3sl4co1l

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #38 on: October 13, 2016, 10:48:11 am »
Now, what I'd like to hear about -- and I don't see it being discussed -- is such an offer [as Rossmann's] even legal?!

Even such simple absurdities like "throughout the universe" can be more dangerous than silly.  Some discussion:
http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB125658217507308619

Why would you add a qualifier to an already completely general "all"?

While the individual clauses of the contract may be reasonable enough in a suitable context (for example, controlling ones' image, because that person irrevocably becomes part of the brand), I suspect that so many of them, so strict and onerous, strung together, without any discussion of Artist rights (beyond payment for episodes), or of considerable and ongoing compensation to make it beneficial, would simply be thrown out if it actually went to court.

It's a basic tenet of US contract law (I think; IANAL) that the agreement be mutually beneficial, and that one cannot remove basic, guaranteed freedoms, even if both parties knowingly consent to the terms (example: dom-sub contracts, that some couples use: they aren't legally binding).

For the nearly limitless responsibilities given to the Artist, and the nearly complete lack of compensation (indeed, the levying of royalties from any source of income Artist may pursue), I suspect that contract amounts to indentured servitude, and is therefore null and void.  It's a waste of paper, that should've never been written in the first place!

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Offline EEVblog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #39 on: October 13, 2016, 11:05:49 am »
I don't mind some of Peter Oakes videos and tutorials but haven't watched any in a while, not sure what the hell happened here though, the entire video page is now just one big advertisement flyer.   :-// :(

Wow  :o

 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #40 on: October 13, 2016, 11:08:37 am »
Now, what I'd like to hear about -- and I don't see it being discussed -- is such an offer [as Rossmann's] even legal?!

Anything is legal to sign.
And they are free to sue you if you break any agreement you sign.
Doesn't mean they will win though.
Legality of anything can only be ruled after the fact by court.
 

Offline T3sl4co1l

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #41 on: October 13, 2016, 11:15:37 am »
Anything is legal to sign.
And they are free to sue you if you break any agreement you sign.
Doesn't mean they will win though.
Legality of anything can only be ruled after the fact by court.

True enough!

(I mean the latter sense, of course; but it is kind of disappointing that such things have to be subjected to the expensive scrutiny of the court before they are found as such.)

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Offline EEVblog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #42 on: October 13, 2016, 11:33:14 am »
(I mean the latter sense, of course; but it is kind of disappointing that such things have to be subjected to the expensive scrutiny of the court before they are found as such.)

Well it's not pot luck. Based on case law you can often be fairly sure if you will either win or lose before it gets that far.
Same rule applies to advice from lawyers. Just because a lawyer says something is ok or not ok does not mean anything legally, they are just guessing based on their experience and case law history. Many a person has lost it all and then complained that their lawyer had ok'd it  ::)
Trap for young players.
 

Offline NANDBlog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #43 on: October 13, 2016, 12:57:47 pm »
2000 bucks for a 3-4 day work? Ok, so that is about 60-80 USD/hour, before taxes, below the engineering contracting rate. Not a good deal, if you dont have the time.

Maybe you should just subcontract the blogging to someone in India and make half the video there, place the blog post in a weird location and the video on EEVBlog3.
 

Offline steve30

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #44 on: October 13, 2016, 02:17:16 pm »
I normally ignore things from people who want to 'reach out' to me.

I certainly don't think I'd want to be 'seeded'.
 

Online Yansi

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #45 on: October 13, 2016, 03:22:58 pm »
Interesting video I watched today ()

Just wanted to note, that even my f*king looser youtube channel with about 650 subs and 600k views (that I dunno where I got from) has been approached at least once from some chinese component and doodley doo arduino supplier wanting me to do reviews for them.

However their product range is mostly what I hate (arduino and stuff around it). The only things in my interest was few STM32 micros they have on stock. ... however, due to my work position in blahblahblah I have access to every blahblahblah's thingy or two and had to kindly decline their offer. The haven't offered any other reward than the item for review either. So not worth it, even for a dumb EE student like me.
 

Offline zapta

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #46 on: October 13, 2016, 05:15:18 pm »


2000 bucks for a 3-4 day work? Ok, so that is about 60-80 USD/hour, before taxes, below the engineering contracting rate. Not a good deal, if you dont have the time.


You need to consider also the potential devaluation of the eevblog brand.

Drain the swamp.
 

Offline jancumps

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #47 on: October 13, 2016, 06:50:29 pm »
Anything is legal to sign.
And they are free to sue you if you break any agreement you sign.
Doesn't mean they will win though.
Legality of anything can only be ruled after the fact by court.

True enough!

(I mean the latter sense, of course; but it is kind of disappointing that such things have to be subjected to the expensive scrutiny of the court before they are found as such.)

Tim

True. I was advised to just sign a job contract with an obviously illegal chapter in it (by a legal service - they do that service for free here if you're member of a union),
because that chapter would not be enforceable in court.
The contract included an exclusivity clause, and that's not valid in Belgium except for particular types of jobs.
 

Offline XynxNet

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #48 on: October 13, 2016, 08:24:23 pm »
Authenticity is in my opinion one of the main reasons for Dave's success.
It is kind of ironic that companies think, that's something they can buy into.
Keep up the good work and your principles, Dave! :)
 

Offline zapta

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #49 on: October 13, 2016, 08:26:10 pm »
Authenticity is in my opinion one of the main reasons for Dave's success.
It is kind of ironic that companies think, that's something they can buy into.
Keep up the good work and your principles, Dave! :)

Check Dave's video, they can buy it but for much more ;-)
Drain the swamp.
 
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Offline jancumps

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #50 on: October 13, 2016, 08:39:15 pm »
I think that it's the personality as a whole, not the <isolated> authenticity.
There's a load of authentic bloggers out there that don't get a view. Ever.
 

Offline vze1lryy

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #51 on: October 13, 2016, 09:22:18 pm »
Now, what I'd like to hear about -- and I don't see it being discussed -- is such an offer [as Rossmann's] even legal?!

Anything is legal to sign.
And they are free to sue you if you break any agreement you sign.
Doesn't mean they will win though.
Legality of anything can only be ruled after the fact by court.

Contract law often favors the side who DIDN'T write the contract when it makes it to court. The reality is that most people who claim they will sue, do not actually sue.

Think about it. Court costs money. The people who sign contracts without having an attorney read them are people without the money for a lawyer.

2000 bucks for a 3-4 day work? Ok, so that is about 60-80 USD/hour, before taxes, below the engineering contracting rate. Not a good deal, if you dont have the time.

Maybe you should just subcontract the blogging to someone in India and make half the video there, place the blog post in a weird location and the video on EEVBlog3.

I agree, and would also like to add, realize the lost momentum!

Every second dave spends on the forum, his channel, and his projects he spends building his brand. Every second he spends on this blog idea, he spends putting down his own ideas. While this might sound silly to a lot of people, losing momentum on your own projects to invest in someone else's project requires a higher level of compensation than the amount of compensation we'd want if we were working for ourselves. Even if what Dave does today doesn't return him much $$$, what he does today might lead to an idea that tomorrow that manifests itself as an additional $30,000 in revenue over the lifetime of his brand.

If he spent tomorrow working on this terrible offer, he might have missed an opportunity to build his own brand by virtue of being busy doing something else. The opportunity cost has to be taken into consideration. It is why self-made successes who are busy doing their own thing will charge insane amounts of money to go "off course" for an idea they do not believe in, because they often don't know how much they are missing out on by taking themselves off track to do unrelated work for someone else.

Agreed, and crossing out almost everything or simply saying that the contract is unacceptable is sufficient, rather than long explanations about each point. If a company really is interested in doing a deal, then after failing to get you to go for the ridiculous version of the contract, they'll pull out the mutually beneficial version or have one drafted.

And if it's "just business" as you say, then the company shouldn't take Louis's rant personally and would come back to him if they really wanted it.

For me I never wanted to be on television. Instead of say no, I gave them an opportunity to listen to my concerns, and send me a piece of paper that incentivized me to change my mind.  If that is their idea of changing my mind, then just gtfo. If I had applied, I understand them offering me this, but they came to me.. they actually showed up here twice because I wasn't available one day.

I worked in entertainment, as a technician, not much a recording engineer, for several years. From tiny NYC studios to Avatar studios, I got to be in the room with a lot of smart people, and occasionally, some pretty ignorant people, and I got to be in the room later to hear how everything worked out. From that time, I did learn that the biggest and oldest scam in the entertainment world is the concept of exposure. For every 1 person that becomes famous or even makes $60k/yr of of a career started off exposure, there are 100,000 that just get used up for nothing by it. As my friend who runs his own label and studio as a living says on one of his albums - "can I take it to the deli and cash it in for a sandwich?" If no, RUN! :)

I've tried doing reviews before and... it doesn't work out well. Even for free. I am just not involving myself in reviews of unsolicited gear.


« Last Edit: October 13, 2016, 09:25:09 pm by vze1lryy »
Louis Rossmann
Component level motherboard repair technician.
 

Offline Merlot1970

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #52 on: October 13, 2016, 09:42:02 pm »
2,000 dollars is chump money to be getting involved with these crooks :)
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #53 on: October 13, 2016, 11:13:28 pm »
2000 bucks for a 3-4 day work? Ok, so that is about 60-80 USD/hour, before taxes, below the engineering contracting rate. Not a good deal, if you dont have the time.
Maybe you should just subcontract the blogging to someone in India and make half the video there, place the blog post in a weird location and the video on EEVBlog3.

I agree, and would also like to add, realize the lost momentum!
Every second dave spends on the forum, his channel, and his projects he spends building his brand. Every second he spends on this blog idea, he spends putting down his own ideas. While this might sound silly to a lot of people, losing momentum on your own projects to invest in someone else's project requires a higher level of compensation than the amount of compensation we'd want if we were working for ourselves. Even if what Dave does today doesn't return him much $$$, what he does today might lead to an idea that tomorrow that manifests itself as an additional $30,000 in revenue over the lifetime of his brand.
If he spent tomorrow working on this terrible offer, he might have missed an opportunity to build his own brand by virtue of being busy doing something else. The opportunity cost has to be taken into consideration. It is why self-made successes who are busy doing their own thing will charge insane amounts of money to go "off course" for an idea they do not believe in, because they often don't know how much they are missing out on by taking themselves off track to do unrelated work for someone else.

Bang on.
 

Offline ez24

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #54 on: October 14, 2016, 12:47:37 am »
This is the kind of paid blog offers I get and turn down often.

Too bad you black out who they are - now I cannot make them an offer.  How about PM and I will do a video on their development kit.  Is it wrong to do a paid review if disclosed?  They are all over Amazon.  I would do it, disclose it, donate the money, and take a tax right off.  After all, didn't you do this once ? I think the date was Apr.1, but I forgot the year.   :-DD





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Offline bigsky

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #55 on: October 14, 2016, 04:47:03 pm »
Here's a question for Dave and others who are more familiar with advertising rates than I am... What would be a fairer price for the advertising generate by this proposal? Their $2K figure is just a laugh, but would it be worth $20K, $200K, or somewhere in between?

From the EE Times ratecard, a double-page print spread for 12 months would cost about $50K, and I'm sure what they're asking for would have at least a similar impact. But if EE times can $8K for an online welcome ad for just one week, maybe even $50K is cheap. As Dave said, 50K+ views is typical for one of his videos, the degree of viewer engagement is very high, the video is up forever and continues to get hits, so all that has got to be worth a considerable amount.

But we all enjoy listening to Dave knowing that his opinion hasn't been bought by anyone, and long may it stay that way  :)
 

Offline bitseeker

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #56 on: October 14, 2016, 05:22:47 pm »
Agreed, and crossing out almost everything or simply saying that the contract is unacceptable is sufficient, rather than long explanations about each point. If a company really is interested in doing a deal, then after failing to get you to go for the ridiculous version of the contract, they'll pull out the mutually beneficial version or have one drafted.

And if it's "just business" as you say, then the company shouldn't take Louis's rant personally and would come back to him if they really wanted it.

Yes, "if they really wanted it," being the key phrase there. As you pointed out, some companies are just looking to see who'll sign such nonsense and move on to other "victims" if they can't have their way.
I TEA.
 

Offline bitseeker

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #57 on: October 14, 2016, 05:32:35 pm »
From that time, I did learn that the biggest and oldest scam in the entertainment world is the concept of exposure. For every 1 person that becomes famous or even makes $60k/yr of of a career started off exposure, there are 100,000 that just get used up for nothing by it.

So true. Many industries are like that. It's a pyramid where few make a lot and many, many struggle to make anything (and are taken advantage of while trying to get somewhere).

Quote
As my friend who runs his own label and studio as a living says on one of his albums - "can I take it to the deli and cash it in for a sandwich?" If no, RUN! :)

I like it! :-+
I TEA.
 

Offline nardev

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #58 on: October 15, 2016, 12:59:44 am »
Ha ha, could be Mikroelektronika :)
 

Offline Stefan Payne

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #59 on: October 15, 2016, 05:30:42 am »
Sadly there are many many sites who do exactly that...

They get paid from the manufacturer to do a (positive) Review of something...
Or have some other Things going on...

That's why some products are rated better than they deserved to be rated, sadly...
 

Offline iampoor

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #60 on: October 15, 2016, 09:04:33 am »
Here's a question for Dave and others who are more familiar with advertising rates than I am... What would be a fairer price for the advertising generate by this proposal? Their $2K figure is just a laugh, but would it be worth $20K, $200K, or somewhere in between?

From the EE Times ratecard, a double-page print spread for 12 months would cost about $50K, and I'm sure what they're asking for would have at least a similar impact. But if EE times can $8K for an online welcome ad for just one week, maybe even $50K is cheap. As Dave said, 50K+ views is typical for one of his videos, the degree of viewer engagement is very high, the video is up forever and continues to get hits, so all that has got to be worth a considerable amount.

But we all enjoy listening to Dave knowing that his opinion hasn't been bought by anyone, and long may it stay that way  :)

CPC (Cost per click) for google adwords is ~1$ a click (this is on the low side), I would think that for a video with 50k views, starting at 20 thousand $ might be reasonable place to start?  ;D

I really wonder what bloggers like Colin Furze get paid. He runs the only Youtube channel that I am 100% okay with being funded by sponsered content, since the projects are so cool.  :-+

 

Offline bigsky

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #61 on: October 15, 2016, 10:22:18 am »
CPC (Cost per click) for google adwords is ~1$ a click (this is on the low side), I would think that for a video with 50k views, starting at 20 thousand $ might be reasonable place to start?  ;D
That might even be on the low side. Watching a 30 minute video is a bit different to clicking on a link. For example, when Dave does a review of a piece of test gear, I will watch it in full and get a pretty comprehensive understanding of the item, what it can do, and how well it does it. Even if the manufacturer sent a salesman round to do a personal demo for me (which would cost them quite a bit), it wouldn't have the same impact as Dave's expert opinion. And the teardowns have great value as well - being engineers, we're interested in build quality and what's inside things.

Quote
I really wonder what bloggers like Colin Furze get paid. He runs the only Youtube channel that I am 100% okay with being funded by sponsered content, since the projects are so cool.  :-+
I enjoy Colin Furze as well - but he doesn't do equipment reviews in the same way as Dave - so there's not the same issue with independence. He got HTC 1.1 million views from the video you linked to - must be worth a considerable amount!
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #62 on: October 15, 2016, 12:50:13 pm »
Here's a question for Dave and others who are more familiar with advertising rates than I am... What would be a fairer price for the advertising generate by this proposal? Their $2K figure is just a laugh, but would it be worth $20K, $200K, or somewhere in between?

Depends on how you price your "service".
If you consider it a paid gig then the time you spend making and supporting the video (hourly rate say $200), and then throw in some extra for your "brand" and audience.
Or you could price it based on views (or this could be the "extra" bit mentioned before), take your views and price it at several hundred dollars CPM at least. So 100k expected views = $20k say.

Lets say the video was a biggie and it took you 40 hours work, that's $8k in your time, plus $20k for the eyeballs.
That would be a realistic industry figure.
Remember, they want your audience, because it's something they don't have.

Quote
From the EE Times ratecard, a double-page print spread for 12 months would cost about $50K, and I'm sure what they're asking for would have at least a similar impact.

Nope, not close.
People treat ads differently to personal opinion, especially the personal opinion of someone they trust.
Also, a eyeball watching a 30 minute review video is orders of magnitude more valuable psychologically than that same eyeball flicking past your ad in a magazine 12 times, maybe only reading it fully the first time if you are lucky.

Quote
the video is up forever and continues to get hits, so all that has got to be worth a considerable amount.

That's called "long tail" views, and would be something you would promote in your ad rate sheet.
 

Offline peteroakes

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #63 on: October 17, 2016, 05:32:56 am »
I don't mind some of Peter Oakes videos and tutorials but haven't watched any in a while, not sure what the hell happened here though, the entire video page is now just one big advertisement flyer.   :-// :(

Wow  :o



Hmm, Noted. I had not realised I was giving that impression, so sorry to all my viewers, I will have to correct that. But just to clarify, I have not sold out, The same as Dave, I do not get paid for any of my videos, and follow my own direction, but as you can see, I have had some of my sponsors being very generous with goodies recently, I just chose to put their logos at the beginning splash page to acknowledge that. Looking at it the way shown in the quote though, I can see where your impression is coming from. And I am long over due to get back to some of my other projects.
Peter Oakes
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Offline peteroakes

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #64 on: October 17, 2016, 04:22:06 pm »
And I like to think I do not hide things from my viewers, I can't afford to buy equipment (At least not much) so rely on vendors and distributors to donate them to me (Sponsor is the better word I guess), the only deal I agree to is to show the products and if it is a review item I will say where it came from and include logo's etc, if as is the case with my soldering station and other tools and components, there to help with projects, i will provide links to the sponsors sell pages and still state that company X provided these to me.The one thing I don't do, which is the same as Dave is to agree that the review will be positive or not, nor provide reviews of the video before publishing.

I think the only video that deviates very slightly from that is where RS Components asked if I would like to provide a short video to be used at the world maker faire in Rome as the support of a new Siemens IoT2020 Educational industrial Gateway, this video was not paid for but I did it as it would get me loads of exposure at the Faire... Awesome yes! and I was creating a review of it anyway, and a bunch of tutorials, Tutorials are the main stay of what I like to do
 

Offline hans

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #65 on: October 17, 2016, 04:54:06 pm »
Remember that thumbnails for video's are to catch attention on YT: a marketing banner for your own video's, not some kind of marketing sponsor banner for some one else. If you don't get viewers for your content, you won't get any for your sponsors either. I would be very thrifty with putting logo's onto my own work and videos. MAYBE an 'acknowledgement slide' or some intro scene if you have main sponsors of your channel, but other than that I would keep stuff like that to a minimum.

Yes it's nice that they sponsor stuff and equipment but if you dedicate time in a video (or even a dedicated video) to it that's already their marketing done (unless agreed otherwise I suppose). Any future use of the product can be seen as a further kickback to them, but I wouldn't mention it explicitly again and again. If people ask just refer them to a mailbag or whatever. If you then mentioned it explicitly they sent it to you for free for a honest review, there is not much else to say.

TBH I know your channel (it's in my RSS watch feed), but I had the stereotypical ad thing in my head too. Personally I hate advertisements and I hate branding; including marketing, logo's, sponsored content, etc. I know it can be a 'necessary evil' to survive and keep the lab equipped with nice gear to shoot interesting content with, but in the end I would click on a video for the content primarily.

Well, that's just my 2 cents.
 

Offline ez24

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Re: Paid Blog Offers
« Reply #66 on: October 17, 2016, 06:37:41 pm »
And I like to think...

Under your Profile you can put links to your sites and YT, and they will be displayed in every post you make.  It would make it easier to see what you are doing.
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