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Offline MrMobodiesTopic starter

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Apple hardware subscription as a service
« on: March 25, 2022, 11:13:52 pm »
I came across this video from Louis Rossmann Apple announces HARDWARE subscriptions: at least they're honest about you not owning it:
https://odysee.com/@rossmanngroup:a/apple-announces-hardware-subscriptions:4

https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/24/22994814/apple-iphone-hardware-subscription-bundle-report
Quote
Apple will reportedly sell the iPhone as a subscription service
The service could launch in late 2022 or early 2023
By Chaim Gartenberg@cgartenberg  Mar 24, 2022, 1:43pm EDT

Apple is reportedly working on selling iPhones and iPads themselves as part of a hardware subscription service, according to a new report from Bloomberg, whose author Mark Gurman writes the service could arrive next year.

The move would fit into Apple’s ongoing push towards subscription services as a whole. Over the past several years, Apple has increasingly been emphasizing recurring subscriptions like Apple Music, Apple TV Plus, Apple News Plus, Apple Fitness Plus, and Apple Arcade as key new revenue streams for the company. Many of those services have already been bundled together into the company’s Apple One bundles, too.
We’ve already seen a similar shift on the hardware front: Apple added a monthly subscription model for its AppleCare extended warranties back in 2019. And Apple has offered its iPhone Upgrade Program — which allows customers to pay for the combined cost of AppleCare and an iPhone over 24 months and the option to trade in their device after 12 months of payments — since 2015. Both those programs already resemble a hardware subscription in many ways.

APPLE ALREADY OFFERS MONTHLY IPHONE PAYMENTS
According to Bloomberg’s report, the monthly charge wouldn’t simply be the price of the device divided by 12 or 24 months, but rather be a still-undecided monthly cost, potentially with the option to upgrade to new hardware as its released. And like Apple’s other subscriptions, it would be tied to a user’s existing Apple ID account, with the possibility of bundling in AppleCare or Apple One services as well.

Right now, you can pay Apple monthly for its services, and you can pay it monthly for an iPhone — but they’re still separate fees and plans to manage.

It’s hard to imagine that Apple will simply be lending out devices on a monthly basis — will you really be able to just pay to “subscribe” an iPhone for a single month, like you can for Apple TV Plus to binge a season of Ted Lasso? Similarly, a world where Apple has customers invest months of capital to rent a device only to have them return it at the end of the process seems equally unlikely.

It’s possible that Apple is simply looking to cut out the middleman and expand its installment-based payment offerings to other products. The iPhone Upgrade Program effectively has customers take out an interest-free loan with Citizens One, which they then repay over the course of the 24-month plan. Apple also allows Apple Card customers to pay for Apple products over monthly installments without paying interest, but that too is only limited to a small subset of Apple customers. An Apple-based subscription service could eliminate those requirements, and allow Apple to expand it to other hardware products (like the iPad or its Mac computers) too.

But while details are still slim, one thing is clear: Apple’s subscription ambitions are still only just getting started.

In other words it's like a rental which might work for some and I just hope they give people a choice like they had before.

My ISP tried this on me recently with these YeaLink "cloud" phones. I was told the handsets were "free" but didn't tell me until right at the end of the cooling off period that it was £10 license fee a month per handset for the privilege of using them and I wouldn't own them at the end of the contract so I cancelled it. I inquired to other ISP's about selling me VOIP services so I can use  analogue phone adapters for when landlines get decommissioned in 2025 but they didn't want to know and were at it too with these "Yea Lock you in" "cloud" crap with the same restrictive terms. Also it is the wrong setting for a home, if I am on the phone making a call and and I had everyone calling me at the same and all the other handsets go off that would distract and annoy me. It's not a call center. Now I am starting to think it is done deliberately to lock me in.

All I want is to pay for something that I see and like and does what I want  for a specific purpose that is going to work to a set of long term standards without any auto update/ no hosting/cloud dependency and for it to be left alone do it's thing.

The good thing is with Apple announcing it it will save me the aggravation and grief of ever buying their stuff that do this and finding out later just like the contract I cancelled right at the end of the cooling period when I found out last minute and confirmed the nonsense which they didn't tell me at first.

There seems to be an every increasing pattern with locking the users into things they don't own.

I remembered in 2003? when Doom 3 came out, I was in a shop about to buy a copy and when I went to pay for it I was told that it requires internet connectivity (they have to mention this to reduce the likelihood of it being returned) and at the moment I thought I would never own this game so put it back forgot about it.


Oops I forgot to ask, would you buy an Iphone this way as a subscription/rental?
« Last Edit: March 25, 2022, 11:53:21 pm by MrMobodies »
 

Offline tooki

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2022, 12:08:47 am »
I came across this video from Louis Rossmann Apple announces HARDWARE subscriptions: at least they're honest about you not owning it:
And this is why I hate Rossmann: he’s dishonest. A rumor from an anonymous source is not the same as Apple “announcing” something!!

And I guess he’s never heard of “leasing” before, which is literally “product as a service for a monthly fee”.



*on Bloomberg no less, which never retracted its fake-ass report about embedded surveillance components (actually, they were line filters…) on server motherboards, meaning Bloomberg is not a trustworthy site to begin with
 
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Offline PKTKS

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2022, 08:37:55 am »
A huge deep common  grave to bury all this RENT-SEEKERS..

I will never buy hardware this way

Paul
 

Offline tooki

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2022, 01:31:40 pm »
A huge deep common  grave to bury all this RENT-SEEKERS..

I will never buy hardware this way
Nobody and nothing is forcing you to do so. Especially not an unsubstantiated rumor.

Mind you that hardware leasing is LONG established practice in the IT world. For the first few decades of computing, you couldn’t even buy most computers, they were only leased. (IBM mainframes famously were lease-only for many, many years.)
 

Offline Bassman59

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2022, 06:21:04 pm »
I came across this video from Louis Rossmann Apple announces HARDWARE subscriptions: at least they're honest about you not owning it:
And this is why I hate Rossmann: he’s dishonest. A rumor from an anonymous source is not the same as Apple “announcing” something!!

And I guess he’s never heard of “leasing” before, which is literally “product as a service for a monthly fee”.

Every time a friend sends me a link to a Rossman video or article, I tell that person: "stop sending me his crap. He's a fucking hack." That generally leads to a long discussion but they stop sending the links.
 
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Offline floobydust

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2022, 06:37:21 pm »
I don't blame Louis Rossman, it's more likely Apple leaking out feelers to see what backlash they might get.
Across many sources, some claiming it's a rumour, Apple is "developing", "preparing", planning", "working on"... a hardware subscription model. How else do you test the market for such bullshit.

How sad, Apple is flaccid and unable to innovate. Instead, their energy is just going into fishing for how to extract more cash from their customers i.e. monthly recurring revenue because they're priority is to dish out accurate forecasts for neurotic investors and the stock market, the primary focus of Apple now. Catering to Wall Street is a well known death spiral for corporations.
 

Offline Bicurico

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2022, 06:55:01 pm »
An iPhone subscription would look like this:

You purchase a 24 month subscription, which you pay with monthly rates.
It will include an insurance. If the phone breaks or you damage it, you get a new one, but you will have to pay a reserve.

The whole deal will cost as much as buying a new iPhone every two years.

The good: you get a working insurance that gives you a new phone during this period, though you pay a reserve. Still better than having to pay to get the screen replaced with an unofficial lower quality screen, when you drop your phone. Same benefit if you lose your phone or it gets stolen.

The bad: you don't own the phone and at the end of the period you have to return it. Hence you cannot make some money by reselling it. This makes the deal slightly more expensive.

What's in it for Apple: constant cash flow, all users are paying users, as there will be no longer a second hand market. Also, no spare parts or third party repair centres chashing in.



Offline TimFox

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2022, 07:00:36 pm »
Before the 1982 break-up, AT&T jealously guarded its monopoly to be the only source of leased telephone equipment and fought against privately-owned equipment being connected to their wires.
As a result, normal telephones were seriously over-engineered and extremely reliable, to minimize AT&T's labor expense in repairing them.
 

Offline MadScientist

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #8 on: March 26, 2022, 07:08:41 pm »
I don't blame Louis Rossman, it's more likely Apple leaking out feelers to see what backlash they might get.
Across many sources, some claiming it's a rumour, Apple is "developing", "preparing", planning", "working on"... a hardware subscription model. How else do you test the market for such bullshit.

How sad, Apple is flaccid and unable to innovate. Instead, their energy is just going into fishing for how to extract more cash from their customers i.e. monthly recurring revenue because they're priority is to dish out accurate forecasts for neurotic investors and the stock market, the primary focus of Apple now. Catering to Wall Street is a well known death spiral for corporations.

The reality of the hardware market is that Apples price performance is getting worse , I’ve personally stopped buying their products other then iPhones , I have three old macs , tablets etc , but my latest laptop is win 10 and my desktop is a self build windows 10 screamer , at a fraction of apples costs.

Apple , to maintain its profits, needs to most likely both cut out the middle men , but also offer alternative purchasing mechanisms. Leasing is attractive to corporations or people that like to continuously upgrade.

I see it as inevitable
EE's: We use silicon to make things  smaller!
 

Offline SiliconWizard

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2022, 07:22:41 pm »
A huge deep common  grave to bury all this RENT-SEEKERS..

I will never buy hardware this way
Nobody and nothing is forcing you to do so. Especially not an unsubstantiated rumor.

Mind you that hardware leasing is LONG established practice in the IT world. For the first few decades of computing, you couldn’t even buy most computers, they were only leased. (IBM mainframes famously were lease-only for many, many years.)

Precisely. Just like the "cloud" was the norm in the early days of computing. The huge progress and breakthroughs in computing in the last few decades has been due to a much more decentralized approach and lower costs.

The fact we're getting back to this is not a sign of progress. It's the sign that vendors are turning into banks, making you forever dependent. The slightest hiccup could cut you off, leaving you with nothing.
 
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Offline Cerebus

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2022, 07:32:27 pm »
What bit of "unsubstantiated rumour" do people not understand?

Apple are famously close-lipped about future product plans. They do not leak to test the market, and Apple employees who are caught leaking get fired and sued. They are well known in the press world for it, and if you want continued access to official Apple sources, invites to their press events and the like you don't participate in the leaking - the nearest you can get and not got get put on Apple's naughty journalist list is to report that somebody else has reported a leak. Source: every computer journalist I used to work with who had any experience of dealing with or reporting on Apple, several of whom were on Apple's PR's "you don't exist as far as we're concerned" list for past perceived infractions.

I'll further note that getting your Apple phone on subscription is the norm for a lot of British consumers, except that it's the mobile phone company that they get it from, not Apple.
Anybody got a syringe I can use to squeeze the magic smoke back into this?
 
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Offline rdl

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2022, 08:03:53 pm »
Leasing/renting is not a problem for me, though I'd probably never do it. It almost always costs significantly more in the long run.
 

Offline tooki

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2022, 08:44:14 pm »
I don't blame Louis Rossman, it's more likely Apple leaking out feelers to see what backlash they might get.
That is not even distantly how Apple operates. Apple has often been described as “aloof”, which is the exact opposite of putting out feelers and worrying about backlash.

Across many sources, some claiming it's a rumour
No, ONE single source, and a highly unreliable one (Bloomberg) at that.


…Apple is "developing", "preparing", planning", "working on"... a hardware subscription model. How else do you test the market for such bullshit.
Uh… market research?

And again, you’ve never heard of leasing? Even if the rumor were true, “subscription hardware” is simply a lease. Even if they do introduce this option, the chances that they’ll do away with outright purchase is somewhere between zero and nil.
 

Offline tooki

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2022, 08:45:37 pm »
Apple are famously close-lipped about future product plans. They do not leak to test the market, and Apple employees who are caught leaking get fired and sued.
As someone who has literally signed an Apple employee NDA in the past, I can absolutely confirm that they take secrecy/confidentiality EXTREMELY seriously.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2022, 06:10:41 pm by tooki »
 
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Offline floobydust

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #14 on: March 26, 2022, 10:27:25 pm »
"Apple shares climbed to a session high after Bloomberg reported on the news Thursday" did you miss out lol.
"Some on Wall Street have previously urged Apple to switch to a subscription model. Sanford C. Bernstein & Co. analyst Toni Sacconaghi pitched the idea of hardware subscriptions in 2016, saying at the time that it could help Apple get to a $1 trillion market valuation. Apple hit that milestone without embracing the approach... but ..."
He touts it as a way to cater to investors who like predictability and stability.

MBA course Greed 501 at university- how does it get consumer and industry opinion on such a change - "you will own nothing", probably not even the data on the rented phone, forget any right to repair 'cuz it ain't yours, and if Apple does make a mistake with bad design/manufacturing you're locked in for a couple years with the lemon?
To me it seems like corporate overreach would happen, depending on the rights you'll have.
 

Offline tooki

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #15 on: March 26, 2022, 11:53:12 pm »
"Apple shares climbed to a session high after Bloomberg reported on the news Thursday" did you miss out lol.
"Some on Wall Street have previously urged Apple to switch to a subscription model. Sanford C. Bernstein & Co. analyst Toni Sacconaghi pitched the idea of hardware subscriptions in 2016, saying at the time that it could help Apple get to a $1 trillion market valuation. Apple hit that milestone without embracing the approach... but ..."
He touts it as a way to cater to investors who like predictability and stability.
What is your point?? We all know what’s being said. My point is that the source of that info is ONE source: Bloomberg. And that I don’t trust Bloomberg farther than I can spit. Everyone else is repeating what Bloomberg said.

It’d be different if multiple news outlets had heard the same thing independently.

So all this outrage over something that a) is anything but confirmed, a lowest grade rumor, no more, and b) just a relabeling of a common practice.
 

Offline Cerebus

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #16 on: March 27, 2022, 12:51:25 am »
If you actually read the Bloomberg article, properly, you soon notice that there are a lot of weasel words ...

Apple Inc. is working on a subscription service for the iPhone and other hardware products, a move that could make device ownership similar to paying a monthly app fee, according to people with knowledge of the matter.
...
But the project is still in development, said the people, who asked not to be identified because the initiative hasn’t been announced.
...
Nonetheless, the subscription service is still expected to launch at the end of 2022, but could be delayed into 2023 or end up getting canceled, the people said.

Those are the nub of that article, all the rest is filler or speculation. Doesn't boil down to much does it?

So, if it all proves to be a Bloomberg fever dream, they have put just the right mixture of words in there so they can say "You relied on it? But didn't you see all the caveats we put in there?".

Note: "people with knowledge of the matter" is journalese for people at quite some remove - "knowledge of the matter" can mean almost anything, some bloke down the pub who "knows a bit about Apple". Code for a source that actually knows something definitive would be "people close to", or "people inside". A "staff member speaking unattributably" is code for an official leak.
Anybody got a syringe I can use to squeeze the magic smoke back into this?
 
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Offline rsjsouza

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #17 on: March 27, 2022, 02:12:22 am »
Did you watch the video? To me it was simply reading the news and providing commentary. Sure, the sources might not be the best and the story looks somewhat shady, but his commentary is not far from what the corporate ghouls ascribed to Schwab's agenda have been trying to impose on regular citizens. Not only that, but he frequently backtracks in future videos when he finds incorrect things - this may well be another one of those.

As for your choice of words: "Hate", "hack"... Pretty spiteful words coming from someone trying to be credible when trying to debunk a rumour. As with anything Apple, unfortunately my observation of your opinion in this forum is usually quite defensive or biased. If I believed that "hate speech" existed, your sentence above would be a good example of that.

Regarding being a "hack": his hacks helped many (Hundreds? Thousands?) to learn a trade and, on the sidelines, personally got involved to influence legislation towards a cause, so he is hardly one.

All in all this might as well be a completely unfounded rumour, but the idea is something in vogue and most probably welcomed by investors and financists alike as yet another source of continuous revenue stream. The novelty would be this coming from a manufacturer, not an actual service provider such as a phone company, which they already do with their lock-ins and installment plans.


I came across this video from Louis Rossmann Apple announces HARDWARE subscriptions: at least they're honest about you not owning it:
And this is why I hate Rossmann: he’s dishonest. A rumor from an anonymous source is not the same as Apple “announcing” something!!

And I guess he’s never heard of “leasing” before, which is literally “product as a service for a monthly fee”.



*on Bloomberg no less, which never retracted its fake-ass report about embedded surveillance components (actually, they were line filters…) on server motherboards, meaning Bloomberg is not a trustworthy site to begin with
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Offline tooki

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #18 on: March 27, 2022, 02:47:19 am »
Did you watch the video?
No, the headline alone told me it’s gonna be another of his annoying videos. His choice of wording - “announces” - is evidence of dishonesty, since Apple announced no such thing.

As for your choice of words: "Hate", "hack"... Pretty spiteful words coming from someone trying to be credible when trying to debunk a rumour. As with anything Apple, unfortunately my observation of your opinion in this forum is usually quite defensive or biased. If I believed that "hate speech" existed, your sentence above would be a good example of that.
You’re mixing up my single comment with other people’s comments. Please read CAREFULLY before making nasty accusations. I didn’t call him a hack. I said I hate him because he’s dishonest, and I stand by that.

I also am not attempting to “debunk” the rumor. I’m merely reminding people that it is a rumor and nothing more!

And yes, I am defensive of Apple because of the sheer amount of idiotic, unfounded anti-Apple BS that gets thrown around here all the time. I have no problem with discussions based on objective facts, but every Apple discussion gets mired down in the myths that the haters repeat over and over, even when presented with counterevidence conclusively disproving those myths.

Regarding being a "hack": his hacks helped many (Hundreds? Thousands?) to learn a trade and, on the sidelines, personally got involved to influence legislation towards a cause, so he is hardly one.
Again, not something I said. I disagree with him and his attitude on many things, and I don’t think his skills in electronics are as good as the deity people make him out to be. Maybe he has helped a few people learn a trade (though I doubt it’s thousands), and he repairs a lot of devices that would otherwise be scrapped, and I do think that’s a good thing. He can do decent work while still being someone I dislike.

All in all this might as well be a completely unfounded rumour, but the idea is something in vogue and most probably welcomed by investors and financists alike as yet another source of continuous revenue stream. The novelty would be this coming from a manufacturer, not an actual service provider such as a phone company, which they already do with their lock-ins and installment plans.
“In vogue”? It just underscores the level of abject stupidity on the part of most journalists and analysts that they’re getting all giddy about a rumor about leasing, which is nothing new in any way, shape, or form.

And this certainly wouldn’t be the first time a technology manufacturer leased stuff directly.


 

Offline MrMobodiesTopic starter

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #19 on: March 27, 2022, 04:58:36 am »
A huge deep common  grave to bury all this RENT-SEEKERS..

I will never buy hardware this way
Nobody and nothing is forcing you to do so. Especially not an unsubstantiated rumor.

Mind you that hardware leasing is LONG established practice in the IT world. For the first few decades of computing, you couldn’t even buy most computers, they were only leased. (IBM mainframes famously were lease-only for many, many years.)

Precisely. Just like the "cloud" was the norm in the early days of computing. The huge progress and breakthroughs in computing in the last few decades has been due to a much more decentralized approach and lower costs.

The fact we're getting back to this is not a sign of progress. It's the sign that vendors are turning into banks, making you forever dependent. The slightest hiccup could cut you off, leaving you with nothing.

I know someone who use to work for an insurance company from the 70's. They set the mainframes to "time share" different tasks and experiments that other companies would pay them for.

I think they should maintain a choice, rental, high purchase (after the contract I get to keep the goods) and own outright own and insurance/service agreement options so they can suit as many buyers and situations.
 

Offline PKTKS

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #20 on: March 27, 2022, 08:29:03 am »
A huge deep common  grave to bury all this RENT-SEEKERS..

I will never buy hardware this way
Nobody and nothing is forcing you to do so. Especially not an unsubstantiated rumor.

Mind you that hardware leasing is LONG established practice in the IT world. For the first few decades of computing, you couldn’t even buy most computers, they were only leased. (IBM mainframes famously were lease-only for many, many years.)


I ca not see how to compare a cellphone to a mainframe...     i can not see how to compare a cellphone even to a PC.. 

You can not even use a cellphone like a cheap bad computer..

So anyone ever use a mainframe for FB.. browsing or photo gallery..?

Do not see how such comparison sounds

Paul
 

Offline Cerebus

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #21 on: March 27, 2022, 10:17:15 am »

I ca not see how to compare a cellphone to a mainframe...     i can not see how to compare a cellphone even to a PC.. 

You can not even use a cellphone like a cheap bad computer..

Hello, 21st century calling. I've got a 3D scanning application on my phone that will create a point cloud model of a real world physical scene. In what world is that not a job for a computer, a computer with a bit more grunt than a "cheap bad computer". It will do in seconds what the whole desktop full of 3 engineering workstations (total value £30k-£50k) I sat behind a few years back would have taken a day to do. If you "can not see how to compare a cellphone even to a PC" perhaps you haven't quite got quite as much of a grasp of what this whole "computer" thing is about as you think you do (your regular postings of loads of bash script notwithstanding).

Quote

So anyone ever use a mainframe for FB.. browsing or photo gallery..?

Do not see how such comparison sounds

Paul

Twenty years ago no consumers leased their cars, it was purely a business phenomenon, nowadays it's a common practice for consumers - one of the forum members was talking just last week about handing his privately leased BMW i3 back to the leasing company. Consumers used to buy their own copies of Photoshop (well, the honest ones did), now they rent it from Adobe. We've already established that many consumers already lease their phones and have done for years. Many, many millions of people used to rent their televisions, or buy them on hire purchase, which is just another variation on a lease.
Anybody got a syringe I can use to squeeze the magic smoke back into this?
 

Offline PKTKS

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #22 on: March 27, 2022, 11:06:16 am »

Hello, 21st century calling. I've got a 3D scanning application on my phone that will create a point cloud model of a real world physical scene.
(..)

((!!!))

Let me get this straight...   So you are all saying.... 

That we can now today (incredible 21th cent)..  pick a cell phone...
put it on the desktop... (just like a mainframe... or powerful PC) ...
...   and use it on the same manner..

I am sorry but I haven't seen how this is possible ..
I do own some cellphones..  and i have no F** clue how to do this

They are ALL LOCKED DEVICES...
I can not use them as regular computers to run programs .. write programs and scripts..
just because they have been totally crippled

Have any of you just tried to root ANDROID? 
or..  even simple ..   running a  BASH SHELL  (which is included by default) on it and issuing a simple  mount command on  a terminal applet (written in some java dialect) ??

I did..   several times..  it is a tragic waste of time...
These so called computers...  are *** gizmos to lock consumers into a business..

They are not computer ... if we are reaaallllly talking serious..

There is no chance in hell to compare a REAL MAINFRAME MULTIUSER device with a cellphone

Nevertheless ... I am pretty sure the folks on Apple think they are seeling something even better than a mainframe or PC and they should charge equal or more...

say what..  irrational world...  greed...  or they just count everybody as imbeciles..

and these genius rent-seekers will lock your life and business inside theirs..
like taking popcorn from children...

so.. if you all gonna pay for a device like that instead of computers... good luck...

Paul
« Last Edit: March 27, 2022, 11:24:59 am by PKTKS »
 

Offline PKTKS

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Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #23 on: March 27, 2022, 11:21:00 am »
I will drop some more absurd greedy non-sense...

Today a pretty shitty  cellphone ... locked and censored by the cloud...
is costing some thing around  U$ 3100   dollars here...

With this amount .. a last generation very capable computer PC
can be bought with all network infrastruct and  other things like external NAS..

U$ 3000 thousand dollars for a shitty cellphone is not rational
just to do browsing ...  photo gallery and shitty emojis...

i am ok if someone want to do this,,, but i can get more value for this amount...
and  who said rational plays a role...

i cal this shit.. the  IFOOOOOL

Paul
 

Offline BeBuLamar

  • Super Contributor
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  • Posts: 1420
  • Country: us
Re: Apple hardware subscription as a service
« Reply #24 on: March 27, 2022, 11:43:33 am »
Leasing/renting is not a problem for me, though I'd probably never do it. It almost always costs significantly more in the long run.

Eventually you will have to do it unless you don't want a cell phone. Apple will do it first but then other manufacturers will follow.
 
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