Author Topic: [MOVED] Will a graphics PCI card improve performance in my Pentium 4, 2.53 GHz, 1 GB RAM  (Read 14459 times)

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Offline Psi

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PCI (not PCI-Express) is very slow, there are are some slim AGP cards out there.
I really recommend that you get a fast hard drive with a large buffer, it can make a huge difference in a old computer

PCI is only slow if you want to do stuff in 3D, for just browsing the web and other 2D stuff (which he says he's doing) any high spec PCI card will do that perfectly fine.

The PCI bus is plenty fast enough to draw 2D graphics with heaps of bandwidth to spare.

But I do agree that an AGP card is the better choice if he can find one that fits.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2011, 12:30:44 pm by Psi »
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Offline Kiriakos-GR

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The DX9 controls both software accelerations about 2D & 3D ...

Yes, even the common 2D tasks , they can be accelerated by allot ,
if the hardware supports DX9 .

The connection Buss  ( AGP - PCI ) was an theoretical subject for thousands of hot debates.

But the point is just one ,  even at 2D , the Direct - X acceleration it is totally important.
    
    
 

Offline Simon

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PCI (not PCI-Express) is very slow, there are are some slim AGP cards out there.
I really recommend that you get a fast hard drive with a large buffer, it can make a huge difference in a old computer

PCI is only slow if you want to do stuff in 3D, for just browsing the web and other 2D stuff (which he says he's doing) any high spec PCI card will do that perfectly fine.

The PCI bus is plenty fast enough to draw 2D graphics with heaps of bandwidth to spare.

But I do agree that an AGP card is the better choice if he can find one that fits.

it's speced at 133 MB/s, from what I read that is a practical 80 MB/s
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Online Zero999

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But if you think that is fast enough (maybe check with another computer) and everything still seems slow I would guess software next.
If you aren't using Chrome (or Opera) you should give it a try. They are pretty responsive. (The new Firefox and IE aren't bad, but still can't compete with Chrome in page load time).

That would be my first recommendation.

What browser are you using? If it's Internet Explorer, give Firefox a go. If it's Firefox, give Chrome or Opera a go.

Another thing you could try is installing a faster hard drive. If you have a crappy old 5400 RPM IDE drive, upgrade to a 7200RPM SATA.
 

Offline Kiriakos-GR

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Another thing you could try is installing a faster hard drive. If you have a crappy old 5400 RPM IDE drive, upgrade to a 7200RPM SATA.


The only breath taking solution are the WD Raptor 10000 RPM.
The performance gain  5400 vs 7200 it is just noticeable.   
 

Offline Simon

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Another thing you could try is installing a faster hard drive. If you have a crappy old 5400 RPM IDE drive, upgrade to a 7200RPM SATA.


The only breath taking solution are the WD Raptor 10000 RPM.
The performance gain  5400 vs 7200 it is just noticeable.   


Why not go the full hog and get an SSD Drive ?  ;D
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Offline Kiriakos-GR

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Another thing you could try is installing a faster hard drive. If you have a crappy old 5400 RPM IDE drive, upgrade to a 7200RPM SATA.


The only breath taking solution are the WD Raptor 10000 RPM.
The performance gain  5400 vs 7200 it is just noticeable.   


Why not go the full hog and get an SSD Drive ?  ;D

I do not trust SSD .
 

Offline Mechatrommer

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the bottom line? the way i see from the discussion... get a whole new system with everything fast!
if something can select, how cant it be intelligent? if something is intelligent, how cant it exist?
 

Offline Simon

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Another thing you could try is installing a faster hard drive. If you have a crappy old 5400 RPM IDE drive, upgrade to a 7200RPM SATA.


The only breath taking solution are the WD Raptor 10000 RPM.
The performance gain  5400 vs 7200 it is just noticeable.   


Why not go the full hog and get an SSD Drive ?  ;D

I do not trust SSD .

Any particular reason ? I must admit I'm slightly queezy although I have had no issues so far with my "portable" 40GB drive, To be honest I felt equally queezy about my new 750 GB mechanical drive as i felt we may be pushing things, now I don't give a second thought to it's reliability.

We have used USB sticks for years
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Offline ndictu

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the bottom line? the way i see from the discussion... get a whole new system with everything fast!
Yup, get a $1000 machine for websurfing. He still hasn't responded with a speedtest result, maybe it's just terrible ISP and internet latency/speed is the biggest factor in this case.

I do not trust SSD .

Why? I mean, in the beginnings they were pretty terrible but now it's a great choice for system partition and prices are going down nicely. I wouldn't put everything there, just the system stuff and get a cheap 1TB drive for the rest.
 

Online Zero999

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It's definietly true that the hard drive is the main bottleneck in a general usage PC because it takes so long to access information stored on it.

I have a Raptor 10,000 drive.

I did notice a significant improvement when moving from 5400 to 7200 though. Don't forget there are other factors, an old IDE 5400 drive which is 50% full and has virtual no cache will be really slow compared to a 7200 SATA drive.

You could go with SSD but I doubt you'll reap the full benefit without upgrading everything else.

While we're on the subject, anyone tried a hybrid drive? I've seen them on ebuyer. When I do finally decide to get a new PC I might give one a go.
http://www.ebuyer.com/store/Storage/cat/Hard-Drive---SSD

 

Offline Simon

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Yea i saw that hybrid one and almost gave it a go. I'll probably get hybrid drives in the future but I'd prefer a 100% SSD for a system disk.

Yes he will need to upgrade the rest of the computer, he may not have a sata port and getting a PCI sata card is pretty pointless
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Offline Kiriakos-GR

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Any particular reason ? I must admit I'm slightly queezy although I have had no issues so far with my "portable" 40GB drive, To be honest I felt equally queezy about my new 750 GB mechanical drive as i felt we may be pushing things, now I don't give a second thought to it's reliability.

We have used USB sticks for years

Have you lost an motherboard ?  due the fact that the USB stick controller shorted out !!
I did ... an 200 EUR one .. The south bridge burned out.  
I was lucky because this model had five years warranty, and I got an replacement.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2011, 07:21:19 pm by Kiriakos-GR »
 

Online Zero999

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Yes he will need to upgrade the rest of the computer, he may not have a sata port and getting a PCI sata card is pretty pointless
I disagree, buying a new IDE drive is pointless. IDE drives are much more expensive than SATA, so much so, it's cheaper to get a PCI SATA card and buy a cheaper SATA drive.
 

Offline Simon

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Well cost wise maybe, but you will be adding another conversion (latency) and bottle neck to a bottle neck you already have. The PCI bus as I said earlier is not fast. Theoretically 133 MB/s in reality no more than 80 MB/s, SATA speeds are now at 375 MB/s (theorectically) and that speed will be used by your generous cache on the Sata drive even if the mechanical drive can't keep up.

I bet a good speed second hand ATA drive will be just as fast as a SATA drive with the adapter
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Offline Kiriakos-GR

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Yes he will need to upgrade the rest of the computer, he may not have a sata port and getting a PCI sata card is pretty pointless
I disagree, buying a new IDE drive is pointless. IDE drives are much more expensive than SATA, so much so, it's cheaper to get a PCI SATA card and buy a cheaper SATA drive.

I have lots of those IDE-SATA & SATA-IDE boards, yes they work nicely.
They operate by an transparent connection , and so they do not need drivers at all.  

 

Offline Simon

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well if you can get an ATA straight to SATA adapter that helps as it cuts out the PCI bus (that by the sounds of it might have a graphics card to handle too). But still, your putting a 375 MB/s bus behind a 133 MB/s bus (theoretically) so you might as well stick with ATA anyway and concentrate your money of fast mechanics.

By the way both SATA and ATA are IDE Integrated Drive Electronics, al it means is that the controller for the physical drive is part of the unit. This is a no brainier today, but back in the days when it was coined it was quite something to have a drive that had the controller for the disk on the same unit.
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Offline Kiriakos-GR

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I bet a good speed second hand ATA drive will be just as fast as a SATA drive with the adapter

ATA vs SATA HDD at the same RPM , SATA wins only at writing speed.
On the Read speed they are identical.
 

Offline Kiriakos-GR

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well if you can get an ATA straight to SATA adapter that helps as it cuts out the PCI bus (that by the sounds of it might have a graphics card to handle too). But still, your putting a 375 MB/s bus behind a 133 MB/s bus (theoretically) so you might as well stick with ATA anyway and concentrate your money of fast mechanics.

By the way both SATA and ATA are IDE Integrated Drive Electronics, al it means is that the controller for the physical drive is part of the unit. This is a no brainier today, but back in the days when it was coined it was quite something to have a drive that had the controller for the disk on the same unit.

I had never see any hard drive to limit the performance of it due the Bus speed (ATA100 vs 133) ,
yes mechanics works always slower than electronics.

About the SATA and ATA differences, you must think differently.
The Serial ATA connection, uses the same bandwidth about transmit - receive !!
The ATA connection does not .    
 
 

Offline Lawsen

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Thanks for your help.  It was orginally 256 MB RAM and it locks up and freezes once in awhile.  I got the RAM upgraded to maximum 1 GB RAM.  I will add a graphics card to it, when I get paid in the future.  PCI graphics card with 512 MB memory and Nvidia is only $40.00, inexpensive. 

Lawsen
 

Offline Mechatrommer

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i will hold my faith on SSD and Moore's Law. until it can match or closer to the current sata drive in term of $/MB.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2011, 04:08:47 am by Mechatrommer »
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