555th video

[peter.mitchell]

Build a 555 out of discreets and get it working on the breadboard!

[creyc]

How about Dave's List of 5's? I'm thinking something along the lines of "5 things Dave is PRO on, 5 things Dave is CON on, and 5 things Dave thinks everyone should remember". It could have multiple "segments", one with pros/cons/reminders on PCB design, one on opamps, one on uC's, etc, etc. I think it'd make for a very fast paced (or rambling... ) & fun episode!

I second this idea, but since it's in accordance with a particular number 555, I feel like it should definitely be just 1 video, 1 segment.

We don't need multiple segments on the things Dave doesn't like, I think we get a dose of that every week! 

[Corporate666]

On a side note, Dave, I hope you will NOT be doing a 666th video... there are those of us who are extremely religious and penitent and it should go without saying that a video numbered after satan is just not on.

Please do not dismiss this as foolishness or improper piety as many buildings do not have a 13th floor, and there are so many Christians in the world, that they can't all be wrong - therefore no 666th video should ever be produced.

Mmm'kay?





</sarcasm>





As for the 555 video... 5*5*5  = 125.  I vote for 125 minutes of Dave ranting about anything and everything.  Nothing is better than a Dave rant.  It's the most enjoyable part of ANY video, especially the highly emoted pejoratives.  DIIIIIICKheads!!!! etc. 

[dr.diesel]

Agreed, hard to beat a well worded rant:

[AndersAnd]

Build a 555 out of discreets and get it working on the breadboard!

A Discrete 555 Timer kit has already been made by Eric Schlaepfer, in collaboration with Evil Mad Scientist Laboratories:
http://tubetime.us/?p=153
http://www.evilmadscientist.com/2013/555-kit/

Sold here:
http://shop.evilmadscientist.com/productsmenu/tinykitlist/652
https://www.adafruit.com/products/1526

[Kjelt]

A Discrete 555 Timer kit has already been made by Eric Schlaepfer, in collaboration with Evil Mad Scientist Laboratories:

Holymoly that thing is huge, with that size they could have also upgraded the specs like 100V , 10Amps 

[strangelovemd12]

The humble 555 chip has been around for 42 years, and a few dozen are made every second.  But many chips have not been so lucky.  I propose 555 minutes of silence, to honor these less fortunate chips.  Preferably streamed live.

[walshms]

Holymoly that thing is huge, with that size they could have also upgraded the specs like 100V , 10Amps 

And if Dave doesn't already have one, he almost certainly will... I don't think he'll be able to resist... 

Very cool... and very well done.

[SeanB]

Only problem is they are using 2N transistors with 100mA of current. they need to upgrade the output devices and the discharge transistor to 2N2219A's to give the drive ability of the real device.

[Stonent]

Only problem is they are using 2N transistors with 100mA of current. they need to upgrade the output devices and the discharge transistor to 2N2219A's to give the drive ability of the real device.

Dangit, I wish I would have read this 24 hours ago before I put in a Tayda order for 13 2N3904's and 13 2N3906's.

I do have some PN2222A and some 2N2907A transistors though.

I just blindly ordered off the BOM that they had without thinking about the current.

[SeanB]

Use the PN2222A's on the output and pin 7 and it will look the same. Myself I would buy all 2N2222A and 2N2907A and make it a period matching unit ( all same style metal cans like the TO100 version of the device) and if I was doing a board then I would add a simple 8 pin TO100 footprint connected to nothing and solder in one of the TO100 555 timers I have around just as a size comparison.

[Kjelt]

Funny still that difference between the US and 2Nxxxx series of transistors en Europe using the BCxxx/BDxxx series of transistors, how is this in other parts of the world?

[AndersAnd]

Funny still that difference between the US and 2Nxxxx series of transistors en Europe using the BCxxx/BDxxx series of transistors, how is this in other parts of the world?

I think BCxxx/BDxxx are mainly used here in Europe.

The European BCxxx/BDxxx part numbers are assigned by Pro Electron: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pro_Electron

Pro Electron

Pro Electron/EECA is the European type designation and registration system for active components (such as semiconductors, liquid crystal displays, sensor devices, electronic tubes and cathode ray tubes).

Pro Electron was set up in 1966 in Brussels, Belgium. In 1983 it was merged with the European Electronic Component Manufacturers Association (EECA) and since then operates as an agency of the EECA.

The goal of Pro Electron is to allow unambiguous identification of electronic parts, even when made by several different manufacturers. To this end, manufacturers register new devices with the agency and receive new type designators for them.

The American 2Nxxxx numbers on the other hand are assigned by JEDEC https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JEDEC

JEDEC

The JEDEC Solid State Technology Association, formerly known as the Joint Electron Device Engineering Council (JEDEC), is an independent semiconductor engineering trade organization and standardization body. Associated with the Electronic Industries Alliance (EIA), a trade association that represents all areas of the electronics industry in the United States, JEDEC has over 300 members, including some of the world's largest computer companies.

The funny thing is the difference is only for active components. For passive components like diodes Europe also use 1Nxxxx like 1N4001, 1N4148 etc.

In Japan they use the JIS semiconductor designation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JIS_semiconductor_designation

JIS semiconductor designation

Japanese Industrial Standards (JIS) has standard JIS-C-7012 for semiconductor part numbers. The first digit denotes the p-n junction count ("3" may also denote a dual-gate FET); then follows the letter "S", then:

So JIS starts with "1S" for diodes and "2S" for transistors (instead of the American "1N" and "2N"), followed by a second letter depending on the type (e.g. C for high frequency NPN BJTs and D for audio frequency NPN BJTs). Sometimes the "2S" prefix is not marked on the package.

Not sure about the rest of Asia and other continents/countries, I think they use one of the 3 standards above as I don't think others have their own naming standards?
But maybe Soviet Union/Russia had/have their own standard too? They had their own Russian tube designations: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_tube_designations


It would have been much easier if there was only one universal standard instead of both European, American and Japanese standards.

[Kjelt]

Thanks didn't know that. Only had the pain sometimes to see an american schematic and unable to obtain any of its parts and had to lookup all the equivalents.

[AndersAnd]

Thanks didn't know that. Only had the pain sometimes to see an American schematic and unable to obtain any of its parts and had to lookup all the equivalents.

Exactly. There's no real reason to use different naming standards, it just makes annoying to try to find equivalents or someone locally selling the American or Japanese transistors.

It's very annoying to repair for example Japanese audio amplifiers and trying to find a Japanese output transistor or an European equivalent. It's often impossible to find a direct equivalent with the same Hfe, pinout, voltage and current ratings etc. For simple on/off transistor circuits it doesn't matter much if Hfe etc. is identical, but for more analog amplifying circuits it matters.


But there's a lot of annoyances because of different standards used around the world.
For example the UK and others driving in the wrong side of the road.
Or the 110/120 Volt/60 Hz vs. 230 Volt/50 Hz issues and dozens of different mains plug types even for the same mains voltages.  At least the EU harmonized the 240 Volt used in the UK and the 220 Volt used in mainland Europe to 230 Volt some years ago. But it's unthinkalbe to do the same with 120 vs. 230 Volt.

Of course the 120 vs 230 Volt issue has become easier with universal SMPS, that accepts all mains voltages used around the world. But you still have the problem with different mains plugs.

But it would also be much easier if every country around the world used the same language. You wouldn't have to waste time learning foreign languages and everyone would be able to communicate. Not to mention not having to write user's manual in 100 different languages.

[kxenos]

But it would also be much easier if every country around the world used the same language. You wouldn't have to waste time learning foreign languages...

no no no, don't mix technical stuff with culture/history stuff please. Saying that all the world should have same technical standards is one thing but saying that we should all have same language etc. is a very fascistic idea. The world is richer because we have multiple mindsets, languages, cultures and civilizations...

[Six_Shooter]

But it would also be much easier if every country around the world used the same language. You wouldn't have to waste time learning foreign languages...

no no no, don't mix technical stuff with culture/history stuff please. Saying that all the world should have same technical standards is one thing but saying that we should all have same language etc. is a very fascistic idea. The world is richer because we have multiple mindsets, languages, cultures and civilizations...

I didn't read it as the would should have the same language used for communication, but that it would be easier, even though it's more than just unlikely.

Basically, he's saying that while things would be easier to be standardized, it's just not going to happen, and we've learned to deal with it in each case.

[AndersAnd]

Yes I didn't say everyone should use the same language, just that a lot of things would be much easier if that was the case.
But more and more is in English these days even if you're not in an English speaking country. More and more local companies here has English as official corporate language.
Just about every book used at engineering colleges here is in English. Except for mechanical engineers who I'm told also use a lot of German material, probably because of the long history of a big steel industry in Germany, and because most Danes learn both English and German in school.
It's too expensive to translate and maintain most technical literature to a tiny market like Denmark, so almost all technical literature used here is in English, usually books from American authors.
But enough about that.


Regarding sourcing rare transistors etc., since the Internet became widespread it has become much easier to find Japanese and American transistors here and other even more exotic parts. Before the Internet it could be very hard to even find a datasheet for some transistors, so it was very hard to even have a chance to find an equivalent part. The small yellow semiconductor database books from ECA was very popular back then, to find data and equivalent parts: http://eca.de
But now you can find most of the needed info on the Internet and order most parts from around the world online at eBay, AliExpress, Mouser DigiKey etc. if you can't find it locally.

[Stonent]

On the subject of transistor naming  standards where does MPSA fit in?

[AndersAnd]

On the subject of transistor naming  standards where does MPSA fit in?

I believe that's a Motorola (now ON Semiconductor) proprietary naming prefix

Here's what I googled: http://forum.allaboutcircuits.com/showthread.php?t=32827

I wish the naming of transistors was organised a bit better, but there are 3 main naming systems (summarised, as BeenThere mentioned, at wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transistor) and they give some clues to the device from the name....

1. Pro-Electron (European) naming scheme:
(nnn=3 digits or letter+2 digits, sometimes followed by letters to specify gain groups, voltage rating, etc.)
ACnnn = Germanium audio transistor (old) (PNP often are even numbers)
ADnnn = ... power ... (AD14x usually TO3 case)
AFnnn = ... RF (high frequency) transistor (AF11x: often TO-7 case)
AA...,AY...,AZ... = Germanium diodes, rectifiers, and zener diodes

BCnnn = Silicon audio/general purpose transistors.
BDnnn = Silicon power transistors
BFnnn = Silicon RF transistors, or JFETs
BLnnn = Silicon transmitting transistors (power+RF)
BPnnn = Silicon phototransistors
BSnnn = Silicon switching transistors (and some MOSFETs)
BTnnn = Triacs, SCRs, etc.
BUnnn = Silicon very high voltage, e.g. TV Horizontal deflection
BAnnn, BBnnn,BYnnn & BZnnn are diodes,dual/varicap diodes, rectifiers & zeners

2. Everything else:
1N.... = diodes (or rectifiers), but 1N5GT is a pentode!
1S... = diodes/rectifiers
2N.... = (JEDEC) transistors, Triacs, SCRs, JFETs or MOSFETs (but not dual-gate)
PN.... = transistors etc. (Often the plastic case equivalent of 2N....)
MPS... = transistors - often the Motorola plastic case equivalent of 2N....
MPSA.. = bipolar transistors, sometimes Darlingtons, originally Motorola brand, PNP complement found by adding 50 to the 2-digit number, e.g. MPSA05 -> MPSA55
MJ.... = Motorola power transistors; numbering slightly related to JEDEC, e.g. MJ2955 is PNP version of 2N3055 (you see why I say SLIGHTLY!)
MJL.... = Motorola "linear" (hi-fi) transistors, sometimes the numeric part of the type number relates to a Toshiba 2S.... part that it copies.
2SA... to 2SJ... (see wiki article for these Japanese types; be aware that a J176 might be two different things - an abbreviation of 2SJ176 or a completely different animal!)
ZTX... Zetex brand transistors - just sometimes the number following ZTX corresponds to a BC... number
NKT... really old Newmarket transistors, just included to show there are zillions of prefixes (and all those RCA numbers without prefixes) that make it hard to follow.

Having many standards is just another way of saying there is NO standard! Some time I feel I should explain how the transistor naming scheme could be made a bit better organised - although, realistically, there is a limit to how far people should try, so I somewhat agree with peranders saying you have to look at the datasheets.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transistor#Proprietary

Proprietary

Manufacturers of devices may have their own proprietary numbering system, for example CK722. Note that a manufacturer's prefix (like "MPF" in MPF102, which originally would denote a Motorola FET) now is an unreliable indicator of who made the device. Some proprietary naming schemes adopt parts of other naming schemes, for example a PN2222A is a (possibly Fairchild Semiconductor) 2N2222A in a plastic case (but a PN108 is a plastic version of a BC108, not a 2N108, while the PN100 is unrelated to other xx100 devices).

Military part numbers sometimes are assigned their own codes, such as the British Military CV Naming System.

Manufacturers buying large numbers of similar parts may have them supplied with "house numbers", identifying a particular purchasing specification and not necessarily a device with a standardized registered number. For example, an HP part 1854,0053 is a (JEDEC) 2N2218 transistor[45][46] which is also assigned the CV number: CV7763[47]

Naming problems

With so many independent naming schemes, and the abbreviation of part numbers when printed on the devices, ambiguity sometimes occurs. For example two different devices may be marked "J176" (one the J176 low-power Junction FET, the other the higher-powered MOSFET 2SJ176).

As older "through-hole" transistors are given surface-mount packaged counterparts, they tend to be assigned many different part numbers because manufacturers have their own systems to cope with the variety in pinout arrangements and options for dual or matched n–p–n+p–n–p devices in one pack. So even when the original device (such as a 2N3904) may have been assigned by a standards authority, and well known by engineers over the years, the new versions are far from standardized in their naming.

Unfortunately the last Naming problems paragraph tells us we are not getting closer to an universal naming standard, but the contrary when SMD versions of standardized leaded transistors gets different names depending on the manufacturer.

[G7PSK]

Its not only Daves 555th video this year its also the 50th anniversary of Dr. Who. So I think that it would be very cool if Dave came up with a Dalek voice device that used 555's.

[Stonent]

A ring modulator.

[JohnnyGringo]

A Sonic Screwdriver. Of course!

[AndersAnd]

Will he make a A 555 Footstool? http://www.evilmadscientist.com/2011/555-footstool/

[Stonent]

Even better would be a walking, remote controlled, 555.