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“Battery EV” vs “Hydrogen Fuel cell EV”

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nctnico:

--- Quote from: Miyuki on November 26, 2021, 04:47:54 pm ---
--- Quote from: nctnico on November 26, 2021, 04:25:50 pm ---
--- Quote from: tom66 on November 26, 2021, 10:48:52 am ---
--- Quote from: nctnico on November 26, 2021, 01:00:01 am ---It doesn't work that way. Currently many of those installations have garantees that whatever they produce is to be absorbed by the grid. Another problem with turning wind turbines and solar panels off is that the electricity they produce is going to be more expensive because the ROI per time period has to remain the same in order to make the interest payments.

--- End quote ---

They're only paid these guarantees because we need a base load now.

--- End quote ---
No. It is because otherwise wind and solar are not profitable so governments are giving the companies that invest into wind and solar guarantees that whatever they produce will be bought AND for a minimum price. Electricity prices may even go negative but the tax payer is paying nevertheless in order to make sure the solar and wind companies are getting the minimum price per kWh.

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The truth is European "market" is weird as they try to push renewables by force and pay guaranteed fixed prices, sometimes really high compared to the end-user price just to promote more installations even in places without good conditions

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It is not weird. It is subsidizing development and mass deployment of new technology. For a lot of new technologies the initial market is too risky for companies to invest into. If deemed worthy, governments can step in to carry part of the R&D costs and cover part of the initial risks. Contrary to popular believe this does not mean governments (at least in Europe) hand out bags with money without any strings attached. The aim is to give companies a stepping stone to introduce new technologies that can become profitable and in turn create jobs and economic growth. For example: there are hundreds of subsidy programs for all kinds of new technology development available across Europe.

SiliconWizard:

--- Quote from: nctnico on November 26, 2021, 05:18:35 pm ---Contrary to popular believe this does not mean governments (at least in Europe) hand out bags with money without any strings attached. (...)
For example: there are hundreds of subsidy programs for all kinds of new technology development available across Europe.

--- End quote ---

That's a cute way of putting it. Would you happen to be involved in one of those projects yourself?

nctnico:

--- Quote from: SiliconWizard on November 26, 2021, 07:49:56 pm ---
--- Quote from: nctnico on November 26, 2021, 05:18:35 pm ---Contrary to popular believe this does not mean governments (at least in Europe) hand out bags with money without any strings attached. (...)
For example: there are hundreds of subsidy programs for all kinds of new technology development available across Europe.

--- End quote ---

That's a cute way of putting it. Would you happen to be involved in one of those projects yourself?

--- End quote ---
Every company that does some form of R&D in the Netherlands is receiving some kind of government subsidy. This has been the case for the past several decades that I have been working as an electronics & firmware  design engineer. And that is very likely the case for all countries / companies in Europe. So if you are involved in R&D then part of your salary is coming from such subsidies (unless your employer likes to pay more salaries and more taxes).

strawberry:
why no one talk about oxygen usage(people cant survive without)
fossil energy source is same as hydrogen(is produced by splitting natural gas in H and carbon components and no oxygen) they both use oxygen in combustion or some fancy cell
for some reason carbon neutral was first invented by some fossil energy company

nctnico:

--- Quote from: strawberry on November 26, 2021, 09:17:27 pm ---why no one talk about oxygen usage(people cant survive without)

--- End quote ---
Because there is more than enough of oxygen. Humanity has thrown how many trillion metric tonnes of CO2 in the air and the concentration went from 0.2% to 0.4%. With oxygen being around 16% (IIRC) it should be clear that oxygen usage is of no concern at all.

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