Chinese tracker hidden in sealed part in UK Government car

[DavidAlfa]

Tell the NSA how terrible this is

[Bicurico]

A SIM card is not a GSM/GPRS/3G/4G/5G module.
A concealed tracking device in a sealed spare part? How would it be powered?
Why buy Chinese spare parts for a car?
The quality of the text is pure rubbish and probably fake news.

  Are you really that ignorant of how modern cars operate and how they're constructed?

   They are FULL of electronic modules that no one outside of the factory has any idea of how they work internally.  MANY of those modules are made by outside vendors including many made in Malaysia, Singapore, Mexico, Canada, and yes, mainland China.  All of those modules have electrical power provided to them so it would be trivial to power a tracking device and/or some kind of communications device.  Most, if not all of those modules are bought by the trainloads from the OEM and the car manufacturer simply takes the module from the box and slaps it into a car with no inspection. So a company in say, CHINA, could install tracking  equipment in something like an Air Conditioner Control Unit and it could be easily installed in new cars without anyone outside of the OEM knowing that it was there. And those modules are never repaired and are only replaced, so no one would even know that it was there. A lot of the newer automatic temperature control AC controllers also have a small vent that points directly into the passenger compartment, nominally to monitor the cabin air temperature but it would be a perfect place to install a microphone and be able to listen in on any conversations in the car.

  Modern cars also have Data Buses in them so if you have a GPS then that data is available to EVERY device that is connected to the buss. In my OLD 2000 year model Mitsubishi even the vents for the AC, defrost, heat, etc was controlled via the data buss.  One on the drivers side and another on the passenger side. In my 2010 Ford even the radio is operated and fully controlled by the data buss. In my wife's 2016 Hyundai Sonata, even the mirrors and seat position and a number of other things are controlled by the data buss and the car's computer recognizes each different driver based on the key in their pocket and it then adjusts the mirrors, etc to suit that driver. My wife's Sonata also knows where you are at all times and it DOES radio that information to Hyundai. When we had the tire pressure get low in one wheel, the car not only told us that it was low but also gave us directions to the nearest Hyundai dealership!  I don't suppose that you know anything about the systems in modern aircraft that continually report all electrical and mechanical readings back to the aircraft company but I can tell you for a certainty that Hyundai is doing that much, and possibly more.  We get frequent notices from the local Hyundai dealership that tell us the status of the car and when to bring it in for service. I've even seen things like low windshield washer fluid being reported.

   This is not proof that what the OP said is true but it is damm well technologically possible!

I am not ignorant and you are being rude.

Have you really read what I wrote in my TWO posts?

Again for you to understand what I said:

1. A SIM is not a tracking device.
2. A tracking device can be bought by anyone for little money and planted in another person's car without too much trouble. No need for Chinese agents.
3. Chinese can track any electronic device with MCU's if they really want to. No need to plant an extra tracking device, just build the logic in any China manufactured PCB directly.

That is what I wrote.

Please stop and think twice before calling other people ignorant.

[Miti]

“Look people, the (villain of the day) is trying to destroy our democracy!”. I wonder what fool still falls for this propaganda crap. Not Chinese or Russians will destroy the west but greed.

[mendip_discovery]

I agree I doubt it's the chinese themselves.

It could quite well be the press/paparazzi for all we know, even a grumpy constituent.

If it was a state supported thing and I was doing it I would target cars either at the supply or servicing side. Any government purchase/servicing deal would be done by a contracted company and it's not too hard to work out who and get it into somewhere deep. Now you you wouldn't know who uses the car so it would be a case if track a load and see what is useful. Hmm maybe I read too many spy novels.

Problem is that the press report refers to SIM card but the press are not technical but it depends on what the police reported in the press release.

I know of people who have found magnetic gps trackers stuck to the underside of vans to track them to their home to later have a break in. Usually bicycles or motorcycles.

[MadScientist]

A SIM card is not a GSM/GPRS/3G/4G/5G module.
A concealed tracking device in a sealed spare part? How would it be powered?
Why buy Chinese spare parts for a car?
The quality of the text is pure rubbish and probably fake news.

  Are you really that ignorant of how modern cars operate and how they're constructed?

   They are FULL of electronic modules that no one outside of the factory has any idea of how they work internally.  MANY of those modules are made by outside vendors including many made in Malaysia, Singapore, Mexico, Canada, and yes, mainland China.  All of those modules have electrical power provided to them so it would be trivial to power a tracking device and/or some kind of communications device.  Most, if not all of those modules are bought by the trainloads from the OEM and the car manufacturer simply takes the module from the box and slaps it into a car with no inspection. So a company in say, CHINA, could install tracking  equipment in something like an Air Conditioner Control Unit and it could be easily installed in new cars without anyone outside of the OEM knowing that it was there. And those modules are never repaired and are only replaced, so no one would even know that it was there. A lot of the newer automatic temperature control AC controllers also have a small vent that points directly into the passenger compartment, nominally to monitor the cabin air temperature but it would be a perfect place to install a microphone and be able to listen in on any conversations in the car.

  Modern cars also have Data Buses in them so if you have a GPS then that data is available to EVERY device that is connected to the buss. In my OLD 2000 year model Mitsubishi even the vents for the AC, defrost, heat, etc was controlled via the data buss.  One on the drivers side and another on the passenger side. In my 2010 Ford even the radio is operated and fully controlled by the data buss. In my wife's 2016 Hyundai Sonata, even the mirrors and seat position and a number of other things are controlled by the data buss and the car's computer recognizes each different driver based on the key in their pocket and it then adjusts the mirrors, etc to suit that driver. My wife's Sonata also knows where you are at all times and it DOES radio that information to Hyundai. When we had the tire pressure get low in one wheel, the car not only told us that it was low but also gave us directions to the nearest Hyundai dealership!  I don't suppose that you know anything about the systems in modern aircraft that continually report all electrical and mechanical readings back to the aircraft company but I can tell you for a certainty that Hyundai is doing that much, and possibly more.  We get frequent notices from the local Hyundai dealership that tell us the status of the car and when to bring it in for service. I've even seen things like low windshield washer fluid being reported.

   This is not proof that what the OP said is true but it is damm well technologically possible!

I am not ignorant and you are being rude.

Have you really read what I wrote in my TWO posts?

Again for you to understand what I said:

1. A SIM is not a tracking device.
2. A tracking device can be bought by anyone for little money and planted in another person's car without too much trouble. No need for Chinese agents.
3. Chinese can track any electronic device with MCU's if they really want to. No need to plant an extra tracking device, just build the logic in any China manufactured PCB directly.

That is what I wrote.

Please stop and think twice before calling other people ignorant.

A gsm SIM activated supports location deduction by cell tower triangulation. Hence all activated gsm  units can deduce device location

No the Chinese  cannot use a mcu to track location. MCUs on their own have no location knowledge to be able to track you’d have to add hidden gsm Wi-Fi or Gps technology. Carv companies evaluate components and sub assemblies carefully so such tracking could only fe added with their compliance , of course the car could be retrofitted after sale etc. that’s entirely different

[Bicurico]

What I meant is that an MCU can have hidden functionalities and backdoors which use the onboard infrastructure for its monitoring activity.

[MadScientist]

What I meant is that an MCU can have hidden functionalities and backdoors which use the onboard infrastructure for its monitoring activity.

clearly that “hidden functionalities @ must have geo location ability the issue most likely is that was added after the car was bought not added during manufacture

[Black Phoenix]

There is some misunderstanding in this. A SIM is not a tracking device. A SIM is a Subscriber Identification Module by itself (normally a microchip card).

A UE (user equipment, could be a phone of a modem for example) is needed for the SIM to work. Without it a SIM is just a card that carries an unique IMSI that is used (after being converted to TMSI in the network) as identification of a subscriber.

Although is true that a UE can "see" many Cell IDs (and a Cell ID is normally a NodeB/Base Station or a group of them in the same geographical location) the only info she get is signal strength (in dBs) and Cell ID number. The geographical info is not transmitted to the UE since the UE doesn't need to know where he is geographically. He only need to know what Cell IDs are available and by the signal strength he can by itself request connection and handover tasks.

That geographic location is only known by the Service Provider as administrative info, for maintenance use. It is never relayed on the network to any equipment. The UE cannot triangulate his location, the NodeB/Base Station can triangulate a UE by signal strength.

If no GPS module is also installed such can't be used to triangulate geographically (via data acquisition and database filling directly in the MCU/device in the car itself) and if it is then the UE and respective SIM will only be used to relay info back, via a data up link.

All of this to say that except if China have agents/contacts in the telecom company such tracking will be almost impossible to do just with a UE/SIM. Or in the country's security forces but if it is this one, I think that here are a lot more problems of spying that just a simple car tracking...

I worked from 2009 to 2015 as a NSN Core Network Engineer in the biggest Mobile Phone Service Provider (at the time) in Portugal, so I know the outs and ins of how 2G, 3G and 4G network work in terms of location and identification of a user - I had to by law sometimes do such as request by the Justice of Portugal, being police or higher forces.

[MrMobodies]

Just another gov. official got busted by their spouse of cheating, instead of major embarrassment, why not use the opportunity to boost the Axis of Evil China rhetoric. 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/apr/13/matt-hancock-kiss-images-ico-inquiry-no-prosecutions

Government department removes Chinese cameras that caught Matt Hancock’s affair
By Elly Blake 27 June 2022
he Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) has said it will remove cameras made by Chinese CCTV firm Hikvision.

The DWP confirmed it “will not be using any security camera equipment manufactured in China” amid an overhaul of its security apparatus. The Chinese company Hikvision has more than a million cameras installed in schools, hospitals and police departments across the UK. However, it is at the centre of controversy after last year a Hikvision camera recorded Matt Hancock embracing an aide, which forced him to resign. There are also concerns by civil liberties campaign groups that it was added to the Chinese government’s persecution of the Uyghur minority.

It comes after the Department for Health banned the procurement of any new Hikvision equipment amid a Whitehall crackdown on the company. Meanwhile, MPs have urged the government to stop buying its cameras and other security systems. Hikvision, which is part-owned by the Chinese government, has been blacklisted in the US.

In a letter to campaigners at Big Brother Watch, a civil liberties campaign group, the DWP said: “During the next three years, the department is undertaking a capital investment programme to update and upgrade its physical security systems. “The Department will not be using any security camera equipment manufactured in China as part of this programme.” According to a Freedom of Information request released last yearm the DWP has 194 cameras installed at 51 locations.

A Hikvision spokesman told the Telegraph: “It must be clarified that Hikvision does not respond directly to public tenders. “Like all manufacturers, we sell through distribution partners and not directly to the end user. Tenders by government departments, which adhere to a strict procurement process are with installer contractors. “In the case of the DWP, one of our partners was invited to bid for the contract in a fair process. On this occasion they came in second in a very competitive tendering process. “This was carried out in the same way as any other bid for a public tender, Hikvision was not disqualified on the basis of nationality.

“It is important to note that this is not a sudden rip and replace – all tenders take time to adhere to due process, the DWP tender in question is no exception. “Although our partner did not win this particular project they have since been awarded some smaller installations.” Big Brother Watch said the decision to remove Hikvision cameras from the DWP was an “an enormously welcome development that could not come soon enough”. They added: “Given the role Hikvision plays in the ongoing brutal repression of Uyghurs in Xinjiang.

These surveillance companies have no place in the UK and it is an outrage that taxpayers’ money is funding companies so closely linked to genocide.” The Standard has contacted the DWP for comment.

I wonder who exposed them on camera?
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/apr/13/matt-hancock-kiss-images-ico-inquiry-no-prosecutions

The footage and stills of the embrace, which prompted his resignation as health secretary, were leaked to the Sun in June last year. It was most likely obtained by someone using their phone to record a CCTV screen, the ICO said.

Joke: If they see something they don't like and it involves equipment from China lets starting banning it.
What about partygate? I wonder what equipment manufacturer they blamed for the photographs it took?
https://metro.co.uk/2022/05/25/partygate-pictures-taken-by-no-10-photographers-may-be-released-16704580/

Potentially damaging further details, including the names of some of those who attended gatherings and photographs taken by official No 10 photographers will also be published.

[MadScientist]

Daily Mail.

More reliable news can be found in the “Beano “

[EPAIII]

And this is a surprise because ... ?

Just how stupid are the intelligence services? Companies like Google do it all the time. Usually with the PERMISSION of the person being tracked. That permission was given when a free game or other program was downloaded and installed on their smart phone. THEY CONSENTED in the fine print, about 50 paragraphs down from the top. No one reads down that far.

Virtually any company that provides FREE software has something in that software that PAYS for it. And even with software that you have to pay for, often there are things in it that spy on the user.