Arbitrary moderation?

[marshallh]

BTW on forums I've been a moderator on:

Some users delete their own posts and pretend the mods did it. Usually this is clear as day to the mods.
Some users do not.
Some mods make mistakes, and forget to mark deletions. Usually in a long string of deletions.
Some mods do not.

As a mod you will never be loved and adored by everybody. That's life. I can't really find fault with the mods here, though remember nobody is infallible.

[Simon]

In case you never noticed users don't make up moderation policy. Often telling someone reasons just opens up a whole for arguments that most don't have time for.

He was being unreasonable at best and I'd trust little of what he has to say.

Were his said posts been deleted without a warning or a note?

Not by me but frankly if i had why on earth would i want to tell him why ? so that I have to argue the toss with him for weeks after ? whatever you say he is always right.

[GeoffS]

As a mod you will never be loved and adored by everybody. That's life. I can't really find fault with the mods here, though remember nobody is infallible.

I am! And I'll delete any post that says otherwise!

[Yago]

As a mod you will never be loved and adored by everybody. That's life. I can't really find fault with the mods here, though remember nobody is infallible.

I am! And I'll delete any post that says otherwise!

Otherwise!!!!

Gotta love these threads for the swan-necking that goes on!
More lurkers than a Victorian public execution.

[zapta]

As a mod you will never be loved and adored by everybody. That's life. I can't really find fault with the mods here, though remember nobody is infallible.

I am! And I'll delete any post that says otherwise!

... after leaving a note of course.

[GeoffS]

What are these notes of which you speak?

[SeanB]

The yellow post its on his monitor............

I guess once a day Simon does garbage collection and dumps them all in the bin, then opens another packet of 3M clones.

[GEuser]

FYI

Mojo-chan has decided to take his bat and ball, and all his posts, and head on home.
So if you see his posts starting to all vanish, it's him deleting them, not the moderators.

I've noticed lately that some of his advice or assisting opinion answers in some posts were very very clinical with very abrupt clinical answers , nearly verging on Teutonic .

No sarcasm , picking on monkeys or anything funny at all , where's that Banana button gone >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

[zapta]

What are these notes of which you speak?

"Post was deleted by moderators". Extra points for explaining why.

Currently it's like communist USSR where people just disappeared from old pictures with no trace and no explanation.

I am taking about bone fide members, not first post by a spammer.

[nctnico]

In case you never noticed users don't make up moderation policy. Often telling someone reasons just opens up a whole for arguments that most don't have time for.

He was being unreasonable at best and I'd trust little of what he has to say.

Were his said posts been deleted without a warning or a note?

Not by me but frankly if i had why on earth would i want to tell him why ? so that I have to argue the toss with him for weeks after ? whatever you say he is always right.

Deleting a post has to be based on the rules set out by the maintainers of the forum. If there is room for argument then the rule is not clear.

[Simon]

If arguing the toss with the user in question is going to be so painful then clearly the post was clearly one to remove.

[nctnico]

If arguing the toss with the user in question is going to be so painful then clearly the post was clearly one to remove.

That sounds like 'apples are bananas' to me  .

[rolycat]

It would be terrific if moderators were able to take the time to provide detailed justifications for every decision they make, but given the growth of the forum it is surely unrealistic to expect this on every occasion.

However, it would appear that there are a few forum members for whom no explanation will ever be satisfactory and no attempt to act impartially ever acceptable.

To paraphrase Shaw, attempting to reason with such individuals is like attempting to wrestle a pig; you both get dirty and the pig likes it.

[Simon]

It would be terrific if moderators were able to take the time to provide detailed justifications for every decision they make, but given the growth of the forum it is surely unrealistic to expect this on every occasion.

However, it would appear that there are a few forum members for whom no explanation will ever be satisfactory and no attempt to act impartially ever acceptable.

To paraphrase Shaw, attempting to reason with such individuals is like attempting to wrestle a pig; you both get dirty and the pig likes it.

Perfectly put! 

[nctnico]

It would be terrific if moderators were able to take the time to provide detailed justifications for every decision they make, but given the growth of the forum it is surely unrealistic to expect this on every occasion.

How much trouble is it to type (copy&paste) 'message deleted because offtopic' or 'message deleted because offensive'? Just deleting posts and leaving people in the dark why is not going to help improve the forum. If moderation is taking too much time from the current moderators then Dave needs to recruit more moderators.

However, it would appear that there are a few forum members for whom no explanation will ever be satisfactory and no attempt to act impartially ever acceptable.

I'm pretty sure that is a wrong assumption. Moderators can misunderstand people's intentions as well and deleting messages without reason doesn't help to keep the peace. Like the French say 'C’est le ton qui fait la musique'.  So far I have read only one side of the story so I can't judge who is right or wrong.

[Simon]

As has been repeatedly mentioned it's all done on a case by case basis. Some people just won't be told and then complain they are being persecuted.

[Yago]

It would be terrific if moderators were able to take the time to provide detailed justifications for every decision they make, but given the growth of the forum it is surely unrealistic to expect this on every occasion.

How much trouble is it to type (copy&paste) 'message deleted because offtopic' or 'message deleted because offensive'? Just deleting posts and leaving people in the dark why is not going to help improve the forum. If moderation is taking too much time from the current moderators then Dave needs to recruit more moderators.

However, it would appear that there are a few forum members for whom no explanation will ever be satisfactory and no attempt to act impartially ever acceptable.

I'm pretty sure that is a wrong assumption. Moderators can misunderstand people's intentions as well and deleting messages without reason doesn't help to keep the peace. Like the French say 'C’est le ton qui fait la musique'.  So far I have read only one side of the story so I can't judge who is right or wrong.

Seems that if only the mods and the user can delete the post there is little mystery.
As long as the mods are prepared to try to explain in PM I think that is fine, endless debates on the forum only make things harder to move on for some.

Not sure how the mod control panel is set up etc, a couple things I found helpful are a closed moderator section to discuss/record problems and actions, and instead of deleting posts, make them invisible to the userbase (very easy for all the mod team to see past events after moderation),

[zapta]

How much trouble is it to type (copy&paste) 'message deleted because offtopic' or 'message deleted because offensive'? Just deleting posts and leaving people in the dark why is not going to help improve the forum.

Very well said.

[EEVblog]

It would be terrific if moderators were able to take the time to provide detailed justifications for every decision they make, but given the growth of the forum it is surely unrealistic to expect this on every occasion.

All we can say is we'll do our best.

And also please remember the stats on the forum, there is very little moderation and deleting of posts on this forum.

However, it would appear that there are a few forum members for whom no explanation will ever be satisfactory and no attempt to act impartially ever acceptable.

Yes, that will always be the case unfortunately. We've seen it's a before and it's certainty we'll see it again.
There is also the time it takes to debate these people. Either publicly or privately it's a waste of everyones time and in many cases you can't win to matter who much to try and appease them. It can also be rather impersonal when some of them are completely anonymous.

[EEVblog]

The solution might be a forum mod that inserts a standard template message or something if a moderator deletes a message. I'll have a look to see if there is any mod like that.

[zapta]

The solution might be a forum mod that inserts a standard template message or something if a moderator deletes a message. I'll have a look to see if there is any mod like that.

This will be a good step forward. At least we will be able to tell between an official deletion and a bug.

[EEVblog]

Let's try to move past this.

Yes. Now that you've had your say of the events, that's the last anyone wants to hear of this issue.

The moderators will try to leave a message if a post is deleted, and that's usually been the case in the past.

[zapta]

Let's try to move past this.

Yes. Now that you've had your say of the events, that's the last anyone wants to hear of this issue.

The moderators will try to leave a message if a post is deleted, and that's usually been the case in the past.

You may want to check this mod

http://custom.simplemachines.org/mods/index.php?mod=1007

It facilitates deletion by moderators and allows to defined a canned message.

Edit: welcome back Mojo Chan.

[SgtRock]

Dear Mojo-Chan:

--By all means. Please stick around. You are an important and helpful contributor. I once came to the defence of an unpopular fellow in a blog, when he was attacked on the basis of nationality. The gentleman I remonstrated this with, then put me on his ignore list, and after that he would then post on every other thread I was involved in, a diatribe stating that I was on his ignore list, and everyone else should put me there as well. In any case I finally posted a comment to the effect that I wished someone else would piss the guy off, so he could hound them for a change. My comments were deleted, but after that I had no trouble. So the moderators did the right thing and saved me a lot of flames. Dave, in my estimation, besides being a real engineer, and a confessed tight ass, I am willing to bet, budgets his time very carefully. Dave has a beautiful family and a full time job, and you can bet that he is completely dedicated to both. Dave really does not have an extra hour or even 20 minutes of time to deal with our problems. Dave once had to ban a fellow, that was far from all bad, because his flippant tone of voice was irritating just too many people. For the past few years the fellow has been to proud to reapply. Sad because this is the best forum he has ever been on, I am sure. I am glad you decided to stay. So let us all forgive each other and let Dave have some peace.

--My neighbour just this minute brought me two identical Sony Bravia KDL-32L504 32" LED TVs. Both were made in August 2009, and both have the classic double image characteristic of tab bond issues. I have ordered some rubber bumpers, and will attempt to place them between the frame and the tabs, to hold them down, and save these "like new" HD units from the scrap yard. I will l post pictures next week in Repairs. Cheers!

Why, sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast."
The Queen from "Alice in Wonderland"
Charles Lutwidge Dodgson (Lewis Carroll)  1832  -  1898

Best Regards
Clear Ether

[EEVblog]

You may want to check this mod
http://custom.simplemachines.org/mods/index.php?mod=1007
It facilitates deletion by moderators and allows to defined a canned message.

Ok, installed. Designed for spam, but lets see how it works for deletion of posts that are in the best interests of the forum.
I'll post something and then delete it here in the next message...