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“Battery EV” vs “Hydrogen Fuel cell EV”
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2N3055:

--- Quote from: tom66 on March 26, 2022, 09:53:30 pm ---
Arguably the hydrogen car doesn't really solve the infrastructure problems that EVs have.  EVs have a lower infrastructure requirement simply because ~50% can be charged overnight on a driveway.  And probably another 10-20% of those could be charged at work instead of in public.  So the problem really comes to providing charging to those who park on the street every night.


--- End quote ---

You misunderstand. Putting chargers on the street is not biggest problem.
There is NO electrical infrastructure in the country to power them.
My country has several hydro powerplants and one nuclear. We actually, today, have VERY green electricity and have surplus of electricity.
But we would need to build one or two more nuclear plants like one we already have to satisfy needed capacity...
And then create triple the capacity in distribution network, from large high voltage country wide to the end user transformers on the block...

Provided we do that overnight using Star Trek replicators and unlimited funds, our, mostly old cities, don't have space for that infrastructure..
Hydrogen pump is just that. A pump. That can be put where convenient.
They don't have to be where I can leave a car overnight. Because you simply go there and top up hydrogen in minutes. Same convenience as current carbon based fuels..

Everybody forgets one of most important weapons of WWII was jerry can..
First cars made were electric. Gasoline and diesels won on convenience, nothing else...
nctnico:
With many technical advances, the countries that start moving the first are usually the ones that end up lagging behind. Using hydrogen makes much more sense compared to investing huge amounts of money in -what basically is- a decentralised infrastructure. Sure you can put BEV charging point next to every parking space, but what will be their utilisation?
PlainName:

--- Quote ---So you will realistically need to increase capacity by 2-3% per year to accommodate EVs assuming total fleet replacement by say 2050.
--- End quote ---

In 2030 (that's only 8 years away) you won't be able to buy new non-EV cars[1]. So the first question is what's the increase in the car population (because in 8 years time they will all be EVs)? And the answer appears to be 15%[2], so that's stuffed your 2-3% prediction to start with.

But that's (sorry to keep repeating this, but it is REALLY close) just 8 years away. If you were to buy a new car now would you buy a diesel? How about in 5 years? I think you'd be losing money hand over fist if you did that because the resale value would be rather low - with petro-prices going up and the stuff being phased out, why would anyone want to take on a non-EV vehicle after 2030?

How about buying a used car before then? There is a huge incentive to not get lumbered with the last of the petro-dinosaurs, and massive encouragement to go EV. Someone is going to be left holding the ball and I bet a lot of normal people (that is, not eco-warriors or flash gits) are going to try and not let it be them. EV owership is likely to increase at a higher rate than expected, I reckon.

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[1] https://www.gov.uk/government/news/government-takes-historic-step-towards-net-zero-with-end-of-sale-of-new-petrol-and-diesel-cars-by-2030

[2] https://tradingeconomics.com/united-kingdom/car-registrations

2N3055:

--- Quote from: dunkemhigh on March 27, 2022, 12:02:14 am ---
--- Quote ---So you will realistically need to increase capacity by 2-3% per year to accommodate EVs assuming total fleet replacement by say 2050.
--- End quote ---

In 2030 (that's only 8 years away) you won't be able to buy new non-EV cars[1]. So the first question is what's the increase in the car population (because in 8 years time they will all be EVs)? And the answer appears to be 15%[2], so that's stuffed your 2-3% prediction to start with.

But that's (sorry to keep repeating this, but it is REALLY close) just 8 years away. If you were to buy a new car now would you buy a diesel? How about in 5 years? I think you'd be losing money hand over fist if you did that because the resale value would be rather low - with petro-prices going up and the stuff being phased out, why would anyone want to take on a non-EV vehicle after 2030?

How about buying a used car before then? There is a huge incentive to not get lumbered with the last of the petro-dinosaurs, and massive encouragement to go EV. Someone is going to be left holding the ball and I bet a lot of normal people (that is, not eco-warriors or flash gits) are going to try and not let it be them. EV owership is likely to increase at a higher rate than expected, I reckon.

----
[1] https://www.gov.uk/government/news/government-takes-historic-step-towards-net-zero-with-end-of-sale-of-new-petrol-and-diesel-cars-by-2030

[2] https://tradingeconomics.com/united-kingdom/car-registrations

--- End quote ---

Those are pipe dreams. Crack pipe dreams. If they stop selling new cars that are not EV, and without infrastructure, people will not buy new cars as much as government would like. They will keep old clunkers until they ban them altogether, as in you cannot get on a street without EV. And if they do that before everything EV is ready and cheap enough, well, welcome to the revolution.... You think people will just give up the fact that someone took away cars from a half of population?
PlainName:

--- Quote ---Those are pipe dreams. Crack pipe dreams.
--- End quote ---

Apparently not for many manufacturers who are going all-electric anyway: Jaguar, Bentley, General Motors, BMW Mini, Volvo, Ford (Europe), Volkswagen, Toyota, Nissan, Mercedes, Renault, Audi, etc.
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