General > General Technical Chat
“Battery EV” vs “Hydrogen Fuel cell EV”
TimFox:
The main commercial source for hydrogen gas at present is natural gas (methane), but I believe that most of the hydrogen on earth is contained in water (bound to oxygen).
tom66:
--- Quote from: strawberry on November 26, 2021, 09:17:27 pm ---why no one talk about oxygen usage(people cant survive without)
fossil energy source is same as hydrogen(is produced by splitting natural gas in H and carbon components and no oxygen) they both use oxygen in combustion or some fancy cell
for some reason carbon neutral was first invented by some fossil energy company
--- End quote ---
Typically, green hydrogen is produced from water and electricity, electrolysis, so oxygen will be released from that. Hydrogen produced from natural gas by steam reforming is oxygen neutral.
The atmosphere is also about 21% oxygen. Even the most aggressive fossil fuel use has 'only' increased CO2 from 0.035% to 0.045%. It is hard to imagine how we could e.g. decrease oxygen from 21% to 19%, which would begin to present issues for humans.
strawberry:
mostly tap water could be in short supply
or sea water desalination plants
without closed loop cant be green nor sustainable
bp is green, so
end of consumerism
100% manual dismantling
reusing/repurposing used metal parts in other areas
if tesla turns out to be piggy bank?
not1xor1:
--- Quote from: nctnico on November 26, 2021, 04:25:50 pm ---No. It is because otherwise wind and solar are not profitable so governments are giving the companies that invest into wind and solar guarantees that whatever they produce will be bought AND for a minimum price. Electricity prices may even go negative but the tax payer is paying nevertheless in order to make sure the solar and wind companies are getting the minimum price per kWh.
--- End quote ---
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_subsidy:
--- Quote ---On 6 October, 2021, The Guardian reported on an IMF study detailing how "the fossil fuel industry gets subsidies of $11m a minute...[and]...trillions of dollars a year are ‘adding fuel to the fire’ of the climate crisis... Setting fossil fuel prices that reflect their true cost would cut global CO2 emissions by over a third, the IMF analysts said."
--- End quote ---
in 2017 fossil fuel subsides were still 3-4 times more than renewable energy ones
https://www.irena.org/publications/2020/Apr/Energy-Subsidies-2020
see also:
https://www.iea.org/topics/energy-subsidies
MadScientist:
This argument sounds a lot like the proponents of Betamax arguing it’s merits long after the industry had basically abandoned the format.
Car companies are going BEV. End of discussion
Those arguing about EV issues have clearly never owned one. I have both a diesel van and an electric car. My EV has 275,000km on it and my van has 290,000km. In all the time Ive never either run out of diesel nor electricity and that’s the experience of vast majority of people
As for comments about not having a driveway , most people in dense housing situations , which proper town planning , don’t need cars , both my adult kids living in major European capitals don’t have cars , nor do their peer group. Both rent them as needed now and again.
The average car commute is 14 km per day. With current EV ranges approaching 500 km , that charging about once a fortnight , easily done at a local fast charging station. No need for a driveway and not to mention many workplaces have fitted charging points , PAYPAL HQ has 50 in its parking lot near me.
Electric motors are fast , powerful , way better then the 19th century bag of bolts. Once you drive all electric you rarely go back.
Embrace it , it’s going to be all encompassing
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