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Confused about PHEV, Hybrids, etc...

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tom66:

--- Quote from: EEVblog on August 17, 2022, 07:50:43 am ---Don't forget the government subsidies.
Yes they have fallen, but not as dramatically as required to make EV's closer to parity with ICE cars. A new small ICE car in the Uk still costs half that.
And market forces are currently driving battery prices back up.

--- End quote ---

The Leaf had a larger subsidy - IIRC about £6k in the UK when it came out.   The ID.3 has no grant at all any more, though when it first launched it qualified for up to £3.5k grant.

The ID.3 is best compared to a Golf - it costs about £10k more than the equivalent Golf - which is a lot, don't get me wrong.  Batteries still aren't *cheap*, but they definitely have fallen substantially.

EEVblog:

--- Quote from: tom66 on August 17, 2022, 08:19:39 am ---Batteries still aren't *cheap*, but they definitely have fallen substantially.
--- End quote ---

Of course they have, there is a big market for them now.
But have not, and probaly will not drop enough for Joe Average to think EV's a no-brainer compared to their ICE car.
Not to mention that EV's simply aren't practically suitable to a large percentage of the population. And I don't see that changing either until you can get a large range at a cheap price AND the ability to recharge in a few minutes.

Someone:

--- Quote from: EEVblog on August 17, 2022, 08:25:14 am ---Not to mention that EV's simply aren't practically suitable to a large percentage of the population.
--- End quote ---
Except that is from the mindset of like for like replacement (and the often repeated even on here "My car is my car and I won't use different vehicles on different days") yet the majority of households have multiple cars and the vast majority of those can swap out one of their cars without any practical impact.
https://www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/what-if-one-your-cars-was-electric
The low hanging fruit is already a huge market, and likely the majority of households.

tom66:
Not to mention a proper car sharing infrastructure would eliminate a lot of that anxiety.

VW had/have a scheme where if you want to go on a really long trip and you have an EV you can rent a dirty diesel from them - and I think 1 week's rental per year of lease is free.

But I guess it's the same reason people drive big SUVs.  They want a car for that 1% of the time when they go to the airport, or on a long road trip etc,  but most of the time they use it to commute to work and back or get shopping etc with one or two passengers.   And it's really a waste of resources because it's *hard* to share a car.  Improving that is really important. 

Miyuki:
Current Lithium based batteries practically hit the raw material cost so they won't be significantly cheaper. Rather might even go a little up.
Maybe Sodium based ones in 10 or so years, can offer a solution, but who knows.

And when I look at the price of BEVs without subsidy it is not nice
Volkswagen ID.3 58kWh current price 48-50k €
Nissan Leaf 39kWh 35k € for the cheapest model and 59kW starts at 43k €
Hyundai IONIQ 5 58 kWh starts at 47k €
Kia EV6 58kWh starts at 52k €

Those are not affordable cars for the average Joe

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