Author Topic: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)  (Read 5047 times)

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Offline Halcyon

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Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« on: October 16, 2015, 03:25:29 am »
Just something interesting for those who are into chemistry. I logged into the Caltex fuel card portal today and they had the following announcement.... (I can't say I've really taken much notice of the colour of petrol)

 

Online blueskull

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2015, 03:29:24 am »
Why they dye gas in the first place?
 

Offline Cubdriver

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #2 on: October 16, 2015, 03:52:16 am »
It's done with aviation gasoline to enable the type to be identified - blue is 100 octane low lead, red 80 octane and green 100/130.  For auto/truck fuel, it could be used to differentiate on road fuel (taxed) from agricultural fuel (perhaps untaxed, or taxed at a lower rate).

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If it jams, force it.  If it breaks, you needed a new one anyway...
 

Offline warp_foo

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #3 on: October 16, 2015, 03:52:51 am »
Why they dye gas in the first place?

In the US, usually for tax purposes. Farm diesel is dyed red, and if you are caught on the public roads with red diesel, it's a pretty serious fine.

m
Where are we going, and why are we in a handbasket?
 

Online blueskull

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #4 on: October 16, 2015, 04:00:18 am »
Why they dye gas in the first place?

In the US, usually for tax purposes. Farm diesel is dyed red, and if you are caught on the public roads with red diesel, it's a pretty serious fine.

m

I doubt why people will bother doing that. #87 had dropped to $1.96/ga a couple weeks ago. Even Dasani is 2 times more expensive than that per volume.
 

Offline warp_foo

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #5 on: October 16, 2015, 04:26:29 am »
Why they dye gas in the first place?

In the US, usually for tax purposes. Farm diesel is dyed red, and if you are caught on the public roads with red diesel, it's a pretty serious fine.

m

I doubt why people will bother doing that. #87 had dropped to $1.96/ga a couple weeks ago. Even Dasani is 2 times more expensive than that per volume.

For private vehicles you are likely correct, however think about fleet vehicles and OTR truckers. That, and in some states, diesel is very heavily taxed. The risk/reward for the annual fuel cost savings begins to look acceptable.
Where are we going, and why are we in a handbasket?
 

Offline SeanB

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #6 on: October 16, 2015, 04:43:06 am »
So they will be importing fuel from Portugal, where they supply a clear liquid. Happens here, though the most common thing is blending diesel with up to 100% of illuminating paraffin, as it is a few cents cheaper.
 

Online Jeroen3

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2015, 05:36:20 am »
We abandoned red diesel (untaxed) for road vehicles dues to high abuse. Since diesel is about 50% tax, it was financially attractive to use it for not only farm vehicles, but also the farmers bmw, jeep, and cars of friends and family.
 

Offline SL4P

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2015, 06:31:15 am »
Possibly some retailers were mixing or switching fuel in the bowser tanks - charging for one, while pumping the other.
Colour means you know what you're getting - if you care to look.
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Offline IconicPCB

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #9 on: October 16, 2015, 07:07:52 am »
Wilfred

ALL refined petroleum product is imported into Australia nowadays.

I think the last refinery was shut down in Sydney recently.
 

Offline Srbel

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #10 on: October 16, 2015, 07:14:30 am »
Why they dye gas in the first place?

It's "trendy".



In my country, they started marking the fuel, to stop the sale of illegally imported bad quality fuel (finaly).

http://www.sscc.rs/2014/08/sgs-fuel-integrity-program-in-serbia/
« Last Edit: October 16, 2015, 07:17:03 am by Srbel »
 

Offline Towger

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #11 on: October 16, 2015, 07:33:54 am »
We have a thriving industry in removing dyes from diesel. Quality control would not be it's strong point, so I am sure it is a major contributor to injector failures.
 

Offline IconicPCB

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2015, 10:27:25 pm »
I drive an old 300D, a 3 litre 5 cylinder diesel.
I add low asht, two stroke oil to the fuel in a ratio of 1:200.

Lubricates the pump and the injectors and quietens the diesel racket.

Rationale; diesel fuel is a poor lubricant. If the mechanical injectors work better, the resultant fuel atomisation means improved combustion.
 

Offline dave_k

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #13 on: October 17, 2015, 02:13:11 am »
Why they dye gas in the first place?

In the US, usually for tax purposes. Farm diesel is dyed red, and if you are caught on the public roads with red diesel, it's a pretty serious fine.


... especially driving a VW.
 

Offline crispy_tofu

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #14 on: October 17, 2015, 03:02:34 am »
(I can't say I've really taken much notice of the colour of petrol)

Me neither! (But then again, I don't own a car...too young lol)  Thanks for the enlightenment! :o
 

Offline vk6zgo

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #15 on: October 17, 2015, 03:50:29 am »
Wilfred

ALL refined petroleum product is imported into Australia nowadays.

I think the last refinery was shut down in Sydney recently.

And of course,Sydney is all of Australia! ;D

BP Kwinana (the biggest in the country) is currently in a maintenance shutdown,but is going to be put back into service when that is completed.

I can't see it going anywhere in a hurry,as a lot of industries in the area use various products from Kwinana in their own production.

Of course,if it,& the other Industrial stuff went away,the land developers would be around there like hungry wolves----I haven't heard them drooling yet,so I think nothing is going to happen in,at least,the short term.
 

Offline Halcyon

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #16 on: October 17, 2015, 04:03:05 am »
Wilfred

ALL refined petroleum product is imported into Australia nowadays.

I think the last refinery was shut down in Sydney recently.

I believe Caltex still operate a refinery in Queensland.
 

Offline Psi

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #17 on: October 17, 2015, 04:57:04 am »
Pic off someone pouring it on the ground..  :palm:
Greek letter 'Psi' (not Pounds per Square Inch)
 

Offline Stonent

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #18 on: October 17, 2015, 03:02:19 pm »
Anyone know why the US uses RMS to calculate octane but other places tend to use RON? Just wondering about that recently.
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Offline SL4P

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #19 on: October 17, 2015, 07:21:10 pm »
(I can't say I've really taken much notice of the colour of petrol)

A similar reason why the taste of household 'methylated' spirits is so foul...
An additive was put in - to induce vomiting - for alcoholics... to stop them drinking it as a shot when they couldn't get the good stuff.

Society, protecting people from themselves.
Chuck Darwin would be disappointed
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Online blueskull

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #20 on: October 17, 2015, 07:30:43 pm »
(I can't say I've really taken much notice of the colour of petrol)

A similar reason why the taste of household 'methylated' spirits is so foul...
An additive was put in - to induce vomiting - for alcoholics... to stop them drinking it as a shot when they couldn't get the good stuff.

Society, protecting people from themselves.
Chuck Darwin would be disappointed


Not only vomiting. Denatured alcohol can cause blindness and even death if consumed in an alcoholic manner.
 

Online Jeroen3

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #21 on: October 18, 2015, 12:14:04 pm »
No, that's not the reason for the additive. They make it poisonous to be able to sell it without special license and normal tax rates.
 

Offline SeanB

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #22 on: October 18, 2015, 02:09:13 pm »
No, that's not the reason for the additive. They make it poisonous to be able to sell it without special license and normal tax rates.

Bingo, Methanol is around 1/20 the cost of ethanol as an industrial solvent, and if your process __NEEDS__ the ethanol as pure as possible ( think of chemical feedstocks and organic synthesis of things like epoxy) you can often get the duty back once you provide the required paperwork, though you will typically only be able to claim as a tax rebate at year end, during the year you pay full fat price. If you buy and it is additive free you pay, but the adulterated stuff is very cheap and mostly usable, though you can strip most of the Bitrex out of it with vacuum distillation ( and the blue dye as well ) if you need it and can tolerate the methanol in it ( hard to separate out easily as the boiling points overlap so much) for your use.

I regularly travel past NCP Alcohols, and they have massive fermentation tanks containing sugar cane bagasse and yeast, making the feedstocks for things like epoxies, azide dyes and medicines from the ethanol from the yeast fermentation. you can always tell the way the wind is blowing and how strong it is from the place where you first smell the plant.
 

Offline boffin

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #23 on: October 19, 2015, 03:34:31 am »
It's common for fuels to be colour coded.  In aviation
  • 100LL is blue
  • JetA (turbine kerosene) is straw coloured
(and from the not that distant past)
  • 80/87 was red
  • 100/135 was green (before my time)


In Canada; fuel for farm equipment (ie without road tax); is dyed (most often red) as well.
 

Offline Stonent

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Re: Change to the colour of Unleaded and E10 petrol ('Straya)
« Reply #24 on: October 20, 2015, 12:29:36 am »
It's common for fuels to be colour coded.  In aviation
  • 100LL is blue
  • JetA (turbine kerosene) is straw coloured
(and from the not that distant past)
  • 80/87 was red
  • 100/135 was green (before my time)


I feel sorry for anyone who has some old red transmission or hydraulic oil that dumps it into their diesel and gets flagged by the cops.

In Canada; fuel for farm equipment (ie without road tax); is dyed (most often red) as well.
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