Author Topic: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!  (Read 26609 times)

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Offline tggzzz

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #225 on: July 01, 2023, 12:26:09 pm »
Around here there's a chap who rides a sit-on monowheel and wears the full protective gear (bike helmet, leathers) because it will save him from being damaged by the pedestrians he might mow down. Rides through the middle of town in the pedestrian precinct, along the pavement out of the town centre. And is employed at the council office, so clearly they don't give a shit. Not cool to nick one of their own, you know, and parking tickets are more lucrative.

If there are any laws specifically for monocycles, I expect they will be the same as for tricycles and bicycles.

I used to work in a (fur lined) cube farm. Sometimes there was a whoosh followed by a crump, as someone learning to use a monocyle whizzed past and hit a shoulder-height partition. Separately, before the farm was fully populated, another person used to lay his parachute out on the floor to air, before repacking it. Happy daze.
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Offline coppice

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #226 on: July 01, 2023, 04:26:05 pm »
Quote
"Just think how stupid the average person is, then realize that half of them are stupider than that!"

Pedantically, average is not necessarily the halfway mark. You could have an average where most of the population are above it  ;)
So, you don't think intelligence doesn't follow a Gaussian distribution? You have some reason why it might not have a stable mean, and not follow the central limit theorem? Perhaps you think its more like a Pareto distribution?
 

Offline PlainName

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #227 on: July 01, 2023, 04:32:22 pm »
Quote
"Just think how stupid the average person is, then realize that half of them are stupider than that!"

Pedantically, average is not necessarily the halfway mark. You could have an average where most of the population are above it  ;)
So, you don't think intelligence doesn't follow a Gaussian distribution? You have some reason why it might not have a stable mean, and not follow the central limit theorem? Perhaps you think its more like a Pareto distribution?

I have no idea - I was just making a joke out of being a pedant, and put a smiley on it in an attempt to give the humourless a clue.
 

Offline TimFox

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #228 on: July 01, 2023, 04:32:28 pm »
I doubt that measured "IQ" is a truly valid quantitative measurement of anything beyond the ability to score on IQ tests.
However, in current psychometry the scores are normalized to a normal (Gaussian) distribution with mean = 100 and standard deviation = 15.
In that distribution, (the median) = (the mean) = (the mode).
 

Offline Nominal Animal

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #229 on: July 01, 2023, 04:37:33 pm »
So, you don't think intelligence doesn't follow a Gaussian distribution?
We do not know the shape of the g factor distribution, and it might not have a nice normal distribution, although somewhat normal (Gaussian) is considered most likely.

Intelligence test scores are normalized to a Gaussian distribution within the target population, so the fact that any set of IQ test results converges to a normal distribution is expected from the test scoring calibration directly, and does not require the measured aspects of intelligence to have a normal distribution at all.

I doubt that measured "IQ" is a truly valid quantitative measurement of anything beyond the ability to score on IQ tests.
Principal components analysis done on large enough datasets (IQ-style questions), to uncover the relative g factors of participating humans, does seem to be a valid measurement of something: see e.g. practical validity chapter of the Wikipedia g-factor article for references.

I find the g factor to have a rational basis, and the principal component analysis (assuming sufficiently large number of individual questions) should erase most types of e.g. cultural biases, assuming the medium used (paper, computer, oral, whatever) for the questions is equally familiar to all participants.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2023, 04:45:29 pm by Nominal Animal »
 

Offline Zero999Topic starter

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #230 on: July 01, 2023, 04:55:07 pm »
Where?  In the US it is not "markedly higher".  What exactly are you referring to?  Can you give a reference?

I have not personally confirmed this to be accurate but here it is:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate


Road deaths per 1 billion km driven, USA 8.3, UK 3.8, that is certainly what I would call "markedly higher", it's more than double. Just scanning down the list the USA is higher than the majority of other developed nations.
As you've said, I suspect it's due to more younger drivers and perhaps the road layouts, which are responsible for the higher number of road deaths per mile in the US, compared to the UK.  I don't know about the US, but here it's quite difficult to pass the driving test, which consists of a theory, as well as a practical test, there's a blanket speed limit of 30 mph in residential areas, dropping to 20 mph in high risk areas and separate lanes, even roads for cyclists.

I doubt that measured "IQ" is a truly valid quantitative measurement of anything beyond the ability to score on IQ tests.
However, in current psychometry the scores are normalized to a normal (Gaussian) distribution with mean = 100 and standard deviation = 15.
In that distribution, (the median) = (the mean) = (the mode).
IQ correlates very well with success in many areas of life. Interestingly sex makes a difference: the male population have a greater variance in IQ, which is less n females i.e. there are more male, than female, geniuses, but there are more males with learning disabilities. This explains why there are disproportionately more boys in gifted student programmes, as well as special schools.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2023, 10:01:24 am by Zero999 »
 

Offline coppice

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #231 on: July 01, 2023, 05:21:17 pm »
I doubt that measured "IQ" is a truly valid quantitative measurement of anything beyond the ability to score on IQ tests.
However, in current psychometry the scores are normalized to a normal (Gaussian) distribution with mean = 100 and standard deviation = 15.
In that distribution, (the median) = (the mean) = (the mode).
In all of the study of human capability and behaviour, IQ scores have the best correlation with lifetime outcomes. The second best correlation is things which are measuring industriousness in some form. Someone who scores high in both IQ and industriousness generally does very well. IQ doesn't measure what most of us would consider "smartness". People seem to use that word as some hybrid of IQ and wisdom, which are rather different things. An industrious, high IQ person who lacks the wisdom to pursue meaningful goals can have a very bad outcome. A high IQ often allows people to rationalise stupid things a lesser IQ person would just consider dumb.

IQ values are on a very compressed scale. Is a person with an IQ of 140 only 40% more capable in problem solving? No, they are far more capable than that. Similarly, is someone with an IQ of 80 only 20% less capable than the average? No, they are barely able to take care of themselves. Perhaps the scaling was chosen specifically to make people feel better about their differences.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2023, 09:11:21 pm by coppice »
 

Offline gnuarm

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #232 on: July 01, 2023, 05:44:38 pm »
Why are people saying US fatal accident rates have increased lately?  I am not able to find any data to support this.  Of course, the total death count is much more readily available. 

Does anyone have a source to support this claim?  Or did I misunderstand what was being said?
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Online Monkeh

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #233 on: July 02, 2023, 01:30:29 pm »
Why are people saying US fatal accident rates have increased lately?  I am not able to find any data to support this.

Because they have. You can't have looked very hard.

The quick version:
https://crashstats.nhtsa.dot.gov/Api/Public/ViewPublication/813124
https://crashstats.nhtsa.dot.gov/Api/Public/ViewPublication/813321
https://crashstats.nhtsa.dot.gov/Api/Public/ViewPublication/813454

It's curious to me how they limited the context in the most recent publication..

Oh, and let's put the preliminary 2022 numbers in play:
https://crashstats.nhtsa.dot.gov/Api/Public/ViewPublication/813428
« Last Edit: July 02, 2023, 01:34:56 pm by Monkeh »
 

Offline gnuarm

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #234 on: July 02, 2023, 05:38:07 pm »
Interesting.  If you look at the most recent data, you see that not only did the numbers increase in 2020, but the step function occurred in 2nd quarter, 2020!  I can't think of anything that happened in 1st or 2nd quarter of 2020 to cause such a step function. 

This would indicate a change in the way the data is collected and/or processed, not an actual change in the thing being measured.
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Online Monkeh

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #235 on: July 02, 2023, 05:44:46 pm »
This would indicate a change in the way the data is collected and/or processed, not an actual change in the thing being measured.

Or it does indicate a change in the data being measured that you just don't want to see. The criteria didn't change, the methods didn't change.
 

Offline PlainName

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #236 on: July 02, 2023, 05:48:53 pm »
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I can't think of anything that happened in 1st or 2nd quarter of 2020 to cause such a step function

Covid lockdown? Over here that resulted in clear roads, so drivers were doing stupid speeds expecting not to meet something in the way. I can easily imagine a higher death rate despite fewer miles travelled.
 
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Offline TimFox

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #237 on: July 02, 2023, 06:05:06 pm »
I remember this incident   https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/15/us/chicago-kennedy-expressway-pileup-trnd/index.html  in Chicago, during the early Covid lockdown in Illinois.
The expressway had relatively little traffic due to the lockdown, and iced up badly.
This was followed by perhaps not-so-intelligent driving.
Luckily, no fatalities.
However, 2020 and 2021 were bad for traffic fatalities in Illinois.
An example of postings from personal-injury attornies:  https://www.chicagolawyer.com/blog/chicago-car-accident-statistics-for-2022/
 
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Offline gnuarm

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #238 on: July 02, 2023, 06:32:35 pm »
Quote
I can't think of anything that happened in 1st or 2nd quarter of 2020 to cause such a step function

Covid lockdown? Over here that resulted in clear roads, so drivers were doing stupid speeds expecting not to meet something in the way. I can easily imagine a higher death rate despite fewer miles travelled.

Sure, if the step had gone away after things opened up again.  But this step has remained.  It was both abrupt, and significant, around 30%!

I don't follow why you think reducing the number of miles driven, would increase the death rate per mile.  It's not like cars spontaneously blow up on their own.  In fact, fewer people on the roads should result in safer driving with fewer fatalities, I would think.  While the number of people on the roads dropped, I never saw "clear" roads. 
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Offline PlainName

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #239 on: July 02, 2023, 09:28:51 pm »
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I don't follow why you think reducing the number of miles driven, would increase the death rate per mile.

Might, not would. And it's not just my idea.

The thinking is that with less traffic drivers drive more carelessly (because there's nothing to get in the way) and when something does get in the way the resulting damage is worse because of the higher speeds and lack of attention. There was actually quite a lot on this in the papers at the time, because the police were picking up serious speeders where normally congestion would tamp it down.

So, fewer vehicles implies fewer miles for a given period, and higher carelessness can lead to more incidents per driven mile (even though the absolute number of incidents might reduce).

Anyone else not able to grasp that? Like is it me unable to explain an idea or am I being played?
 
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Offline TimFox

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #240 on: July 02, 2023, 09:32:52 pm »
The April 15, 2020 pileup in Chicago I cited above was the first thing I thought of when the question of increased traffic crashes starting in 2020 arose.
As I remember, the serious Covid shutdown in Illinois started on March 18 of that year, and expressway traffic had decreased greatly, allowing higher speeds.
 
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Online Monkeh

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #241 on: July 02, 2023, 09:35:04 pm »
Quote
I don't follow why you think reducing the number of miles driven, would increase the death rate per mile.

Might, not would. And it's not just my idea.

The thinking is that with less traffic drivers drive more carelessly (because there's nothing to get in the way) and when something does get in the way the resulting damage is worse because of the higher speeds and lack of attention. There was actually quite a lot on this in the papers at the time, because the police were picking up serious speeders where normally congestion would tamp it down.

So, fewer vehicles implies fewer miles for a given period, and higher carelessness can lead to more incidents per driven mile (even though the absolute number of incidents might reduce).

Anyone else not able to grasp that? Like is it me unable to explain an idea or am I being played?

You're pretty much on the money, and the statistics in most countries I've looked at follow that trend - fewer total accidents due to less driving, more accidents per mile.

During and immediately after the lockdowns around here was.. bizarre and dodgy. Between the people who'd got used to ignoring speed limits and give way signs because nobody else was on the road, and the ones who hadn't driven for several months, things were quite exciting.

Quite why the rate has remained so high in the US I can't say. The numbers are, however, beginning to fall towards their usual unacceptable levels.
 
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Offline Nominal Animal

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #242 on: July 02, 2023, 10:15:21 pm »
I noticed the safe road culture in Norway back in 1993, on a bicycle trip from Kilpisjärvi to Tromsø and back.  Even the fully loaded ore trucks gave plenty of way, moving clearly to the other lane when passing us bicyclists.

I like that sort of tolerance.  It made for a very fun, safe cycling trip.

I don't like the sort of tolerance that says that it is okay to silence people accused of being racist, or perhaps just because they're ugly or someone heard them say an off joke.  I find it shallow and short-sighted, and in the long run, not helping anyone.  We shouldn't make people think "Can I help you?" might possibly be racially loaded; instead, we should replace that kind of tribalist oppressor-oppressed worldview with individualism, just like Morgan Freeman has suggested (for example, to Mike Wallace on 60 Minutes): don't treat others based on what group they belong to, treat them as individuals.
 

Offline gnuarm

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #243 on: July 03, 2023, 12:34:38 am »
Quote
I don't follow why you think reducing the number of miles driven, would increase the death rate per mile.

Might, not would. And it's not just my idea.

Ok, that's a strange qualifier.  It's a pointless mitigation, like saying, "kind of" or "I'm just sayin'..."  An 11th grade history teacher broke me of that habit.  If you have something to say, say it.  Don't hem and haw around using "weasel words".

Quote
The thinking is that with less traffic drivers drive more carelessly (because there's nothing to get in the way) and when something does get in the way the resulting damage is worse because of the higher speeds and lack of attention. There was actually quite a lot on this in the papers at the time, because the police were picking up serious speeders where normally congestion would tamp it down.

So, fewer vehicles implies fewer miles for a given period, and higher carelessness can lead to more incidents per driven mile (even though the absolute number of incidents might reduce).

Anyone else not able to grasp that? Like is it me unable to explain an idea or am I being played?

I understand the English language.  I simply don't follow the reasoning.  There are many, many situations where traffic is not thick in any way.  I don't see more dangerous behavior at all.  In fact, it is in the heavy traffic when I see people making dangerous lane changes, and speeding while weaving through gaps that could close at any moment. 

But of course, there will be more speeding than when traffic congests roads.  That's a bit of a "duh".  I don't buy into the notion that driving 80 in a 65 zone makes the road noticeably more dangerous than when the traffic is heavy.  I especially don't see a connection to lighter traffic causing a "lack of attention". 

Sorry, but I think this is poor reasoning and poor logic.  How many others buy into this idea is not relevant.
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Offline tggzzz

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #244 on: July 03, 2023, 07:50:13 am »
I noticed the safe road culture in Norway back in 1993, on a bicycle trip from Kilpisjärvi to Tromsø and back.  Even the fully loaded ore trucks gave plenty of way, moving clearly to the other lane when passing us bicyclists.

I like that sort of tolerance.  It made for a very fun, safe cycling trip.

That's easier if the only other vehicles are on the horizon :) Less easy in London, Palermo, ...

Having said that, I interrailed up to Narvik in 1980, and was very impressed by the rail carriages having carafes of water at each end, and being able to rotate the seats so you were facing forwards/backwards group of 2/4. Clearly they were transporting people, not SLF or passenger-units.

Quote
I don't like the sort of tolerance that says that it is okay to silence people accused of being racist, or perhaps just because they're ugly or someone heard them say an off joke.  I find it shallow and short-sighted, and in the long run, not helping anyone.  We shouldn't make people think "Can I help you?" might possibly be racially loaded; instead, we should replace that kind of tribalist oppressor-oppressed worldview with individualism, just like Morgan Freeman has suggested (for example, to Mike Wallace on 60 Minutes): don't treat others based on what group they belong to, treat them as individuals.

Basically: yes.

That should be a formal requirement for managers and human resource droids.
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
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Offline TimFox

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #245 on: July 03, 2023, 02:10:29 pm »
I also took the train to Narvik in the mid 1980s.
It was February, and I thought it would be cold like Minnesota, but it was only cold like Chicago (Narvik is on the Gulf Stream).
The carafe of water at each end of the car was needed because the water in the car's plumbing is non-potable.
I completed the trip back to Copenhagen through Sweden;  I obtained two certificates attesting to my travel north of the Arctic Circle.
The Norwegian certificate was stamped by the stationmaster in Narvik, but the Swedish one was merely purchased at the gift shop in Kiruna.
 

Offline tggzzz

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #246 on: July 03, 2023, 05:50:23 pm »
I also took the train to Narvik in the mid 1980s.
It was February, and I thought it would be cold like Minnesota, but it was only cold like Chicago (Narvik is on the Gulf Stream).

But go inland and uphill to the Hardangavidda in January: frost giants rule!

As we were taught in school geography lessons: spot the 0C isotherm crossing Crimea and the Balkans east-west, then going due north for >1500 miles :)

If you look at the UK's latitude, and then at the polar bear range in Canada, you will notice that without the Gulf Stream polar bears would range across the whole of the UK :)



Shame the Gulf Stream will disappear, albeit not in my lifetime.

Quote
The carafe of water at each end of the car was needed because the water in the car's plumbing is non-potable.

That's true in all trains! Only on Norwegian trains have I seen the carafes of water.

Quote
I completed the trip back to Copenhagen through Sweden;  I obtained two certificates attesting to my travel north of the Arctic Circle.
The Norwegian certificate was stamped by the stationmaster in Narvik, but the Swedish one was merely purchased at the gift shop in Kiruna.

Ditto, but I didn't bother with any bits of paper.

The bus ride from Fauske to Narvik was during a glorious high pressure blocking event. I saw the offshore islands from a distance, thought "wow, they look different", decided I wanted to go there, and later discovered just how strange the Lofoten Islands really are. Still haven't been back, but have been other strange places.
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Offline Zero999Topic starter

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #247 on: July 03, 2023, 06:22:28 pm »
Shame the Gulf Stream will disappear, albeit not in my lifetime.
Oh, not the old Gulf Stream myth again, which will never die. West coasts are always milder in winter because they're downwind of large ocean basins. Nothing to do with the Gulf Stream. The UK has had plenty of mild winters, when the North Atlantic has been colder than average and mild winters, when the ocean has been warmer than average. The difference is the weather pattern being more conducive to cold easterlies, or mild westerlies.

The grain of truth is, sea surface temperatures do affect the weather patterns, but with other factors and it's very unpredictable.
Quote
I don't follow why you think reducing the number of miles driven, would increase the death rate per mile.

Might, not would. And it's not just my idea.

The thinking is that with less traffic drivers drive more carelessly (because there's nothing to get in the way) and when something does get in the way the resulting damage is worse because of the higher speeds and lack of attention. There was actually quite a lot on this in the papers at the time, because the police were picking up serious speeders where normally congestion would tamp it down.

So, fewer vehicles implies fewer miles for a given period, and higher carelessness can lead to more incidents per driven mile (even though the absolute number of incidents might reduce).

Anyone else not able to grasp that? Like is it me unable to explain an idea or am I being played?

You're pretty much on the money, and the statistics in most countries I've looked at follow that trend - fewer total accidents due to less driving, more accidents per mile.

During and immediately after the lockdowns around here was.. bizarre and dodgy. Between the people who'd got used to ignoring speed limits and give way signs because nobody else was on the road, and the ones who hadn't driven for several months, things were quite exciting.

Quite why the rate has remained so high in the US I can't say. The numbers are, however, beginning to fall towards their usual unacceptable levels.
The pandemic, along with the poor response to it by many governments, has reduced the quality of the health system in many countries, so perhaps more of those who have been involved in road collisions are dying now, when they would have survived before?
 

Offline Nominal Animal

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #248 on: July 03, 2023, 06:23:40 pm »
I noticed the safe road culture in Norway back in 1993, on a bicycle trip from Kilpisjärvi to Tromsø and back.  Even the fully loaded ore trucks gave plenty of way, moving clearly to the other lane when passing us bicyclists.
That's easier if the only other vehicles are on the horizon :) Less easy in London, Palermo, ...
Actually, the ore truck traffic was quite heavy part of the way, and they did drive fast on those not-so-wide roads.

Oh, and I forgot to mention that the altitude difference between Kilpisjärvi, Finland and Skibotn, Norway, is about 550 m; distance is about 50 km.
The view during the descent, including the biome change, is amazing, though.  I admit, me and my friends took the bus back, instead of trying to pedal that uphill.

I obtained two certificates attesting to my travel north of the Arctic Circle.
I was born well north of the Arctic Circle, around latitude 68°N, but had already moved to Helsinki by that time.  The difference in road culture between Norway and Finland was notable, even though Finnish roads aren't dangerous per se, and weren't back then either.

Here in Helsinki, at pedestrian crossings where there are no traffic lights, about half of the drivers assume pedestrians will stop and wait, even though the law says the opposite should happen.  I live on a residential street with 30 km/h (20 MPH) speed limit, and some drivers do like to show their 'displeasure' when they have to slow down to let pedestrians cross.  Luckily I look like an angry potato, so a quick evil eye tends to give them the heebie-jeebies back.

I don't drive, myself, though, so my viewpoint is skewed.  I must say that some cyclists here have a death wish: I've seen a cyclist take a four-lane crossing diagonally against a red light during rush hour (Haapaniemenkatu – Sörnäisten rantatie).. and a lot of pedestrians really don't perceive anything around them, their face glued to their cellphones, or just talking to someone else and not watching at all where they are going.  So maybe it's cultural?  I think it might be.
« Last Edit: July 09, 2023, 07:14:18 am by Nominal Animal »
 

Offline PlainName

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Re: Amazon accuses customer of racism & shuts down their smart home!
« Reply #249 on: July 03, 2023, 07:13:24 pm »
Quote
Here in Helsinki, at pedestrian crossings where there are no traffic lights, about half of the drivers assume pedestrians will stop and wait, even though the law says the opposite should happen.

Here in the UK the rule is that drivers should give way to pedestrians waiting to cross, and must give way to pedestrians on a crossing. There are strict meanings for 'should' and 'must', so if one is 'making progress' then a waiting pedestrian is fair game whereas one with a foot on the crossing wins. Most drivers seem to either not know the detail of the rules or just generally considerate.

edit: source
Zebra crossings. Give traffic plenty of time to see you and to stop before you start to cross. Vehicles will need more time when the road is slippery. Wait until traffic has stopped from both directions or the road is clear before crossing. Remember that traffic does not have to stop until someone has moved onto the crossing. Drivers and riders should give way to pedestrians waiting to cross and MUST give way to pedestrians on a zebra crossing (see ?Rule H2). Keep looking both ways, and listening, in case a driver or rider has not seen you and attempts to overtake a vehicle that has stopped.
 
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