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| And now the Boeing 777... |
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| Brumby:
--- Quote from: coppercone2 on February 27, 2021, 05:48:17 am ---isent it up to boeing to analyze the engine to make sure its good? They vet the subassembly after all. It will be complicated to figure out whos fault it is i.e. lack of maintenance incorrect maintenance bad from factory 1) design flaw 2) manufacturing defect (QC fail) installed incorrectly/damaged during installation system interfaced incorrectly (the engine has I/O), or its just not compatible with the design for whatever mechanical reason, if its not related to hydraulics or electronics or telemetry failed to inspect device before/after installation failed to perform more stringent tests control safety system fail (did not monitor telemetry or handwaving was involved) of course its up to the investigators to find out what happened --- End quote --- Oh, for crying out loud - no, it's NOT Boeing at fault here. Maybe some maintenance procedures - but they would not have originated from Boeing responsible components. When purchasing a plane, there are two steps: 1. Choose the airframe and 2. Choose the engines. For a Boeing 777, I believe there are 3 choices of engine - Pratt & Whitney, Rolls Royce or GE. Boeing don't make engines. They make airframes. The engine had a failure. The airframe held up very nicely. Pratt and Whitney are the ones with egg on their face at the moment. |
| coppice:
--- Quote from: Brumby on February 27, 2021, 02:16:56 pm ---Oh, for crying out loud - no, it's NOT Boeing at fault here. Maybe some maintenance procedures - but they would not have originated from Boeing responsible components. --- End quote --- If my TV breaks I wouldn't say "Its not LG's fault. They didn't make the component that broke.". Anyone integrating parts into a product is responsible for the whole product. |
| drussell:
--- Quote from: coppice on February 27, 2021, 02:39:02 pm --- --- Quote from: Brumby on February 27, 2021, 02:16:56 pm ---Oh, for crying out loud - no, it's NOT Boeing at fault here. Maybe some maintenance procedures - but they would not have originated from Boeing responsible components. --- End quote --- If my TV breaks I wouldn't say "Its not LG's fault. They didn't make the component that broke.". Anyone integrating parts into a product is responsible for the whole product. --- End quote --- That is not at all the way it works in the aircraft industry. Boeing doesn't do the fancy inspections necessary to maintain or overhaul the engines. That is entirely the engine manufacturer's domain. Boeing quite literally have nothing to do with it other than having the misfortune of having offered that particular engine as one of the options to the purchaser of the aircraft. There is absolutely nothing, zero, zip, nada, that Boeing could have done to somehow find this issue. |
| coppercone2:
--- Quote from: coppice on February 27, 2021, 02:39:02 pm --- --- Quote from: Brumby on February 27, 2021, 02:16:56 pm ---Oh, for crying out loud - no, it's NOT Boeing at fault here. Maybe some maintenance procedures - but they would not have originated from Boeing responsible components. --- End quote --- If my TV breaks I wouldn't say "Its not LG's fault. They didn't make the component that broke.". Anyone integrating parts into a product is responsible for the whole product. --- End quote --- so the explanation I read in this thread makes me think the profession I took is way too complicated because it seems easier to pick a plane engine then a damn single resistor. I can't even do that. I can still fuck a resistor choice in a way that they will blame me. I just know unless I do a fair bit of thinking someone is going to come out of the wood work and tell someone 'you needed a more experienced guy to make that part placement decision for you because'... then it will come down to if a company feels like defending me. Not saying its hard or likely to happen but I still need to usually consider some things other then the description on the digikey baggie if its serious. |
| james_s:
--- Quote from: coppice on February 27, 2021, 02:39:02 pm ---If my TV breaks I wouldn't say "Its not LG's fault. They didn't make the component that broke.". Anyone integrating parts into a product is responsible for the whole product. --- End quote --- A TV is not an airliner, not even close. When purchasing a TV you don't get to choose what brand of power supply it includes. The situation with an airliner is more like what you have with outboard powered boats. The outboard motor may be included as part of a package deal, but you will choose the specific motor that you want installed, and if the motor blows up that isn't the fault of the boat builder, you take it up with the manufacture of the motor you selected or the dealer you purchased it from. Turbine engines are incredibly complex and expensive machines, large ones cost tens of millions of dollars each. The engines and ancillary components are a package deal engineered by the engine manufacture, the airframe manufacture does the integration, providing the mounting brackets and fairings and such. If an engine needs to be serviced, technicians trained to work on that specific engine do the work, not the airframe manufacture, they don't design engines, they don't build engines, they don't service or support engines, they design and build airframes to support the engines the customer selects. If there is a problem with the engine, that is 100% the responsibility of the engine manufacture unless an airframe problem caused the engine to fail. Unfortunately as has been illustrated here, ignorance of the general public is going to put egg on Boeing's face even though it is not deserved. People assume that a $320M aircraft is anything like a $400 consumer TV set or a family car. |
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