Author Topic: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt  (Read 7075 times)

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Offline edy

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #25 on: February 18, 2019, 12:49:26 am »
I keep hearing the terms cryptocurrency and block chain being thrown around in the media and everyone and their grandmother seems to be in on some kind of get rich scheme. My limited understanding of it is that while block chain technology has usage in many industries (one of which happens to be cryptocurrency) it does not necessarily validate or give credence to cryptocurrency as a stable, reliable, "secure" means of financial exchange. There are huge differences between what we use as money, even though it is a "fiat" currency as well (now far removed from the gold-backed treasury systems of yester-year), and cryptocurrency, with enormous risks found in the latter which are obviously downplayed by people rushing into this area looking to make big bucks in speculative investments... nothing more than the next derivative market, and I use the term "legalized" loosely when I say legalized gambling.

For one, if you managed to get in on Bitcoin early enough, your "money" was really created on the backs of algorithms... computing cycles to fabricate and then lock in (as part of the block chain) the bitcoins. It was this "work" and difficulty and limited pool of bitcoin (which is harder and harder to calculate) that gave it value. After that, the entire value of bitcoin jumped exponentially due to people jumping in on the bandwagon speculating and not wanting to waste the resources needed to compute further bitcoin. Every cryptocurrency seems to start this way. As long as you have enough people believing this and treating it like money, it behaves that way (much like our little paper or plastic bills we carry around). However without major adoption by governments and all the legal protections, banking rules, financial oversight and controls that real money has, it will always fall short and be nothing more than a highly volatile "currency" and as such will result in continuing to be that way. Chicken-egg problem.

Now I have nothing against cryptocurrrency as long as people are aware of what they are getting into. It also doesn't help its reputation when malware and crypto-jacking today scams people into buying cryptocurrency or hijacks your computing cycles to create more crypto for hackers or advertising agencies... much of it to avoid tracking for illegal purposes. I do find the idea interesting as a means for publishers to get paid for their content (by you donating some of your computing power in generating cryptocurrency for the site). However what we have today is a crazy market where you hear $300,000,000 worth of bitcoin lost... what does that even mean? Poof it's gone... but if it was just artificially created value which speculators drove up into the clouds, how do you equate this with real value?

Anyways, just my two cents. I also contemplated running some cryptominers but realized it wasn't economical for me and when you have Chinese farms mining for next to nothing and cashing in on millions in illicit operations and hackers contributing to the rise in values by hording or holding people hostage by demanding they trade real cash for bitcoin (driving the "value" up) I just don't see this as an alternative at this time. Perhaps the entire system needs to mature a few more years and get through some major upsets before the masses trust it. Until then I am keeping far far away but keeping a keen interest in this.   :popcorn:
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Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #26 on: February 18, 2019, 12:57:01 am »
No disagreement there, but you are talking about the value of money while I am talking about liquidity. And that is the caution I made in my original reply to RoGeorge's post. Your original post indicates the liquidity of "physical money bills" is equal to a criptocurrency or other representation. Being pragmatic, this is not simply a perceived difference; it was decided by international agreement that FIAT money carries value and was defined as the basis for goods exchange in intranational and international exchanges.

I am not talking about the value money has in the act of goods exchange: I surely know in practice that FIAT money can be equally worthless or valued depending on the conditions (war, famine, transnational exchanges, etc).
Try paying with Yen or Turkish Lira in the US, or any similar country and currency switcharoo. Or even try paying with the right currency cash in a card only place. It's probably easier to use that cryptocurrency. Internationally the latter may even be more universal than most fiat currencies.
 

Online rsjsouza

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #27 on: February 18, 2019, 09:54:57 pm »
Try paying with Yen or Turkish Lira in the US, or any similar country and currency switcharoo. Or even try paying with the right currency cash in a card only place. It's probably easier to use that cryptocurrency. Internationally the latter may even be more universal than most fiat currencies.
Ok, last one on this from me.
I surely know in practice that FIAT money can be equally worthless or valued depending on the conditions (war, famine, transnational exchanges, etc).
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Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #28 on: February 18, 2019, 10:04:46 pm »
Ok, last one on this from me.
I surely know in practice that FIAT money can be equally worthless or valued depending on the conditions (war, famine, transnational exchanges, etc).
The conclusion is that it depends on the circumstances, in both cases.
 

Offline Deodand2014

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #29 on: March 08, 2019, 09:02:42 am »
And it looks like the cryptomoney has 'disappeared'...

Quote
Last month, Canadian cryptocurrency exchange QuadrigaCX found itself in an unusual situation, even by the standards of this lawless, scam-happy industry: The only person with the passwords to the exchange’s trove of cold storage funds allegedly died, taking access to customers’ money to the grave with him. Now it seems many of the digital wallets identified as potentially containing those funds are entirely empty.

https://www.gizmodo.com.au/2019/03/crypto-exchange-says-its-founder-died-with-clients-180-millionbut-the-money-is-missing/
 

Online macboy

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #30 on: March 08, 2019, 04:27:38 pm »
http://dayssinceacryptocurrencyexchangehaslostmorethan100million.com/    :-DD
Based on that, there are certainly a few people in the world making their mega fortunes in crypto, but it's not so much the miners or traders.  It's the scammers who perpetrate these 'accidental' blunders causing multiple $100M to be 'lost'.
 

Offline Bud

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #31 on: March 08, 2019, 05:44:52 pm »
Seems they found the cold wallets but all of them are empty. So the passwords that only the dead CEO knew do not matter.

https://www.halifaxtoday.ca/local-news/search-into-missing-cryptocurrency-turns-up-empty-cold-wallets-report-1268687
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Offline Marco

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #32 on: March 08, 2019, 05:54:09 pm »
Ernst and Young seems pretty capable in cryptocurrency, of course they are going to eat up most of the recoverable money, but still.
 

Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #33 on: March 08, 2019, 05:56:18 pm »
Seems they found the cold wallets but all of them are empty. So the passwords that only the dead CEO knew do not matter.

https://www.halifaxtoday.ca/local-news/search-into-missing-cryptocurrency-turns-up-empty-cold-wallets-report-1268687
Empty so far. I wouldn't get my hopes up, but still.
 

Offline Psi

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #34 on: June 25, 2019, 09:59:43 pm »
When it comes to crypto currency, if you want it safe you have to store it yourself.
Only you can decide just how safe you want it to be.
If you let someone else decide how safe they want your money to be then you cant be surprised when this sort of thing happens.
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Offline windsmurf

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #35 on: June 25, 2019, 11:33:30 pm »
When it comes to crypto currency, if you want it safe you have to store it yourself.
Only you can decide just how safe you want it to be.
If you let someone else decide how safe they want your money to be then you cant be surprised when this sort of thing happens.

Many believe he faked his own death in India and made away with cash.
https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/24/18715959/quadrigacx-canadian-cryptocurrency-exchange-report-founder-transferred-money-spending
« Last Edit: June 25, 2019, 11:35:55 pm by windsmurf »
 

Offline Stray Electron

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #36 on: June 26, 2019, 12:40:31 am »
  Well so much for the idea that crypto currencies are secure! Anyone that puts their money into a crypto currency after this needs to have their head examined.
 

Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #37 on: June 26, 2019, 12:49:29 am »
  Well so much for the idea that crypto currencies are secure! Anyone that puts their money into a crypto currency after this needs to have their head examined.
That's like claiming paper money isn't secure after you gave a stack of it to that mysteriously successful uncle and he made it disappear.
 

Offline Bud

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #38 on: June 26, 2019, 12:54:28 am »
Evidently, from this case, cryptocurrency is secure. Do not confuse security with mismanagement. What happened was a case of lack of proper key management.

I find it amusing that noone saw the dead body. No grave, no photos from the funeral, no documents of transferring the body from India to Canada (he was not buried in India, was he). Even more amusing is that noone seem to be doing investigation into this aspect.
Edit: at least i have not seen any evidence.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2019, 12:56:18 am by Bud »
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Online EEVblog

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #39 on: June 26, 2019, 01:07:09 am »
Well so much for the idea that crypto currencies are secure! Anyone that puts their money into a crypto currency after this needs to have their head examined.

Crypto currencies are just as secure as cash. If you give the cash to someone else to hold/manage then, well...
It's trivial to get your own hardware wallet and store your crypto in that, then no one can steal it unless they physically have your hardware wallet and code, or your backup paper code.
 

Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #40 on: June 26, 2019, 01:15:03 am »
Evidently, from this case, cryptocurrency is secure. Do not confuse security with mismanagement. What happened was a case of lack of proper key management.

I find it amusing that noone saw the dead body. No grave, no photos from the funeral, no documents of transferring the body from India to Canada (he was not buried in India, was he). Even more amusing is that noone seem to be doing investigation into this aspect.
Edit: at least i have not seen any evidence.
I think people smelled a rat right away.
 

Offline AlbertL

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #41 on: September 29, 2021, 12:00:17 pm »
The last time money disappeared from my conventional bank account is...let me check...seems like...apparently...never!
 

Offline sokoloff

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Re: A Lot Of Folk Without Their Own Crypto-Lockers Are Going To Get Burnt
« Reply #42 on: September 29, 2021, 01:00:18 pm »
The last time money disappeared from my conventional bank account is...let me check...seems like...apparently...never!
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