Clever ebay scam

[hacklordsniper]

Well i will write this as somebody could be in this situation which costed me 500 $

I bought an item from seller A, 499 $ free air mail shipping and paid immeadately. After 20 days no shipping information or response from the seller so i opened a paypal dispute. Last day of dispute there was no answer so i changed that to claim and after paypal investigation i recieved my money back one week later.

I bought the same item again from seller B for 50 $ more for upgrading to DHL. I recieved the item 4 days later, all was ok, left positive feedback.

One day after recieving the item from seller B i recieve an e-mail from paypal to pay again to seller A since he has given a reclamation to the claim and delivered a proof i recived the goods. He gave the paypal the DHL tracking number from seller B!?!

Immeadately i wrote to paypal back explainng them that this tracking number was for other purchase and ebay transaction and uploaded a screenshot of my ebay as proof and all relevant details. I got an automated response that my reclamation was rejected and 2 days later they charged my card for 499 $ and sent the money to seller A.

Probably these seller were connected somehow (both located in China) and scammed me pretty nicely. Paypal just sends automated responses that seller has proof of delivery but dont care its from other auction 

I gave all relevant documents to my bank credit card center, hope they can do something about it

[Mechatrommer]

what item was that? and you better name the seller here, A and B

[Simon]

I'd do plenty of shouting, this is redicolius, ebay own paypal and both are pathetically useless with dealing with issues because they neither care or have the staff. You paypal account cleaerly has a history of TWO payments and one refunded so it is pretty obvious there is a problem. You need to get hold of ebay too and report both sellers for fraud. if you dig deep enough there are ways of emailing ebay or phoning them but they make it hard to find. I wish I knew who to report them too because they leave people on thelurch and at the mercy of their actions with no way of replying back.

I had a bit of a barny with a seller who refunded me and cancelled the transaction claiming and error in the listing. there sure was an error because she had tried to swindle ebay fees by loading the postage and got it wrong as she did not anticipate I'd buy 10 items at once and get a really good deal for half what oter sellers sell for. So i left negative feedback to that effect and a row via email ensued during which she accused me of sexism when I had no idea theseller was female. She went to ebay to complain and they wrote to me supporting her claims of abuse and that I should moderate my comunications although they were taking no action. I replied telling them that she was fakely accusing me of sexism and that if they were happy to let her fiddle ebay fees that was up to them, they wrote back saying they would investigate my "claims" which is pathetic because it is what I said from the start.

Naturally I have stopped bothering to pay too much attention about loading the price onto postage anymore, if they are happy to let people do it well I'll take full advantage of that ! the more you automate a system the less efficient it becomes and the more you loose money so the more you automate it to save and so on - Welcome to ebay.

That's why I intend going self employed and setting up my own website

[Simon]

what item was that? and you better name the seller here, A and B

yes please do

[mikeselectricstuff]

Forget talking to Paypal - go to your card company and get a chargeback on the basis of goods not delivered

[Chet T16]

Be warned, if you do a chargeback against paypal they'll freeze your account and try their hardest to get the money back out of you

On my CC statements the paypal transactions have a national number for paypal after them

[ejeffrey]

Be warned, if you do a chargeback against paypal they'll freeze your account and try their hardest to get the money back out of you

On my CC statements the paypal transactions have a national number for paypal after them

Yeah, I would definitely try calling paypal first.  It is much easier to ignore and email or send a canned reply.  If you tell them that you are going to call your credit card company next and contest the charges, they will probably see reason.  If you can't get a hold of a human or they don't immediately agree to fix the situation then call the CC company.

I wouldn't be above recording the phone conversation.  If you do so, make sure you notify them that you are recording it.  At the very least make sure you write down the name of the person you talk to.

[hacklordsniper]

what item was that? and you better name the seller here, A and B

I will hold all the details about the sellers for the moment as my bank is trying to resolve this matter. The item was a Rigol bench multimeter.

[Psi]

Out of interest, how many sales had A and B done previously, and what was there feedback percentage?

[nukie]

What's the price difference between A and B? Some eBay sellers could trade with two accounts.

[Kiriakos-GR]

I would suggest a direct phone call to Paypal  Europe.

Not to say that just the shipping paper work,  found on the product and specially the receipt of the seller B, is all that you need so to clear up the mess.

Did you asked for the help of the seller B about this subject ?
He should had a major interest to help you out,  you are an valuable customer to him. 

[hacklordsniper]

Out of interest, how many sales had A and B done previously, and what was there feedback percentage?

Both of them have very good feedback

What's the price difference between A and B? Some eBay sellers could trade with two accounts.

Price was same, i just upgraded for DHL shipping at seller B.

I would suggest a direct phone call to Paypal  Europe.

Not to say that just the shipping paper work,  found on the product and specially the receipt of the seller B, is all that you need so to clear up the mess.

Did you asked for the help of the seller B about this subject ?
He should had a major interest to help you out,  you are an valuable customer to him. 

Strangely seller B does not answer any e-mails about this topic. If he was not  somehow connected to seller A there would be no tracking number exchange.

I just got a call from my bank, they will charge back my transaction 

Seller A is smtzone
Seller B is aidtech

[Simon]

I'm surprised paypal(ebay) get away with their poor management of peoples money. As far as the regs are concerned they have to abide by banking laws and are a form of bank in order to operate their so called service

[Kiriakos-GR]

I would suggest a direct phone call to Paypal  Europe.

Not to say that just the shipping paper work,  found on the product and specially the receipt of the seller B, is all that you need so to clear up the mess.

Did you asked for the help of the seller B about this subject ?
He should had a major interest to help you out,  you are an valuable customer to him. 

Strangely seller B does not answer any e-mails about this topic. If he was not  somehow connected to seller A there would be no tracking number exchange.

I just got a call from my bank, they will charge back my transaction 

Seller A is smtzone
Seller B is aidtech

This is good news,  but it is possible to be correct about the connection,  its more that natural one whole-seller to have more than one web shop's.

It helps the accountant to split me thousands of dollars in smaller business, and they pay less tax, than be a single account with millions as profits.

But its true that Paypal had become totally faceless, and its not helpful at all.
The same happens with the Ebay too, and all those automated dialogs about getting help.
I have lost my faith to both, and I have stop using them for the time.
 

[saturation]

http://myworld.ebay.com/smtzone/

[Mechatrommer]

i see that like a normal seller that i used to deal with. maybe some miscommunication? you have to be soft with chinese people, they are easily offended

[saturation]

Many things can happen, but shipping International can have more issues than shipping domestic; particularly this vendor ships international from a Chinese site, rather than from the US site.  The site seems quite legitimate and unlikely a scammer, he's been in business since 2004 and has 99.6% good rating,  that's hard to maintain.

i see that like a normal seller that i used to deal with. maybe some miscommunication? you have to be soft with chinese people, they are easily offended

[flolic]

Seller A is smtzone
Seller B is aidtech

I am 99.9% sure that smtzone and aidetech  are in fact same seller, just with two different accounts. I have dealt with (both of) them in the past without any problem.

[Fraser]

My Rigol DSO came from AideTech using DHL without any problems. Excellent service on that occasion.

[flolic]

My Rigol DSO came from AidTech using DHL without any problems. Excellent service on that occasion.

I can share same experience with my DG1022 from the same seller.
Btw I checked my email conversations and I can confirm that "aidetech" and "smtzone" are in fact the same.

From one of emails:

Please feel free to let me know if you have any other questions.
Come back to our ebay stores for more new items:
http://stores.ebay.com/smtzone
http://stores.ebay.com/AideTech-USA
Thanks and best regards,

David Cai

www.aidetek.com
22 Straton Ct.
Parlin, NJ 08859 USA

[Lawsen]

As long as you got refunded back for the second pay, then you should be well.  The problem is the vendor has two E Bay sites for exactly the same item.  You will need to contact E Bay over this.  It seems like some sloppy E Bay postings.  There are an increase in surplus stores in China advertised on E Bay.  I have found some surplus stores in Singapore, Hong Kong, and South Korea.  They all sell very quality and name brand items.  This has not been a good year for E commerce.  I bought a Mutoh drafting machine and it arrived broken.  I did not returned it back, but repaired it myself.  The pictured showed a perfect drafting machine, but the owner dropped it, before packing.  I sold a Macintosh Portable on Craigslist and the buyer did not pay me for seven months during the great recession of 2008.  I bought a pair of Street Skis and the bindings were defective and mounted in the wrong place, that I have to exchange the bindings myself and mounted them in the right place leaving holes in situ.  The recessions have caused the sloppy on e commerce and manufacturing goods, too. 

Please, complain to not just E Bay and Pay Pal, but to the seller via, "contact the seller," if possible.  Be polite and clear that you were charged twice for the same item and asked why?  Tell them that sloppy listing and charging twice for one item are not acceptable.  I complained to the Street Ski maker, Macintosh Portable buyer, and Mutoh seller.  I got them resolved on my own and eventually got paid after seven months!!!  You are not alone with problems in e commerce.  I want to buy two microscopes from main land China, when I have work, but I am hesitation over, if it went wrong, then who will help me? 

[SgtRock]

Dear hacklordsniper:
--This is a very interesting and alarming post. Please keep us informed of events, particularly with regard to:

1) Whether the seller(s) were actually being dishonest.
2) Whether you were able to get eBay and PayPal to take a verified non-wishwashy position on this matter.

--I think you should make all of the parties involved aware of this blog and the postings with regard to this matter.

--I assure you they do not want to have to deal with my bank or my lawyer. Best Regards
Clear Ether

[hacklordsniper]

The situation is resolved. My bank credit card division investigated the documents and refunded that paypal chargeback fully.

The paypal is silent, i tought they will ban me but however i managed to pay for some items today without any problems.

[Psi]

The situation is resolved. My bank credit card division investigated the documents and refunded that paypal chargeback fully.

nice to see a bank doing something positive

Just out of interest, do you have a gold/platnum or other expensive credit card or just the common cheap one?

[Fraser]

Just for info and a warning regarding overseas purchases......

I recently lost GBP12 on a soldering iron tip thermometer that never turned up. Another, ordered at the same time from the same seller (not AideTech) arrived quickly (2 weeks from HK) I chased the seller and they provided a tracking number that showed the item as having left Hong Kong but no other tracking detail. After many weeks I tried to negotiate supply of another temperature meter but was met with silence. Communications had been great with them promising to help me....right up until I asked them to supply a replacement 

The item was tracked but not insured (as it was only worth GBP12). The seller supplied a valid tracking number (for my consignment ?.... I'm not certain) so claimed their part of the deal was complete. I saw their point as they had apparently sent the item and it was lost in transit without insurance.  For GBP12 life is too short so I bought two more thermometers at GBP8 each from another seller  They both arrived safely.

The moral of this story is.... for expensive items,  pay the extra for tracking AND loss insurance.  Free shipping can be a curse rather than a benefit if things go wrong (no insurance ?)