General > General Technical Chat

Can I get banned from using capacitive touch technology? (intellectual property)

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nctnico:

--- Quote from: Haenk on November 02, 2023, 12:07:06 pm ---If this is a sub-1k contract, they will likely have a hard time finding another contractor working for this little money.
So essentially I would offer them: "I'll deliver a working and compliant design for said amount x. No further legal terms are accepted."

--- End quote ---
Sorry, but you don't want to leave things 'hanging' where they are free for any interpretation.  There are evil people around looking for contractors they can suck dry through frivolous lawsuits. I once had cake because a guy like that died in a car crash and the person he sued was so happy everybody at work deserved cake.

As others wrote: Good legal advice from a lawyer will pay for itself somewhere down the line.

rstofer:

--- Quote from: Georgy.Moshkin on November 02, 2023, 12:38:19 am ---The project is <$1000, but answers related to larger amounts are very important for me too

--- End quote ---

I wouldn't get out of bed for less than $100/hour - maybe that's why I have been comfortably retired for nearly 20 years...  $1,000 is a good day's work but that's all it is, a good day's work.  I don't see how you could even settle on the design in a day!  Meetings, including Zoom, are time sinks.  Do a realistic time estimate (including meetings and phone calls) and price accordingly with no conditions.

Walk away!  If you must take the job, accept no conditions other than to deliver a working project by an agreed date for an agreed amount - cash on delivery.  No restrictions!  That little bit of money just isn't worth the aggravation.

ejeffrey:
So international contract and IP law are... complex.  It's hard to know even what laws will apply for sure.  At the same time, enforcement is difficult and expensive.  It's not going to be easy for your American client to bring suit against you for violating the terms, but also it's going to be easy for you to collect if your client doesn't pay because of a dispute.  So it can be hard to low dollar value international contracts where you both make money and are adequately legally protected.  That's just a fact of life for international business.

Also, I really don't know how much legal advice costs in Hong Kong, but for < $1000 I don't think this is a situation where you will be able to have your own lawyer redline the contract and send it back, then expect them to come back with a revised document and so on.  So I wouldn't go to a lawyer yet.  Remember: a lawyer is going to help you understand legal jargon, know what contract terms might be difficult to enforce, and what implicit terms you might be agreeing to without noticing (things like: are you providing an implicit warranty that could leave you on the hook for a lot more development?)  But if the plain terms of the contract are not something you want to agree to, no need to involve a lawyer at all.  It's your call, but for $1000  I wouldn't consider any sort of long-term restriction or anything that would cause me to turn down other work at all.  I'd tell them you think these terms are unreasonable, and to come back with something that is a lot more scoped to "I do the thing, you pay the money" If they say no, just walk away.  If they say yes, take that document to a lawyer to get advice.

If you are going to be doing lots of small jobs like that, ideally what you would do is get a contract template that works for you, get vetted by a lawyer, and insist that clients take it or leave it.  That's the most efficient way to do it.  But if your clients are big companies, they are going to have a hard time accepting that.  They are going to want you to start with their contract and negotiate from there.  In that case, consider just adding a zero to your rates to cover the extra costs.

The good thing about doing small jobs for a big company is that once you have worked with their legal team and gotten mutually agreeable contract terms, you may have a good in for future work, due to the difficulty and expense of getting new contractors "in the system".  But don't underbid a contract expecting future work from the same client, make sure the first contract is going to cover your expenses, including any one-time expenses such as legal fees.

Siwastaja:

--- Quote from: Georgy.Moshkin on November 02, 2023, 12:38:19 am ---The project is <$1000, but answers related to larger amounts are very important for me too

--- End quote ---

You can probably take the "in the USA I make $x per hour" type of comments with grain of salt because the level of price for expert work is significantly lower elsewhere - but still, even taking that into account, $1000 project sounds like there is not much room for special conditions regarding IPR let alone competition limitations. For a $1000 project, all the client should get is the right to use the deliverables, but pretty much nothing else. It's such small sum you should probably keep all the rights to re-sell if not the whole project at least parts of its as components to other customers, and get paid better for your work that way, and your client should really accept this. Mandatory car analogy: if you pay for a bus ticket, then you ride with other customers and get lower quality service. If you want your own private ride, you pay for a car.

rstofer:
Make sure there is no 'loss of income' clause where they sue you for non-delivery in an amount equivalent to their projected sales.  'Best effort' is the only guarantee you should offer.  Many times the customer redefines some aspect but fails to change the due date.

Document everything, especially design meetings.  Circulate your notes and get approval at the next meeting.  Document everything!  The technology is easy, it's the people who screw things up.

Infineon has an entire product line with touch sensing.  They should hold you harmless from patent problems.  Plus they have example code.

https://www.infineon.com/dgdl/Infineon-AN85951_-_PSoC_4_and_PSoC_6_MCU_CapSense_Design_Guide-ApplicationNotes-v70_00-EN.pdf?fileId=8ac78c8c7cdc391c017d0723535d4661

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