General > General Technical Chat
Confused about PHEV, Hybrids, etc...
tom66:
--- Quote from: gnuarm on August 22, 2022, 08:44:54 am ---Why are you being so petty? I was simply trying to make a point with sarcasm. So many people from the UK have such a defeatist attitude about BEVs. It makes me wonder how the UK ever got anything done. There has to be someone in the UK that can figure it out. I guess it will take a while to find that one person.
--- End quote ---
I think you're being a little unfair to the UK, frankly. I would argue the US is more opposed to electric vehicles with their obsession over massive trucks/SUVs, driving to places that most people walk/cycle to and insistence that a vehicle is impractical unless it can drive 1,000 miles in a day non stop. PR is a small territory, you can easily cross from one side to another on a single charge with almost every EV made today, so your view of how accepted electric vehicles are may be influenced by that.
The UK has a well-developed charging network, a large number of charging companies based in the UK which have expanded into Europe, and equipment manufacturers and suppliers. We have a factory that is supposed to be building new EV batteries (we'll see if it takes off), Nissan makes the Leaf for Europe & UK here, the plug-in hybrid-electric London taxi (100km all electric range) is made in Birmingham, UK and we've got a few EV startups too (ARRIVAL is the big one having recently won a contract to supply Royal Mail with custom built EV vans.)
Engineers in general, which is predominantly the membership base of this forum, seem to have a very luddite-like view of the world and seem to be very opposed to change. This is not just in relation to EVs, it's things like smartphones, "the cloud", heck I've even seen an argument here where a chap was insistent that his Ni-Cad drill was better than a new Li-Ion one because he can leave the battery at 0% for a year and it'll still work. Never mind the fact it can do half the torque and half the work before going flat.
Of the EE friends I know, only about two or three are actively interested in electric vehicles. Most are on the fence and a few are opposed in similar ways to several of the posters might be here.
I imagine it will begin to shift over time, nothing changes overnight.
tszaboo:
--- Quote from: tom66 on August 22, 2022, 08:58:24 am ---
--- Quote from: gnuarm on August 22, 2022, 08:44:54 am ---Why are you being so petty? I was simply trying to make a point with sarcasm. So many people from the UK have such a defeatist attitude about BEVs. It makes me wonder how the UK ever got anything done. There has to be someone in the UK that can figure it out. I guess it will take a while to find that one person.
--- End quote ---
I think you're being a little unfair to the UK, frankly.
--- End quote ---
Don't feed the troll.
gnuarm:
--- Quote from: pcprogrammer on August 22, 2022, 06:14:54 am ---I'm not judging, but these luxuries use energy, and as long as not all energy comes from "renewables" it counteracts the whole purpose of the changeover to a BEV.
--- End quote ---
That's not realistic. We use energy in many ways, for creature comfort. The fact that it is tied to using a car doesn't make it counterproductive to have a BEV.
--- Quote ---Sure ICE owners turn on the engine to heat the windshield and warm the car before they start driving, which is also very bad. I make it a habit to first do what is needed to prepare for driving and start the car when ready to take of. Already did so when I was still working. Just put on a pair of gloves and use a good scraper to clear the windshield.
--- End quote ---
Exactly! I know someone who warms the car for 15 minutes or so, so the kids don't have to sit in a cold car. Some people do, some people don't. I use seat and steering wheel warmers.
--- Quote ---Furthermore it shows the big flaw in the whole idea of counteracting the human impact on nature.
--- End quote ---
Which is an unachievable goal. It's not possible, so where do we draw the line?
The point of BEVs is to eliminate carbon emissions. This will require renewable energy, but that is doable. With ICE, it will never happen.
--- Quote ---The human race should reduce consumption of especially energy in the fight against climate change. But what we do is just the opposite. Sure I have build myself a big house I keep warm in winter, but don't need to cool in summer. Like to play the no children card here :)
--- End quote ---
Sorry, there are no cards, because there is no game.
--- Quote ---Read SiliconWizard his post here: https://www.eevblog.com/forum/dodgy-technology/why-no-dodgy-quantum-entanglement-technology/msg4372342/#msg4372342 It reflects what I'm saying.
The whole energy transition thing is still aimed at a growing and not stabilizing economy. People are very concerned about the environment and climate change and sooth their conscience with owning a BEV, installing solar panels, switching to green energy and recycling, but it should not impact their lives to the extend that they can't have three vacations a year or what other luxuries they enjoy.
--- End quote ---
We don't actually have to reduce our energy footprint, just the pollution it creates. It's not about "conscience". It's about doing something useful that is practical, NOW (or at least, soon).
tom66:
--- Quote from: pcprogrammer on August 22, 2022, 06:14:54 am ---I'm not judging, but these luxuries use energy, and as long as not all energy comes from "renewables" it counteracts the whole purpose of the changeover to a BEV. Sure ICE owners turn on the engine to heat the windshield and warm the car before they start driving, which is also very bad. I make it a habit to first do what is needed to prepare for driving and start the car when ready to take of. Already did so when I was still working. Just put on a pair of gloves and use a good scraper to clear the windshield.
--- End quote ---
I metered how much energy pre-heating my car uses. It's about 2.3kW for 20 minutes, or less than 1kWh. That's ~4 miles of driving.
The alternative is a diesel/petrol car idling with a cold engine warming the cabin up whilst the owner scrapes off the window.
Yes it's possibly more energy than driving a completely cold car but we are allowed some luxuries!
edit: though driving a completely cold engine car may have other negative effects, most cars run open-loop when cold not knowing catalyst performance etc.
pcprogrammer:
--- Quote from: gnuarm on August 22, 2022, 08:44:54 am ---Oh, and if you are going to dis a group, you might at least learn something about them. For starters, Puerto Rico is not a country. It's a US territory. So all your negative BS is misplaced. Compare the Nobel Prize winners of the US to the UK. 400 vs the not even close 138 for the second place UK. Yeah, that is embarrassing for you.
Why are you being so petty? I was simply trying to make a point with sarcasm. So many people from the UK have such a defeatist attitude about BEVs. It makes me wonder how the UK ever got anything done. There has to be someone in the UK that can figure it out. I guess it will take a while to find that one person.
--- End quote ---
Go and check your history. The founders of America, came from Europe. Without this movements of Europeans across the globe who knows what the state of America would be today. Maybe a nice place with lots of nature not spoiled by greedy humans. Same story applies to Australia. Basically founded by the English.
So by pissing on the UK so much, you are pissing on your ancestors :-DD
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