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| Chip on Apple credit card fails |
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| Bud:
I once fried a chip card in the kitchen mictowave oven for a few seconds and it was still working when tested after. But this is not the same as static discharge. |
| coppice:
--- Quote from: mc172 on December 16, 2021, 03:26:19 am --- --- Quote from: coppice on December 16, 2021, 02:48:41 am ---The chips on my Visa cards used to die quite often when visiting EMC labs. I lost 3 or 4 before I realised there was a connection with my lab work, I tended to be doing some pretty extreme discharge testing, but I was still surprised to find the cards in my wallet, in my trouser pocket trouser failing. --- End quote --- I don't buy it. I've done a bit of discharge testing myself varying from human body static, to induced current from lightning strikes near CATV/networking gear, all the way up to direct lightning strikes on conductive parts of aircraft and no matter which one you choose, you're never anywhere near it when the "main event" happens for safety reasons, the gap just gets bigger the more exotic you go. These tests have always been conducted inside a Faraday cage where everyone is taken out for a number of reasons - mainly to de-pollute the spectrum but also it's seriously dangerous to be anywhere near it. I've worked at places that have their own EMC lab, and at places where they've outsourced the EMC testing. Something I've seen across the board is that EMC labs both respect a quiet spectrum and also do not contribute to a noisy one. Put more brutally, running an EMC lab doesn't give you free reign to operate a spark gap transmitter - any credible lab will run discharge tests inside a shielded enclosure for obvious reasons. If you don't like that response, I've previously put, or should I say dropped, some of my cards (one of which was my everyday Visa card) and my phone into a field with a strength of about 30V/m at 10 GHz and they worked fine afterwards. --- End quote --- I wasn't thinking of extreme on the lightning scale, but extreme on the hand held scale. Take the hand held discharge guns from people like Noise Ken and Schaffner, and just keep running them for hours, sweeping over every detail of a piece of equipment, searching for vulnerabilities. Most people doing formal approval testing use those guns in a very benign way, usually with the gun in a clamp and nobody near. |
| Halcyon:
On the subject of chip cards, I've never have one fail me. That being said, inserting a card in a reader is seldom done these days in Australia as most bank cards have NFC capabilities. They seem to be pretty resilient, even after they've been through the wash a few times ;-) |
| Bud:
This one is all metal, so can't have RF antenna inside. |
| vk6zgo:
--- Quote from: richard.cs on December 15, 2021, 10:40:34 pm ---Something is wrong here. These chips just don't normally fail, I've been using chip and pin since it was introduced here nearly 20 years ago, never had one fail, even cards that were horribly abused mechanically. Nor am I aware of anyone I know having broken one. Bad batch seems unlikely, if you've been through 5 cards it must have been over a significant period of time and a batch that big would surely have affected many others. Given it's a bit of an oddball card perhaps there's a card reader somewhere near you that kills it somehow, a bad design that shorts a power supply to the metal body or similar and lifts it to a damaging voltage relative to the contacts - easily done if you assume all cards are insulating. Or maybe the shorting of the card reader contacts as the card is inserted upsets some power supply with poor transient response and it murders the chip as it recovers. Who knows, but the conductive body is the main thing that differs from normal cards. Unless it's just some weird bug with your account and the cards are fine. --- End quote --- You have to "insert" your card??? :-DD Or are you talking about ATM machines? |
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