General > General Technical Chat
Cheques being phased out in Australia by 2030
CatalinaWOW:
A great many posts in this thread are of the form: "There is no use case for checks than cannot be performed by another method (usually electronic)" and then concluding that there is no use for checks.
While the alternative method may be difficult for some people for some transactions, I do agree that there is nothing that checks do that cannot be done by other means. We could even go back to "Letters of Credit".
But at its root the argument is much like saying there is no tune that cannot be played on a musical instrument other than a piano, and therefore pianos are unnecessary and can be eliminated without losing anything. And the argument is somewhat true. There is a rich world of music that does not involve a piano. Many people have no fondness for a piano. Pianos are large, expensive and heavy instruments. And piano usage and ownership has been declining rapidly. But the argument is intrinsically wrong. Those who like and use pianos are the ones who should decide whether they should exist and be used, not those who do not use them.
Halcyon:
--- Quote from: CatalinaWOW on October 15, 2023, 11:38:50 pm ---A great many posts in this thread are of the form: "There is no use case for checks than cannot be performed by another method (usually electronic)" and then concluding that there is no use for checks.
While the alternative method may be difficult for some people for some transactions, I do agree that there is nothing that checks do that cannot be done by other means. We could even go back to "Letters of Credit".
But at its root the argument is much like saying there is no tune that cannot be played on a musical instrument other than a piano, and therefore pianos are unnecessary and can be eliminated without losing anything. And the argument is somewhat true. There is a rich world of music that does not involve a piano. Many people have no fondness for a piano. Pianos are large, expensive and heavy instruments. And piano usage and ownership has been declining rapidly. But the argument is intrinsically wrong. Those who like and use pianos are the ones who should decide whether they should exist and be used, not those who do not use them.
--- End quote ---
I think most people here acknowledge this. However as I (and other) have pointed out before, how long do you go supporting an antiquated and increasingly inefficient system (both in terms of actual utility and associated costs)?
Now, I've never worked in a bank but I can envisage some of the costs involved in producing/processing cheque payments would be as follows:
* Cheque drawing/processing fees
* Costs associated with staff having to perform manual processing (both from the bank's and end-user perspective
* Indirect costs associated with cheque/signature fraud
* Cost of maintaining a physical presence in the community (bank branches)
* Delays associated with slow clearing times (thinking about large projects etc...)
tggzzz:
--- Quote from: Halcyon on October 16, 2023, 04:24:18 am ---
--- Quote from: CatalinaWOW on October 15, 2023, 11:38:50 pm ---A great many posts in this thread are of the form: "There is no use case for checks than cannot be performed by another method (usually electronic)" and then concluding that there is no use for checks.
While the alternative method may be difficult for some people for some transactions, I do agree that there is nothing that checks do that cannot be done by other means. We could even go back to "Letters of Credit".
But at its root the argument is much like saying there is no tune that cannot be played on a musical instrument other than a piano, and therefore pianos are unnecessary and can be eliminated without losing anything. And the argument is somewhat true. There is a rich world of music that does not involve a piano. Many people have no fondness for a piano. Pianos are large, expensive and heavy instruments. And piano usage and ownership has been declining rapidly. But the argument is intrinsically wrong. Those who like and use pianos are the ones who should decide whether they should exist and be used, not those who do not use them.
--- End quote ---
I think most people here acknowledge this. However as I (and other) have pointed out before, how long do you go supporting an antiquated and increasingly inefficient system (both in terms of actual utility and associated costs)?
Now, I've never worked in a bank but I can envisage some of the costs involved in producing/processing cheque payments would be as follows:
* Cheque drawing/processing fees
* Costs associated with staff having to perform manual processing (both from the bank's and end-user perspective
* Indirect costs associated with cheque/signature fraud
* Cost of maintaining a physical presence in the community (bank branches)
* Delays associated with slow clearing times (thinking about large projects etc...)
--- End quote ---
Now, for fairness' sake, imagine the costs associated with other payment mechanisms.
Start by understanding the number of companies involved in, say, every credit card transaction. When I first glimpsed that my eyes widened and I resolved that I really really never ever wanted to have to understand that!
I did get to see a little of the reconciliations business, i.e. how one company matches the monies received/sent to the statements of account received/sent. It ain't pretty, and it is unusual that all statements are fully reconciled. What happens is that each bank has a large number of rules to the effect "discrepancy too small; can't be bothered to investigate".
As for working in a bank, my understanding are that many of the processes are to protect banks and to a lesser extent their customers from internal fraud by their staff. When that goes wrong the results are very unpleasant, e.g. Halifax-vs-Munden where a policeman was falsely jailed for "phantom ATM withdrawal" fraud, or Barings bank.
Halcyon:
As a bit of a side note, I just got an email from my bank this morning. From 20/05/2024, they will no longer accept deposits in the form of cheque or cash, with cheques to be completely phased out by November 2024.
Cash withdrawals from an ATM will still be possible.
https://www.macquarie.com.au/help/general/cheque-and-cash-changes.html
tggzzz:
--- Quote from: Halcyon on October 17, 2023, 12:03:37 am ---As a bit of a side note, I just got an email from my bank this morning. From 20/05/2024, they will no longer accept deposits in the form of cheque or cash, with cheques to be completely phased out by November 2024.
Cash withdrawals from an ATM will still be possible.
https://www.macquarie.com.au/help/general/cheque-and-cash-changes.html
--- End quote ---
So you take out cash and pay a merchant, who presumably cannot pay cash into their account?!
In a cashless environment, what happens when your card is lost or swallowed by an ATM, or a North Korean (et c, etc, etc) gang cripples the bank? Or, for that matter, when the bank cripples itself?
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