EEVblog Electronics Community Forum
General => General Technical Chat => Topic started by: steverino on March 22, 2018, 01:21:32 am
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One of things that became apparent to me as a reader of this forum is the independent nature of Australians. I guess this could be summed up as their no bullshit attitude. I know there's a danger of over generalizations, but I think the Aussies would agree.
I was just watching a youtube video featuring an interview between Marcello Kayak (an amazing technician on the guitar) and John Williams the classical guitarist (not the composer). John spent his early childhood in Australia and he was commenting on the Australian attitude (he used the phrase "nonaggressive" anarchists to characterize this). Anyway, he told a story, true he claimed, that demonstrated the Aussie independent nature. I thought I'd retell it, as best I can, as I found it rather humorous.
There was a formal dinner after the Ashes cricket competition, in Australia, between England and Australia. During the dinner, bread rolls and butter were being served. The person in charge of dispensing the pad of butter for the rolls would give each diner a single pad of butter. One person asked, "May I please have another pad of butter", to which the server said "no". The requester then stated "I'll have you know I'm the president of the New Wales Cricket Association". The server replied "and I'm the bloke with the butter!"
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That sort of response from the server is easily credible from a certain type of Aussie - but I wouldn't expect it to be displayed at a formal dinner like that - and certainly not for something as trivial as a pad of butter. Perhaps at a blue-collar pub or out in the bush - but even then, we generally aren't that stingy about little things like that.
There is the possibility that he may have "read the room" and it was a bit of cheeky engagement for a laugh by everyone at the table - but if it was a serious statement, the server would have copped some repercussions.
However, "shit-stirring" is a national pastime.
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While I would like to think Australians (including me!) are all free thinkers etc, in some ways our society is not. eg in many countries taking your pet dog into town or even the pub is fine, but only rarely seen in Australia.
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Actually, I forgot to state John's final observation. You can't pull rank on an Aussie.
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I'd typed my story before seeing this - but it makes for a good intro to it:
Actually, I forgot to state John's final observation. You can't pull rank on an Aussie.
If you want a real example of an Aussie response - then let me tell you a true story....
Many years ago there was a project running at the company I was working for. It was a major process change using a modularised system that purportedly could do all manner of wonderful things through a series of integrated components. This company went for a high-end solution, taking up quite a few components. It looked really good on paper, but the trouble was, when the pre-contract site visits were done, no single site had anywhere near that degree of complexity installed. They had 3 or 4 components which varied from site to site and these examples seemed to be running well.
The fun began once the contract was signed.
The degree of integration that looked so good on paper, simply didn't exist in the real world. The vendor's USA head office sent over a rolling contingent that spent ages trying to tame the beast and the local branch had a few reps in there as well. It was an absolute schmozzle and there was no sense of success anywhere on the horizon.
Then one day a senior exec from the US head office came out to "address the troops". The US contingent was in awe. I got the sense that he was more respected than the President of the USA. It was almost a case of bow and scrape and "Yes, Sir. No, Sir. Three bags full, Sir".
Did I say "almost"?
Anyway, he and the staff from both the USA and Australia went out to a dinner. At that dinner he made his address speaking of their fine efforts and the success of the project (or something like that. It was utter bullshit - and as obvious as hell). The US contingent sat there nodding. The Aussies burst out laughing. The US contingent were aghast that such disrespect was show to one so high and mighty in the company. You just do what is expected, believe what you're told and behave like you should..!!!
Sorry ... With so much bullshit, it's not going to happen in Australia.
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American military pilots....didn't like us pointing our bare bums at them as they taxied out. We saw them being saluted by their crews we thought...yeah bum salute appropriate. Anyways they took great offence very very unhappy very tense situation, something about denigrating their flag, which of course is not what was intended and IMHO they really needed to lighten up. I guess no sense of humour!
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One of things that became apparent to me as a reader of this forum is the independent nature of Australians. I guess this could be summed up as their no bullshit attitude. I know there's a danger of over generalizations, but I think the Aussies would agree.
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There's a "larrikin" spirit (old-fashioned word, that) that was (maybe still is) one of the best aspects of Australian culture. My guess is it that came from the early Irish convicts/settlers and their contempt for the English landowners and political class.
One of the features of this spirit was suspicion of those with power and financial success. There was this unspoken feeling that success of that kind was nearly always due to dishonesty and corruption. The only success that Aussies fully celebrated was sporting success - it was seen as clean, honest, untainted, worthy of respect. At one time - I'm going back decades - you could put your life in danger by walking into any working-class pub and bad-mouthing a sporting icon like Sir Donald Bradman.
Americans were seen as bizarre with their worship of people with money. The English were seen as ridiculous with their stunted, stultifying class system.
The worst aspect of larrikinism was its anti-intellectualism. Australian life was narrow and narrow-minded. That has changed greatly in the last fifty years.
You can see two great examples of larrikinism in former Prime Minister Bob Hawke, and in the movie character Crocodile Dundee (played by former comedian Paul Hogan).
There is an interesting historical story involving Bob Hawke, when he was a trade union leader. At the time, Frank Sinatra had flown in, with his hangers-on, to give concerts here. But towards the end of this visit, Cranky Franky insulted a female journalist, calling her a hooker.
The unions didn't take kindly to an American blowhard mouthing off, so they blackbanned him, his entourage, and most importantly, Cranky Franky's plane. Sinatra couldn't leave the country. His mafia connections couldn't help him here. Sinatra was stranded.
Nationwide, it was a major news story, and Aussie schadenfreude reached epic levels. ACTU President Bob Hawke had to intervene, by smoothing things over with various unions, and getting Sinatra to realize that he only way he was leaving was to issue an apology. Which he did.
Aussie larrikinism, and its distrust of bigshots, were in full effect. Wonderful.
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I can’t comment on the Aussies beign this or that.
However over the years I’ve tried to read lots of articles about the different behavioral traits of cultures around the world (generally speaking), and I’ll just say that the matter is so complex that I’d pay 1000€ for a book that would explain country by country how most people are.
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Aussie larrikinism, and its distrust of bigshots, were in full effect. Wonderful.
Demanding respect from Aussies rarely works. Earning it, however, is something quite different.
... and you can't take yourself too seriously. There has to be a point where you can laugh at yourself.
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American military pilots....didn't like us pointing our bare bums at them as they taxied out. We saw them being saluted by their crews we thought...yeah bum salute appropriate. Anyways they took great offence very very unhappy very tense situation, something about denigrating their flag, which of course is not what was intended and IMHO they really needed to lighten up. I guess no sense of humour!
Hah! I certainly would have been amused, although I suppose it would get old after a while if it kept happening. I'm not in the military though.
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I don't know, I've always felt that everything touched by The Queen has similar oddball quirks. I don't feel it's a coincidence that the UK and Australia have internet filtering and Canada has weird laws regarding cartoon violence.
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Aussie larrikinism, and its distrust of bigshots, were in full effect. Wonderful.
Demanding respect from Aussies rarely works. Earning it, however, is something quite different.
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I can't remember where I read it, but there is a story set (I think) in WWII England that goes like this.
Two Australian infantrymen are in a bar, having a drink. A British Army officer walks in, and goes over to them. He is offended because the Australians haven't saluted.
He demands that they salute. The two Aussies nonchalantly decline.
"I am a British Army officer!"
"And a good job it is too," says one of the men. "You keep it."
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American military pilots....didn't like us pointing our bare bums at them as they taxied out. We saw them being saluted by their crews we thought...yeah bum salute appropriate. Anyways they took great offence very very unhappy very tense situation, something about denigrating their flag, which of course is not what was intended and IMHO they really needed to lighten up. I guess no sense of humour!
Gees! They ought to see what goes on in the Australian Defence Forces! The Yanks got off lightly. Unprofessional, yes, but all in good fun. We all fight for the same team in the end.
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However, "shit-stirring" is a national pastime.
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I've always appreciated this about the Aussies. I thought it was from living in an environment where everything that crawls, slithers, flies, and swims can kill you and possibly want to eat you.
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There is an interesting historical story involving Bob Hawke, when he was a trade union leader. At the time, Frank Sinatra had flown in, with his hangers-on, to give concerts here. But towards the end of this visit, Cranky Franky insulted a female journalist, calling her a hooker.
The unions didn't take kindly to an American blowhard mouthing off, so they blackbanned him, his entourage, and most importantly, Cranky Franky's plane. Sinatra couldn't leave the country. His mafia connections couldn't help him here. Sinatra was stranded.
Nationwide, it was a major news story, and Aussie schadenfreude reached epic levels. ACTU President Bob Hawke had to intervene, by smoothing things over with various unions, and getting Sinatra to realize that he only way he was leaving was to issue an apology. Which he did.
Aussie larrikinism, and its distrust of bigshots, were in full effect. Wonderful.
Reasonable movie about that - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Night_We_Called_It_a_Day_(film) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Night_We_Called_It_a_Day_(film))
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I've always appreciated this about the Aussies. I thought it was from living in an environment where everything that crawls, slithers, flies, and swims can kill you and possibly want to eat you.
I've never understood people who live in a country like the USA, with big, furry land animals that can, & will, eat you being worried about a few snakes, crocodiles & things.
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The whole deadly animals thing is a bit of a myth. Sure, we have some of the most venomous creatures in the world, but for the most part, you'll probably never come across them.
Most spiders you find around your garden and home (at least in Sydney) are harmless, in fact they are beneficial. Same with snakes, if you happen to come across one, it's likely going to be more scared of you than you are of it.
At the end of the day, if you respect these creatures and give them space, they'll leave you alone. If you go around poking the bear, expect to get bitten.
In Australia there has been 1 fatality in past 39 years from a spider bite and 19 deaths from a snake bite in the past 10 years (and most of those occurred in regional/rural areas). It's really not that common.
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OT but Last month I learned on “River Monsters” that Australia homes the stonefish and the box jellyfish, both as deadly as cyanide.
In the US I’d be wary of camping in some areas as there are ticks that carry the Lyme disease, nasty too.
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Don't forget this little guy (a big one is only 8" in size)
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/aussie's-attitudes/?action=dlattach;attach=406421;image)
Just make sure you keep your distance - especially when those blue rings get bright.
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I am sure there is some sort of Aussie character, but if you are anything like the US it comes with lots of caveats and exceptions. The character of a southern redneck, a Compton gangbanger, a Boston brahmen and a North Hollywood hipster have more differences than commonalities.
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OT but Last month I learned on “River Monsters” that Australia homes the stonefish and the box jellyfish, both as deadly as cyanide.
In the US I’d be wary of camping in some areas as there are ticks that carry the Lyme disease, nasty too.
Lyme disease is increasingly becoming a problem in many parts of the world. It’s nasty indeed. I’ve seen people contract it and get violently ill, never being quite the same person again.
Parasites are nasty creatures at the best of times, but when they’re carrying potentially permanently lifechanging diseases they become a real nightmare.
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I don't feel it's a coincidence that the UK and Australia have internet filtering and Canada has weird laws regarding cartoon violence.
I don't know where you get these strange ideas, but there is no Internet filtering in the UK.
A few, a very few websites have been banned in the UK by court order, usually for commercial reasons (e.g. piracy), and in practice that means you can't see them if, and only if, you rely on the DNS servers of a handful of the biggest ISPs to find them for you.
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It may say something about Aussie attitudes in that, in the UK, we "take the piss out of" out mates, in Aus you "rip the piss out of" your mates.
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I don't know where you get these strange ideas, but there is no Internet filtering in the UK.
A few, a very few websites have been banned in the UK by court order, usually for commercial reasons (e.g. piracy), and in practice that means you can't see them if, and only if, you rely on the DNS servers of a handful of the biggest ISPs to find them for you.
Have you followed the news? Reporter without Borders lists the UK amongst the “Enemies of the internet”, alongside contries like Saudi Arabia, Iran, China and Pakistan. There’s ever more surveillance and filterting going on. Let’s also not forget the plan to filter internet porn, requiring anyone wanting to see a naughty video to register. Or how it’s one of the very few nations that has a decryption law, locking people up for failure to decrypt.
The same is happening in real life. The CCTV density is unlike pretty much any other place on Earth. There’s no doubt about it, the UK government makes your business its business.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_the_United_Kingdom (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_the_United_Kingdom)
http://www.wired.co.uk/article/porn-block-ban-in-the-uk-age-verifcation-law (http://www.wired.co.uk/article/porn-block-ban-in-the-uk-age-verifcation-law)
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My guess is it that came from the early Irish convicts/settlers and their contempt for the English landowners and political class.
Typical bloody Irish trying to take the credit for being the salt of the earth. :) The vast majority of transportees from England were poor Londoners*, which is where the cheery cockney piss-taking and lack of respect for 'persons' that is close to my heart transmutes into the common Aussie bloke-ishness. I don't think it's an accident that you're as likely to hear "I'm just an ordinary bloke" from a working class Londoner as you are from an Aussie.
*Of the 162,000 transportees, 26,000 women were from London (and Middlesex - adjacent and nowadays just part of London). I haven't been able to find a figure for Male transportees from the same area, but overall 4 1/2 times an many men as women were transported, which implies that Male transportees from London and Middlesex were about 116,000 in number. So about 73% of transportees were Londoners.
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The whole deadly animals thing is a bit of a myth. Sure, we have some of the most venomous creatures in the world, but for the most part, you'll probably never come across them..........
Jeez worked in Katherine Northern Territory, 75SQN F18's (330Klms south of Darwin)....croc's, water Buffalo (not the American type), snakes....did I mention the croc's! Every time you went near any water (up north) you had to be very aware...in fact you didn't go near it unless fishing...did I mention the fishing..."Barra" best eating fish ever!
Loved the place best positing ever. US Marine SQN visited occasionally some for ~ month or more. They hated it way to far from civilisation and no port for shipping cargo no McDonalds (in 90's).
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One thing I've noticed about Australia is that you love your rules!
I was on a tram or train in Sydney and counted something like 18 different signs telling to not to do this and warning about fines if you do that.
The way they are worded is very authoritarian as well. Something like "You will be fined $200 if you eat on this train" Whereas here in NZ it might say something like "For the comfort of other passengers, please refrain from eating on the train"
Just walking around the city, there seems to be rules everywhere!
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One thing I've noticed about Australia is that you love your rules!
I was on a tram or train in Sydney and counted something like 18 different signs telling to not to do this and warning about fines if you do that.
The way they are worded is very authoritarian as well. Something like "You will be fined $200 if you eat on this train" Whereas here in NZ it might say something like "For the comfort of other passengers, please refrain from eating on the train"
Just walking around the city, there seems to be rules everywhere!
Maybe that’s a matter of tuning the message to the recipient. Insubordinate monkeys need firm guidance. ;D
I’m jesting, for anyone confused.
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Have you followed the news? Reporter without Borders lists the UK amongst the “Enemies of the internet”, alongside contries like Saudi Arabia, Iran, China and Pakistan. There’s ever more surveillance and filterting going on. Let’s also not forget the plan to filter internet porn, requiring anyone wanting to see a naughty video to register. Or how it’s one of the very few nations that has a decryption law, locking people up for failure to decrypt.
The same is happening in real life. The CCTV density is unlike pretty much any other place on Earth. There’s no doubt about it, the UK government makes your business its business.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_the_United_Kingdom (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_the_United_Kingdom)
http://www.wired.co.uk/article/porn-block-ban-in-the-uk-age-verifcation-law (http://www.wired.co.uk/article/porn-block-ban-in-the-uk-age-verifcation-law)
I'm not going to be baited into debating it here, because that will just de-rail the thread. So I'm going to correct the misinformation and then shut up.
Your claim that there is general Internet filtering in the UK in the sense that any reasonable person would understand by that phrase doesn't hold water. China, yes, Turkey yes, Egypt, yes, UK no. I have never, ever, in all my years using the Internet from the UK (1993-present) encountered a page saying "You're not allowed to see that". Then again, I've never gone looking for child pornography which is the only thing (other than the aforementioned court ordered blocks) that is ever officially filtered, and that is not by all ISPs by any means.
That some ISPs, mostly mobile phone providers, provide opt-in or opt-out content filtering is not a UK phenomenon, ISPs the world over offer some variety of 'family-friendly' Internet. This is not the same as your implication that 'the UK filters the Internet'.
The reason that I have a fair insight into how the UK Internet really works is because I was the network manager for one of the UK's earliest ISPs (10th to start by my count), was there the day that the LINX voted to fund the Internet Watch Foundation (who provide the filter lists for child pornography sites), was a non-executive director of the London Internet Exchange for years, stayed in the business until the mid 2000s and still have plenty of contact with people who are still at the coal face. If there were sub-rosa activity to filter content that the general public didn't know about, I probably would.
The putative "porn blocking" doesn't actually exist yet, is not actually blocking, and at the rate it is going it probably never will. It was a sop to certain pressure groups (i.e. the DUP) and they are just discovering that saying "let there be age verification" and actually doing it are two very, very different things. Anyway, the onus on age-verification is on the porn sites, they're not being filtered. It's just the same as bars, prove your age or we won't let you in to partake. Sure, blocking for non-compliance is a possibility, but so is having your bar shut down if you regularly serve under-age drinkers.
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I'm not going to be baited into debating it here, because that will just de-rail the thread. So I'm going to correct the misinformation and then shut up.
Your claim that there is general Internet filtering in the UK in the sense that any reasonable person would understand by that phrase doesn't hold water. China, yes, Turkey yes, Egypt, yes, UK no. I have never, ever, in all my years using the Internet from the UK (1993-present) encountered a page saying "You're not allowed to see that". Then again, I've never gone looking for child pornography which is the only thing (other than the aforementioned court ordered blocks) that is ever officially filtered, and that is not by all ISPs by any means.
That some ISPs, mostly mobile phone providers, provide opt-in or opt-out content filtering is not a UK phenomenon, ISPs the world over offer some variety of 'family-friendly' Internet. This is not the same as your implication that 'the UK filters the Internet'.
The reason that I have a fair insight into how the UK Internet really works is because I was the network manager for one of the UK's earliest ISPs (10th to start by my count), was there the day that the LINX voted to fund the Internet Watch Foundation (who provide the filter lists for child pornography sites), was a non-executive director of the London Internet Exchange for years, stayed in the business until the mid 2000s and still have plenty of contact with people who are still at the coal face. If there were sub-rosa activity to filter content that the general public didn't know about, I probably would.
The putative "porn blocking" doesn't actually exist yet, is not actually blocking, and at the rate it is going it probably never will. It was a sop to certain pressure groups (i.e. the DUP) and they are just discovering that saying "let there be age verification" and actually doing it are two very, very different things. Anyway, the onus on age-verification is on the porn sites, they're not being filtered. It's just the same as bars, prove your age or we won't let you in to partake. Sure, blocking for non-compliance is a possibility, but so is having your bar shut down if you regularly serve under-age drinkers.
Let's be clear that you are actively debating it here. That ship has sailed and backing out later under the guise of this proclamation isn't going to save face. ;) You should also be careful not to shoot the messenger. The reasonable person you speak of would understand that a well respected journalist organisation, from a sector with a large stake in and knowledge of freedom of information, has listed the UK as an enemy of the internet. So Iran yes. China yes. UK yes. It is what it is. As you could read in the article I linked the blocking started in the mid 2000's and escalated from there, so it's very possible you missed it.
It's also important to note that it's not just about heinous crimes committed against children. Few people will object to that and that type of content was actually the first to be blocked. Overblocking has occurred in many categories, amongst which political satire, feminism and gay content, civil liberties and computing sites, but also Childline, NSPCC, and Police websites.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_the_United_Kingdom (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_the_United_Kingdom)
https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/uk-branded-an-enemy-of-the-internet-for-the-first-time-by-reporters-without-borders-9196571.html (https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/uk-branded-an-enemy-of-the-internet-for-the-first-time-by-reporters-without-borders-9196571.html)
"Since the mid-2000s there has been a gradual shift toward increased surveillance and police measures in the UK. National security concerns, the need to fight terrorism and crime, and issues regarding child protection have resulted in the state introducing extensive surveillance measures over online communications as well as filtering and tracking practices. In some cases these are encouraged or required by the state and used by state agencies. In others they are voluntarily implemented by private operators (e.g., internet service providers).[5]
The country was listed among the "Enemies of the Internet" in 2014 by Reporters Without Borders,[6] a category of countries with the highest level of internet censorship and surveillance that "mark themselves out not just for their capacity to censor news and information online but also for their almost systematic repression of Internet users".[7] Other major economies listed in this category include China, Iran, Pakistan, Russia and Saudi Arabia.
Current situation
Internet customers in the UK are prohibited from accessing a range of web sites by default, because they have their Internet access filtered by their ISPs. The filtering program has applied to new ISP customers since the end of 2013, and has been extended to existing users on a rolling basis. A voluntary code of practice agreed by all four major ISPs[8] means that customers have to 'opt out' of the ISP filtering to gain access to the blocked content.[9] However, the complex nature of the active monitoring systems means that users cannot usually opt out of the monitoring and re-routing of their data traffic, something which may render their data security vulnerable. The range of content blocked by ISPs can be varied over time.[10] Categories blocked across the major ISPs include: Dating, Drugs, Alcohol and Tobacco, File sharing, Gambling, Games, Pornography, Nudity, Social networking, Suicide and Self-harm, Weapons and violence, Obscenity, Criminal Skills, Hate, Media Streaming, Fashion and Beauty, Gore, Cyberbullying, Hacking and Web-blocking circumvention tools"
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It may say something about Aussie attitudes in that, in the UK, we "take the piss out of" out mates,
That's what I hear here.
in Aus you "rip the piss out of" your mates.
I can't recall ever having heard that.
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It may say something about Aussie attitudes in that, in the UK, we "take the piss out of" out mates,
That's what I hear here.
in Aus you "rip the piss out of" your mates.
I can't recall ever having heard that.
I've known quite a few Aussies use the phrase, definitely one from Melbourne and one from Perth.
Maybe it's just the girls, both the ones I'm certain about using it are Women. :)
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Oh. Melbournians.
The gender bias could be a factor too. I've observed that sometimes the girls can make the guys blush.
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I've observed that sometimes the girls can make the guys blush.
Blush? Sometimes you just hope that they don't decide to eat you. Based on several experiences some years ago, probably later than I should have done, I formulated a rule for myself "Never go out drinking with a party that consists of only Aussie girls and yourself". I mean it was fun, but ...
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I can’t comment on the Aussies beign this or that.
However over the years I’ve tried to read lots of articles about the different behavioral traits of cultures around the world (generally speaking), and I’ll just say that the matter is so complex that I’d pay 1000€ for a book that would explain country by country how most people are.
It is called cultural anthopology. Plenty of good books around, and I can send you one for a 1000€ :).
Incidentally, our Aussie culture is strongly influenced by other cultures, especially in the big cities. Overall, culturally, immigration has been good for the country. For example, most Aussies enjoy Indian, Chinese, Vietnamee, Italian, Greek, and American cuisine (if you call McDonalds "cuisine"). Actually I do not think there is such a thing as Australian cuisine. Meat pies, Vegemite and damper are not exactly what one might call cuisine. Australia is one big mix of cultures.
Some cultural behaviours from immigrants conflict with our norms and some can be considered offensive; and vice versa. Some immigrants try hard to learn English and assimilate well, whilst others are not interested and remain stuck in their communities. My daughter emigrated from Australia to France. She is fluent in French - reading, writing, and speaking - both at a normal and academic level. When she moved, she purposely avoided English speakers and indulge herself into the French culture. She forced herself to learn French and has worked hard. That's the way to learn a language and a culture, not hide away in an ethnic ghetto.
Unlike the French who have a government institution to protect the French language, Australia does not even have English as its official language. What is the official language of Australia? There is none.
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Overall I'd say we do have that sort of attitude here...I think a lot stems from our foundation as a nation. From the late 1700s up until the late 1800s, a lot of settlers came to a country that was largely inhospitable compared with where they came from, they had to essentially build civilisation from the ground up, start from the very beginning, tame the land, overcome the numerous difficulties with the different climate, wildlife, etc...so I think this instilled a sense of rugged independence, this sense of striving to prove ones worth. Though there has been a massive shift away from this mindset, and I've noticed this a lot with younger generations/my generation...more and more people are buying into the idea that you need government approval/permission to do xyz, rather than going out there themselves and taking the risk. But this sort of carefree attitude is still prevalent.
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One thing I've noticed about Australia is that you love your rules!
Only their own ! :P
They don't give a shit about international sporting rules.....cricket ball tampering in SA.
<ducks for cover and runs>
For those that have missed it:
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2018/mar/25/an-unashamed-disgrace-ball-tampering-cheats-australian-cricket-fans (https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2018/mar/25/an-unashamed-disgrace-ball-tampering-cheats-australian-cricket-fans)
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You don't have to duck.
I - and I'm sure there will be many other Aussies - am completely pissed off with those idiots. Right now, I'd be happy to bundle them up and drop them in your backyard for you to do whatever you want with them.
Absolute disgrace.
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You don't have to duck.
I - and I'm sure there will be many other Aussies - am completely pissed off with those idiots. Right now, I'd be happy to bundle them up and drop them in your backyard for you to do whatever you want with them.
Absolute disgrace.
We haven't heard the last of this I suspect.......what will the ICC do ?
Lifetime bans ?
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Don't know. Don't care - aside from them getting their just desserts. This isn't just an "error of judgement", it was a deliberate, planned exercise for something that should have just not entered into the thinking of players - at ANY level .... but as a national representative team.... ##$**#%^$@#%$#%&$$%^$!!!!!!
After a stunt like that, I wouldn't have any of them in a local club cricket team.
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It is called cultural anthopology. Plenty of good books around, and I can send you one for a 1000€ :).
I think he's after a pocket guide to the world's cultures, not a collection of essays on regional differences in reindeer herding practices in the Sami. Something like "Phineas Fogg's Guide to Foreigners, their Customs and Habits; or Why the French are so Terrible".
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Couldn't resist >:D not linking this pic in that my boy spotted on FB from a ZA cricket fan..... :-DD
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/aussie's-attitudes/?action=dlattach;attach=407911)
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It is called cultural anthopology. Plenty of good books around, and I can send you one for a 1000€ :).
I think he's after a pocket guide to the world's cultures, not a collection of essays on regional differences in reindeer herding practices in the Sami. Something like "Phineas Fogg's Guide to Foreigners, their Customs and Habits; or Why the French are so Terrible".
Yes more like that. It would be awesome in doing business for example: with Northamericans better get straight to the point, with Turks make friends before negotiating, Asians will say 'yes' even when they mean 'no'... These are clear differences but I've read articles depicting very subtle ones among close countries, this a deep subject and there is a lot to cover, material right now is disseminated and offered with a variety of detail.
To me the real barrier for effective communication is culture not language