Author Topic: Any fisherfolk here? Could you recommend a cheap reel for launching antennas?  (Read 1413 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Online cdev

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 6136
  • Country: 00
As detailed in another thread I've been trying to put together a system I can use to launch a weight, like a fishing weight, on some fishing line, high enough into some fairly tall trees to have enough velocity on the way down to pull the line far enough to get the (60 to 120 gram?) weight all the way back down to the ground without the line getting tangled. which is going to be a challenge, I can tell from some preliminary experiments.

The problem is the fishing line is incredibly hard to keep from fouling.

I pretty much will need to use a reel, either with a fishing rod (like casting a fishing lure) or the slingshot+ball weight that I already have. (which will probably be enough)

I know literally nothing about what kind or brand of fishing reel to get. Do you have any suggestions?

(Neat link showing the history of the fishing reel.)

Some of the very inexpensive ones actually look pretty nice, as machinery.

The problem with just using the fishing line spool - (no reel) by itself is that monofilament fishing line is so incredibly prone to tangling and this tangling will I can tell be problematic-at the moment of launching-

This is the situation fishing reels are designed for.


Thank you!  Any other suggestions are welcome too.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2018, 09:54:45 pm by cdev »
"What the large print giveth, the small print taketh away."
 

Offline GreyWoolfe

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3471
  • Country: us
  • NW0LF
See if you can find a Zebco 33.  That should work just fine.  If it is cheep enough, get 2, they're small.
"Heaven has been described as the place that once you get there all the dogs you ever loved run up to greet you."
 
The following users thanked this post: cdev

Offline TheSteve

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 3220
  • Country: ca
  • Living the Dream
I'd rather use something like this:
https://www.wb5cxc.com/spud_gun.html
VE7FM
 
The following users thanked this post: cdev

Online coppercone2

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 4702
  • Country: us
  • $
I have been thinking about this too. I don't know if it makes sense to buy a reel.

This is what I had in mind: some kind of shaft mounted on two ceramic bearings mounted by low expansion epoxy in a enclosure.

Reel is designed to bring stuff back and be portable. For a one time job like setting up an antenna I don't see why you can't use a power drill to wind it.

Ceramic bearings because they have extremely low friction at low loads . https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=ceramic+bearings%5C

I think it might work better then something commercial for fishing because it does not have to be designed for reeling in a marlin.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2018, 10:56:11 pm by coppercone2 »
 

Online cdev

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 6136
  • Country: 00
I'd rather use something like this:
https://www.wb5cxc.com/spud_gun.html

I can get the projectile up there fine. The problem is spooling the line attached to it out effortlessly (or it will prevent the whatever from getting high enough) without its fouling. So the line has to either be laid out straight without much to slow it in advance, - but my problem is, its too light..

or come out of a reel at exactly the right rate, not too slow, and not too fast.
"What the large print giveth, the small print taketh away."
 

Offline TheSteve

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 3220
  • Country: ca
  • Living the Dream
Guess you could mount the back half of a rod(most are two pieces) to the launcher. That would give you the reel mount and at least one guide ring so the line doesn't want to unspool to badly on its own.
VE7FM
 
The following users thanked this post: cdev

Online coppercone2

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 4702
  • Country: us
  • $
oh is that how fishing line reels work? I guess the arrow deaccelerates faster then the reel right, so you end up getting a bunch of tangles in front of you (since the wheel will develop momentum from spinning).

obviously you put a radar on it and track the arrow to adjust friction, simple solution  ;D
 

Online cdev

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 6136
  • Country: 00
Guess you could mount the back half of a rod(most are two pieces) to the launcher. That would give you the reel mount and at least one guide ring so the line doesn't want to unspool to badly on its own.

Yes, thank you for reminding me about the ring.

"What the large print giveth, the small print taketh away."
 

Offline Nusa

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1942
  • Country: us
Kite + line.
Start upwind of trees.
Launch kite, get it up higher than trees. Fancy reel not required, but doesn't hurt.
Deliberately crash kite leaving line draped over trees.
Rescue kite (optional)
Use line.

Alternate version.
Balloons + weighted line.
Get it higher and over trees from upwind side.
Shoot balloons with BB/pellet gun.

Me, since I have a compound bow in the closet already, I'd likely think about attaching a weight+string to a practice arrow head. Then the obvious.
« Last Edit: December 14, 2018, 12:38:50 am by Nusa »
 

Online coppercone2

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 4702
  • Country: us
  • $
is it really a problem to drag wires behind projectiles without a a proper reel?
 

Offline TheSteve

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 3220
  • Country: ca
  • Living the Dream
At fieldday when using the air canon we just laid the rope out first, so far it has worked fine.
VE7FM
 

Offline GreyWoolfe

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3471
  • Country: us
  • NW0LF
is it really a problem to drag wires behind projectiles without a a proper reel?

The line spools off and winds back up in a fairly predictable manner.  Having loose line could end up birds nesting.  Without a proper reel, you still need to have the line spooled onto something that allows the line to free spool out and then have a method to wind it back in in a controlled manner.

TheSteve posted an interesting link.  It might require pondering and rumination.
"Heaven has been described as the place that once you get there all the dogs you ever loved run up to greet you."
 

Online coppercone2

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 4702
  • Country: us
  • $
No I mean if you have a low friction spindle (like I mentioned about ceramic bearings) with the monofilament or more safe line wound up on it next to a bow or cross bow, is it gonna work well compared to a fishing device?

rewinding is easy because you just extend the shaft and use a drill to rewind

but, how important is some kind of tension control mechanism? this is difficult. mounting a simple shaft can be done with proper epoxy. I know how to fit it too and I wanna build it rather then buy something for hunting fish, but am I missing important mechanisms with my idea?

i also feel like you are less likely to get in trouble if you have a home made thing because they are not saying you are bow fishing or tryin to reel in birds or some crazy shit like that. Using a weaker line is probably legally better too since you can't get hit with a hunting fine. If some cop gets it in his head you are gonna reel in game to club it or something (like pudge in dota) its gonna probobly end in the police station. I had trouble with wild life officials before when I was field testing equipment, ended up getting handcuffed and released a while later while they looked for signs of hunting and shit. Really irritating. I musta came off like kinda huntery/tactical and I think they were looking for a stash with guns and maybe a dead doe because they were looking for me for a while. Figured I was hunting without a permit. I was there like 1/2 an hour handcuffed on my knees in the damn woods knee deep in leaves...... I don't really blame the cops but shit it sucked

If I try this am I going to end up messing with trying to figure out some kind of tension control shit when I just designed something thats made for absolutely lowest friction? I kinda wanna just see it spin like crazy.
« Last Edit: December 14, 2018, 04:34:59 am by coppercone2 »
 
The following users thanked this post: cdev

Offline beanflying

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 5473
  • Country: au
  • Toys so very many Toys.
The issue you will have with most reels and your plans for a ballistic type acceleration they will tend to over spool the line. The old side caster type reel overcomes some of this in that the drum doesn't rotate but you do need to use a hand to stop the line coming off at the end of the cast or launch.

https://youtu.be/Av3TX4SDg4U

You need to 'just' get your line over your objective no more and the speed it get there at isn't important hence my post in your other thread. It has worked well without snarls and tangles over a number of years.

Going off at a tangent however maybe what you 'need' is to buy yourself a decent sized Drone to run your line 8)
Coffee, Food, R/C and electronics nerd in no particular order. Also CNC wannabe, 3D printer and Laser Cutter Junkie and just don't mention my TEA addiction....
 
The following users thanked this post: cdev

Offline KE5FX

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1329
  • Country: us
    • KE5FX.COM
Slingshots and model rockets both work well, but the best way to go is probably a drone.
 
The following users thanked this post: cdev

Offline tpowell1830

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 797
  • Country: us
After reading your other post and comments from this one, I believe you want a fishing rod with an open face spinning reel. This guy has a series of training for this type of setup. I have used this type of rod a reel rig for many years, and with a little bit of practice, I can place a small 1 ounce weight into a coffee cup at 100 feet. Penn, Shimano and Daiwa brands and they all work well. You could go to a garage sale and find the entire rig for very cheap.



I think I understand, and correct me if I am wrong, that you want to throw the weight attached to the string over a mast, tie it to a rope that you then pull over and down so that you can lift some sort of antenna. This rod and open face spinner reel will do the job, and I would use the teardrop shaped weights. When you choose your string, buy the SpiderWire brand as it is very strong and proven, it is all that I ever use. You need to get at least 25 lb. test string because smaller will get tangled easier. If you learn how to properly cast with this rig, you shouldn't have any tangles, unless of course you get the string caught up in a tree or other tangly obstacles.

Hope this helps...
PEACE===>T
 
The following users thanked this post: cdev

Online tautech

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 20443
  • Country: nz
  • Taupaki Technologies Ltd. NZ Siglent Distributor
    • Taupaki Technologies Ltd.
Egg beater (open face) style reel, shortish rod (8ft max), Heavy nylon, say 30lb/15kg and teardrop casting sinkers so to reduce snagging on retrievals.
Then practice and practice.

Or the way the pros do it...with arborist throw lines:
https://www.ebay.com/bhp/arborist-throw-line

Avid Rabid Hobbyist
 
The following users thanked this post: cdev

Online coppercone2

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 4702
  • Country: us
  • $
I want some kind of compact camping kit with a little crossbow that is meant for emergency communications setup even if you break an arm or are otherwise injured.

mainly because its a cool gadget.
 

Online cdev

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 6136
  • Country: 00
Yes, you've got the picture, except I'm trying to do what fisherpeople probably never have to do, I am trying to cast at a very high angle, not quite straight up but almost- I would say around 75 degrees. My yard is fairly small and I dont have a large distance to go where I can remain on my property except in one direction. So I have to (from the base of the tree) go back maybe 6 or 7 meters at the most and then shoot up, and over the top part of the tree, where the line will hopefully be drawn behind the weight and then the weight falls down fast enough on the other side to pull the line behind it and fall to the ground.

I have 2.5 kg test line now and although its strong, its not much thicker than my fairly fine hair. It's like air. And it immediately gets tangled up once its off the spook. Almost no way to stop it.

Outside the other day trying to cast the weight up and over the wind was catching it and just blowing it away. (The wind was at my back) Thats the dominant direction of wind where I live. So rather than mess with the risk of having the weight go up but not having a usable twine behind it to use for pulling, I thought it might be best to get a reel and perhaps a short rod too. Since they are very inexpensive it seems, and good quality.

Yes, this kind of reel is what I have been looking at the most.


After reading your other post and comments from this one, I believe you want a fishing rod with an open face spinning reel. This guy has a series of training for this type of setup. I have used this type of rod a reel rig for many years, and with a little bit of practice, I can place a small 1 ounce weight into a coffee cup at 100 feet.

Thats pretty impressive. I believe you, Ive had friends who were very good at this too. I've never been good at stuff like this. It takes a lot of practice to get a skill like that.

Do you think its possible to cast up? Or should I just use the reel with my slingshot (which may be illegal, thats another reason why I am 'casting around' for another method. Even though its literally my own back yard. )


Penn, Shimano and Daiwa brands and they all work well. You could go to a garage sale and find the entire rig for very cheap.



I think I understand, and correct me if I am wrong, that you want to throw the weight attached to the string over a mast,

Actually a tall hardwood tree in my yard is my first choice platform, my second choice would be a tall pine tree, but I can see that its likely much more difficult to get a good stable spot for the antenna to be anchored with a pine. So I am really hoping to get it right on the first try, And not leave a mess of tangled monofilament line up in the tree.

tie it to a rope that you then pull over and down so that you can lift some sort of antenna. This rod and open face spinner reel will do the job, and I would use the teardrop shaped weights.

I've got three of those weights now, two two ounce and one four ounce.

When you choose your string, buy the SpiderWire brand as it is very strong and proven, it is all that I ever use. You need to get at least 25 lb. test string because smaller will get tangled easier. If you learn how to properly cast with this rig, you shouldn't have any tangles, unless of course you get the string caught up in a tree or other tangly obstacles.

:)  Crossing my fingers!  Thank you all for your sage advice-
"What the large print giveth, the small print taketh away."
 

Online cdev

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 6136
  • Country: 00
"Brilliant" !  I havn't even begun to think about how to get the line to the optimal crick of the limb yet, but indeed thats where the antenna rope needs to rest in order to become a good stable anchor.

Egg beater (open face) style reel, shortish rod (8ft max), Heavy nylon, say 30lb/15kg and teardrop casting sinkers so to reduce snagging on retrievals.

Then practice and practice.

Or the way the pros do it...with arborist throw lines:
https://www.ebay.com/bhp/arborist-throw-line


"What the large print giveth, the small print taketh away."
 

Online cdev

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 6136
  • Country: 00
It was the other day, likely because the fishing line I was trying to use was so very light. Like gossamer threads or something. And it gets tangled in seconds the minute it is off the spool.

The next size up that I have is kind of too heavy though I think.

is it really a problem to drag wires behind projectiles without a a proper reel?
"What the large print giveth, the small print taketh away."
 

Online tautech

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 20443
  • Country: nz
  • Taupaki Technologies Ltd. NZ Siglent Distributor
    • Taupaki Technologies Ltd.
"Brilliant" !  I havn't even begun to think about how to get the line to the optimal crick of the limb yet, but indeed thats where the antenna rope needs to rest in order to become a good stable anchor.

Egg beater (open face) style reel, shortish rod (8ft max), Heavy nylon, say 30lb/15kg and teardrop casting sinkers so to reduce snagging on retrievals.

Then practice and practice.

Or the way the pros do it...with arborist throw lines:
https://www.ebay.com/bhp/arborist-throw-line


Look for videos on YT of using throw lines, they're a specialist bit of gear and with little practice very very effective.
And no it's not just some weight on the end of a line but a little sack filled with lead shot (pellets) that if anything proposes less risk to the thrower should it come back down on their head.
The videos online will demonstrate the proper techniques for using them.......much like using a throwing sling....David and Goliath style.  ;)
Avid Rabid Hobbyist
 

Online coppercone2

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 4702
  • Country: us
  • $
you could try a thicker line? that sounds extremely fine.
 


Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf