1950s book copyright - can I scan this and upload it?

[EEVblog]

So is robbery.
If we don't know what's right and what's wrong, we have become barbarians.

That's a crazy analogy.
Take this in context. It is 60+ year old technical book that is out of print. The author is likely dead, and the publisher has been gobbled up twice since then. I bet if you called the current publisher who technically would retain the rights (although you don't know what the contract was with the author), I'd bet money they'd have no idea they ever printed that book.
It is a book long forgotten in the annals of time. Classic case if there ever was for scanning and preservation. If the OP doesn't do it, who ever will?

[cimmo]

When trying to understand the bizarre intricacies and absurdities of copyright law, don't forget that somehow, the song "Happy Birthday to you" is still under copyright.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Happy_Birthday_to_You#Copyright_status

The other thing to remember is that copyright infringement (with some exceptions) is not a crime against the state,  but against an individual (corporations are also individuals).
It is no different than a dispute with a neighbour over a fence.

[IanB]

I'm sure the author put a lot of effort into writing the book in order to share knowledge with others. As such, the book contains the author's labour; it is the author who holds the moral rights to the work, not the original publisher. If any of us wrote such a book, I am sure we would be only too pleased to share it.

To me it seems like a no-brainer. If the author were still alive then asking for permission to reproduce it would be right and polite. But if the author has passed on, what better memorial to his memory than a work he created?

[Richard Crowley]

... the book contains the author's labour; it is the author who holds the moral rights to the work, not the original publisher.

We can believe that the author retains the "moral rights" to their work, but except in very recent times, putting all that labor into writing a book would get you nowhere without the services of a publisher. And publishers typically required transfer of legal rights ("copy-right") in order to put their effort into the printing, distribution, and promotion.

In recent times however, the internet has made "self-publishing" much more possible, not just for online distribution but even for one-off or on-demand printing of hard copies. I have recently purchased a couple of on-demand hard-copies, I believe from Amazon (or one of their subsidiaries). And the books were very well done for likely fully-automatic production from content in a database.  I was impressed.

[kc0ngu]

This web site :  http://comminfo.rutgers.edu/~lesk/copyrenew.html allows you to check publication copyright, for books published 1923 - 1964. Seems like a handy tool to confirm or otherwise copyright renewal.

[KJDS]

There are many available on abebooks

http://www.abebooks.co.uk/servlet/SearchResults?sts=t&an=Philip+Parker+-&sortby=3&x=38&y=6&tn=Electronics&kn=&isbn=

[TerraHertz]

There are many available on abebooks

http://www.abebooks.co.uk/servlet/SearchResults?sts=t&an=Philip+Parker+-&sortby=3&x=38&y=6&tn=Electronics&kn=&isbn=

Sigh. Shhh, you.  Five isn't 'many'. Now by the time I have $40 to spare for one of them, they will be all gone.
Had my eye on this 1st edition one:
 http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/BookDetailsPL?bi=7509104900&searchurl=an%3DPhilip%2BParker%26amp%3Bsts%3Dt%26amp%3Btn%3Delectronics    Price: US$ 20.00 Shipping: US$ 27.00

And yes, partly because I'd like to scan it.

[amyk]

This web site :  http://comminfo.rutgers.edu/~lesk/copyrenew.html allows you to check publication copyright, for books published 1923 - 1964. Seems like a handy tool to confirm or otherwise copyright renewal.

...for "U.S. copyright renewal records", so probably not going to contain anything from the UK.

[TerraHertz]

This web site :  http://comminfo.rutgers.edu/~lesk/copyrenew.html allows you to check publication copyright, for books published 1923 - 1964. Seems like a handy tool to confirm or otherwise copyright renewal.

...for "U.S. copyright renewal records", so probably not going to contain anything from the UK.

Wouldn't it have been quicker to try it? Like, as soon as you saw the link? Because:
------
Search results for query "Electronics Philip Parker" (411734 total records)

Matching 2 of 3 words; there is 1 item

CLNA: SEESE, MILDRED PARKER.
TITL: Electronics.
XREF: Millman, Jacob.
------
http://www.copyright.gov/docs/datafields.html
Data Fields in Copyright Cataloging Online Records
says
CLNA Name of claimant(s)
-------

More searching doesn't tell me who that person is (wife, descendant?) or if they are still alive. Or if they care.

Anyway, I still think it needs to be scanned.

[G7PSK]

Arnolds the publishers are no more having been taken over in 2001 and Philip Parker died in 1960 as far as I can make out.

[daqq]

So, I've had the book disassembled at a local bookbinder (under 3 EUR, they have great services and prices) and started scanning the individual page blocks, then I will have it reassembled (which will cost 7 EUR with repairs to the binding included). So far I've managed to scan about 1/4 or 1/5th of the book, it went pretty quickly. Though some postprocessing (any volunteers, hints for automated OCR? ) will be needed.

I've uploaded what I've got so far. Note: The pages are pretty much ordered randomly.


WARNING: 90 MEG file
http://daqq.eu/temp/1of4.zip

[mikeselectricstuff]

How is this wrong?

Copying a book without copyright is stealing.

Copying a long out-of print book is more like dumpster diving

[n45048]

Just do it. For those who never break a law (travelling slightly above the speed limit or not coming to a complete stop at every stop sign), then don't download it and you have nothing to worry yourself about.

[monksod]

Maybe we should all face the fact that the very idea of "copyright" is becoming largely obsolete. Torrent sites thrive & nearly everyone is a "pirate" in some way. And I think this is a good thing, in a way? Information (and entertainment) should be free. We gotta change our perspectives & get out of this "monetary reward" mindset (which is dragging this entire planet down into hell atm)... Money shouldn't be the incentive to help others or create art etc. That's fundamentally abhorrent, when you get right down to it.

[Richard Crowley]

Maybe we should all face the fact that the very idea of "copyright" is becoming largely obsolete. Torrent sites thrive & nearly everyone is a "pirate" in some way. And I think this is a good thing, in a way? Information (and entertainment) should be free. We gotta change our perspectives & get out of this "monetary reward" mindset (which is dragging this entire planet down into hell atm)... Money shouldn't be the incentive to help others or create art etc. That's fundamentally abhorrent, when you get right down to it.

Please reveal to us how you propose to pay the people who produce and distribute all that "free" information and entertainment?  And if you can accomplish that, maybe you can take a crack at how you propose to incentivize the creative process to get these things going in the first place. 

You seem to have no concept of how things work in the Real World. Do you think the computer you are reading this on right now would have been developed and mass-produced (so you could afford it) without the capitalist profit-motive? Do you think installing the billions of $£¥€ worth of internet infrastructure to bring this website (and your bittorrents) to you happened on its own?   

[BillyD]

Maybe we should all face the fact that the very idea of "copyright" is becoming largely obsolete. Torrent sites thrive & nearly everyone is a "pirate" in some way. And I think this is a good thing, in a way? Information (and entertainment) should be free. We gotta change our perspectives & get out of this "monetary reward" mindset (which is dragging this entire planet down into hell atm)... Money shouldn't be the incentive to help others or create art etc. That's fundamentally abhorrent, when you get right down to it.

Please reveal to us how you propose to pay the people who produce and distribute all that "free" information and entertainment?  And if you can accomplish that, maybe you can take a crack at how you propose to incentivize the creative process to get these things going in the first place. 

You seem to have no concept of how things work in the Real World. Do you think the computer you are reading this on right now would have been developed and mass-produced (so you could afford it) without the capitalist profit-motive? Do you think installing the billions of $£¥€ worth of internet infrastructure to bring this website (and your bittorrents) to you happened on its own?   

He may actually have been being sarcastic, although it's possible to infer many different tones from written words. Agree with your point though.

[dexters_lab]

So, I've had the book disassembled at a local bookbinder (under 3 EUR, they have great services and prices) and started scanning the individual page blocks, then I will have it reassembled (which will cost 7 EUR with repairs to the binding included). So far I've managed to scan about 1/4 or 1/5th of the book, it went pretty quickly. Though some postprocessing (any volunteers, hints for automated OCR? ) will be needed.

I've uploaded what I've got so far. Note: The pages are pretty much ordered randomly.


WARNING: 90 MEG file
http://daqq.eu/temp/1of4.zip

i scanned in a 1000+ page book a few years ago, used VueScan to scan it with low contrast settings and then post processed an example page in photoshop, then used the settings to batch process the remaining images. My book was 50/50 text & graphics do opted not to do any OCR with it.

[Richard Crowley]

So, I've had the book disassembled at a local bookbinder (under 3 EUR, they have great services and prices) and started scanning the individual page blocks, then I will have it reassembled (which will cost 7 EUR with repairs to the binding included). So far I've managed to scan about 1/4 or 1/5th of the book, it went pretty quickly. Though some postprocessing (any volunteers, hints for automated OCR? ) will be needed.

I've uploaded what I've got so far. Note: The pages are pretty much ordered randomly.

How were the pages imaged?  There appears to be a shadow through the middle which suggests that the pages weren't flat against the glass when imaged. Unbinding the book is pretty aggressive. It would be  a shame to discard that effort by not keeping the pages perfectly flat and lighted evenly when imaged.

So the pages appear to be in signature order. (as printed before stitching each signature together).  But when you separate the individual pages into individual files (or put them into a PDF file) it is easy enough to re-order them sequentially.

[retrolefty]

Just do it, and if someone complains, take it down.

+1

 As at work (before retirement), it is easier to ask forgiveness then permission. 

[TerraHertz]

Yay, this thread bumped up again. Which reminded me, I now could afford to buy that copy I linked to. It was still available (amazingly) and I got it. I *hope* it was still actually in the shop, rather than just a dead listing. Touch wood, that nothing goes wrong in the post and reshipping.

Edit to add:

So, I've had the book disassembled at a local bookbinder (under 3 EUR, they have great services and prices) and started scanning the individual page blocks, then I will have it reassembled (which will cost 7 EUR with repairs to the binding included). So far I've managed to scan about 1/4 or 1/5th of the book, it went pretty quickly. Though some postprocessing (any volunteers, hints for automated OCR? ) will be needed.

I've uploaded what I've got so far. Note: The pages are pretty much ordered randomly.

WARNING: 90 MEG file
http://daqq.eu/temp/1of4.zip

Wow, that really is an amazing book. I'm eagerly awaiting having a copy in hand.
Daqq, you're going to a lot of trouble to scan it and kudos to you for that. But I think the result could be better with some improvements in your technique.
Main points:
 * You have to get the pages flat on the glass. A springy backing, pressed hard on the document, is not optional. Holding the paper down with a few fingers doesn't work. Yes I know that's what  you're doing, see pic 04 below - there's your hand. The dark shading on most pages is due to not having the paper flat.

 * TIFF is a non-lossy file format - that's good. But doing the scan in two-tone B&W (Fax mode) then letting the scanner software dither dots to approximate fine tonal shading, is a disaster. It also results in character edge jaggies. The large file sizes despite fairly lo-res scan and Fax mode, is due to coding all those dots for the dithered shading. The data loss is not recoverable via post processing.
I hope you didn't yet scan the other three quarters of the book the same way. Because, I'm sad to say and knowing you won't like to hear this, it should be all done over again. In gray scale, and at high enough resolution to avoid moire pattering in the few toned photographs in the book. Since you went to the effort and expense of dissecting the book, it's a shame to get sub-par scanning results.

 * You have bleed-through of the text on the back of the pages. This is highly undesirable too. Can be avoided.

Sorry to be blunt. I'm trying to save you putting in effort that will only result in griping from people who read the document you create.

Last year I started writing an article on the techniques of scanning and digital book creation. It's one of those background projects that goes very slowly, not least because I'm still struggling with the techniques for dealing with print photo-screening. Which will be a section of the article, so I want to get that right before posting the article. Long way to go yet.
But for now I've put a draft copy here: http://everist.org/temp/On_scanning.htm
Also related: http://everist.org/temp/20140812_disconnecting_the_dots.htm
Maybe a few useful points for you.

Ha ha... and that 126 page HP computer manual - I've decided I have to scan it all again, because at that time I hadn't figured out how to eliminate bleedthrough of the text on the back of sheets, and there's too much of it.

[daqq]

Hi Terraherthz,

Thanks for the tips, I'll look into it. I'll poke around the setting and see if anything will be better.

The reason I was holding the book down with my hand was that it was really fast - the scanner in question is a real beast - I was doing somewhere around 4 pages/min - that's 16 book pages, without closing the lid. But you are right, quality suffered. I might get one of our interns to "volunteer" :-D Nah, I'll do it manually, though it will take more time.

Anyways, yeah, the book is really great, I'm pretty sure you could design your own tube with the stuff there.

[Psi]

Copying a book without copyright is stealing.

Nope, its not stealing. Stealing/theft have clear definitions under the law and do not apply to duplicating something. It is "copyright infringement"

The book is no longer in print for goodness sake so no one is loosing anything.

Unfortunately, as long as you don't own the copyright, you have no say in that.

IMHO copyright was never intended to be used this way and everyone should take a stand by disregarding it when it is obviously wrong.
Old works that are no longer published should not be copyright.

If i had my way copyright would last 10 years max and only a person (or group of people where appropriate) could have copyright on something, not a company or business entity.  The people would also have to be the ones who were personally involved in making or discovered the key aspects of the works.
The music artist(s) could own the copyright, but not their agent or recording studio etc..

[vk6zgo]

Technical Books are largely made up of a re-hash of stuff which is already Public Domain at the time of writing.
Fiction or original works of scholarship are a more obvious case for copyright protection.

Electronics took off in the early part of the 20th Century despite the efforts of various groups to confine knowledge by means of patents,copyright,etc.
As it was in the interest of Electronics component manufacturers to sell a lot of parts,they eventually gave up & provided technical information quite widely.

I'm quite sure the old magazines like "Radio & Hobbies"in Oz,& Wireless World"in the UK didn't peruse patents & copyright every time they produced a new project.

[monksod]

Please reveal to us how you propose to pay the people who produce and distribute all that "free" information and entertainment?  And if you can accomplish that, maybe you can take a crack at how you propose to incentivize the creative process to get these things going in the first place. 

Man, you really think the creative process requires "incentivizing" with money? You are obviously not artistically inclined. 

You seem to have no concept of how things work in the Real World.

Lol... in capitals even? 

Do you think the computer you are reading this on right now would have been developed and mass-produced (so you could afford it) without the capitalist profit-motive?

Well, there's no reason why it couldn't be possible, is there? Which one of us has the wrong grasp on human nature I wonder? 

Do you think installing the billions of $£¥€ worth of internet infrastructure to bring this website (and your bittorrents) to you happened on its own?   

No.

[TerraHertz]

Electronics took off in the early part of the 20th Century despite the efforts of various groups to confine knowledge by means of patents,copyright,etc.

Further to that:
http://www.spiegel.de/international/zeitgeist/no-copyright-law-the-real-reason-for-germany-s-industrial-expansion-a-710976.html
No Copyright Law - The Real Reason for Germany's Industrial Expansion?
By Frank Thadeusz  08/18/2010

Both copyright and patent law as originally envisaged were somewhat beneficial to original creators. Now both have been twisted and perverted into tools of the corporations, almost entirely used to hinder human progress.

http://everist.org/archives/links/__Copyright_DRM_links.txt