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Confused about PHEV, Hybrids, etc...
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Cerebus:

--- Quote from: pcprogrammer on August 22, 2022, 02:08:39 pm ---@Cerebus, don't get me wrong, it was no personal attack on you. Just an observation on society in its whole.

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No, I didn't take it as such. I was just amplifying on what you said.


--- Quote ---Our old car was 17 years old and the French government had a very good deal for us on trade in. As we have no income apart from some interest on savings we fall in a tax bracket that allowed a grant of 3000 euro back for our old car as long as it got scrapped. We did look into a more environmental friendly option, but the prices are to high. Now we have a ~2 year old Ford Fiesta with enough horse power to drive comfortably in the hills, which the old one lacked a bit, and it has a better fuel economy then the old one. ~5.5L/100Km. We drive maybe 8000Km per year, of which ~50% is from twice a year a trip to visit the parents in the Netherlands.

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I missed out on any scrappage grants here, and I thought that, like you, I was going to be forced into a newer, bigger, ICE vehicle. I was lucky in hitting the first wave of ex-lease PHEVs hitting the streets at sane prices and having enough spare cash that I could afford to think long term rather than just filling the gap with what I could immediately afford.


--- Quote ---To compensate a bit I switch of my internet every night. (Mostly because it saves money :) ) This means 1 fiber to ethernet converter, 2 wireless routers in series (one controlled by my ISP) and a switch. Not a lot, but every bit helps.

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I'm an old hippy and proud of it. I've been trying to minimise my environmental impact as much as I can while being compatible with living in the modern world my whole life. Have I made a difference? Maybe, maybe not, but at least I consciously try.
Cerebus:

--- Quote from: nctnico on August 22, 2022, 02:27:35 pm ---And how about refilling the oil? Those taxis are Brittish made cars so they have to leak oil  >:D

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I think they have a separate oil tank, not actually connected to any working parts of the car, to take care of that. Got to keep up appearances, dontcha know? I think they also fit a crowbar circuit to occasionally blow the main headlight fuse to compensate for not having Lucas electrics fitted any more.
gnuarm:

--- Quote from: tom66 on August 22, 2022, 09:34:48 am ---
--- Quote from: gnuarm on August 22, 2022, 09:25:13 am ---100 km is pretty lame range, even for a city car.  I don't know how many miles a day a taxi drives, well, km then, but 100 km is only 60 miles and that's not much for any sort of working vehicle, even if you charge at lunch.  We'll see if it is successful. 

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It's not a bad compromise tbh... Most of the taxis spend their time tootling around in city traffic where average speeds of 8 mph mean you're doing well.  So they can easily run till lunch.  The petrol engine then gets them any fares to the airport and back.
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Sorry, I missed that it is a hybrid.  I don't have much enthusiasm for hybrids.  They don't solve any problems, other than making ICE cheaper to run.



--- Quote ---But I think long term something like a 200mi / 300km all electric taxi will make the most sense.  PHEVs are training wheels for real EVs :)
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That's something people say that makes no sense to me.  It's not an EV, it just uses a battery and electric motor to improve mileage.  It doesn't have the same advantages or disadvantages. 



--- Quote ---As for Ni-Cads, no doubt at all that a Li-Ion power tool battery will outperform on current output.  My drill battery is fist sized and can do 30 amps without cutting out, at 18V.  That's over 500W peak power.  You are not getting that from Ni-Cads.

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You mean the density?  Yeah, that's true.  But I've never seen a battery power tool that lacked in power.  I would still be using my NiCd Makita, but I'm not paying nearly as much for a new battery as I would for a new drill.
gnuarm:

--- Quote from: Miyuki on August 22, 2022, 10:15:41 am ---
--- Quote from: tom66 on August 22, 2022, 09:34:48 am ---
--- Quote from: gnuarm on August 22, 2022, 09:25:13 am ---100 km is pretty lame range, even for a city car.  I don't know how many miles a day a taxi drives, well, km then, but 100 km is only 60 miles and that's not much for any sort of working vehicle, even if you charge at lunch.  We'll see if it is successful. 

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It's not a bad compromise tbh... Most of the taxis spend their time tootling around in city traffic where average speeds of 8 mph mean you're doing well.  So they can easily run till lunch.  The petrol engine then gets them any fares to the airport and back.

But I think long term something like a 200mi / 300km all electric taxi will make the most sense.  PHEVs are training wheels for real EVs :)

As for Ni-Cads, no doubt at all that a Li-Ion power tool battery will outperform on current output.  My drill battery is fist sized and can do 30 amps without cutting out, at 18V.  That's over 500W peak power.  You are not getting that from Ni-Cads.

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Looking at the average value for Prague (a decent size city) average taxi (and all uber, bolt ...) are 180-220 km a working day

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So 150 km (90 miles) should handle a day's work with a top off at lunch.  There are lots of BEVs that get that sort of range and would not be so high priced.
tom66:

--- Quote from: gnuarm on August 22, 2022, 08:12:56 pm ---Sorry, I missed that it is a hybrid.  I don't have much enthusiasm for hybrids.  They don't solve any problems, other than making ICE cheaper to run.

That's something people say that makes no sense to me.  It's not an EV, it just uses a battery and electric motor to improve mileage.  It doesn't have the same advantages or disadvantages. 
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I don't know if you actually understand what a PHEV *is*.

The best way to think of a PHEV is like a battery-electric vehicle that can run on petrol when the battery is flat.  That is why I say it is like training wheels.  You get slowly more used to electric mobility.  Working out how to schedule your charging times, finding public chargers, optimising efficiency for EV driving.  That kind of thing.  My PHEV offsets some 80% of emissions because the petrol engine *simply never runs for those miles*.   When it is running on petrol, you get some efficiency benefits from being electrically-assisted, e.g. my car only has a 1.4L engine but is almost as fast as the comparable model with a 2.0L engine, which means less drag and higher load factors.  But that's relatively minor compared to pure EV benefits.


--- Quote from: gnuarm on August 22, 2022, 08:12:56 pm ---
--- Quote ---As for Ni-Cads, no doubt at all that a Li-Ion power tool battery will outperform on current output.  My drill battery is fist sized and can do 30 amps without cutting out, at 18V.  That's over 500W peak power.  You are not getting that from Ni-Cads.

--- End quote ---

You mean the density?  Yeah, that's true.  But I've never seen a battery power tool that lacked in power.  I would still be using my NiCd Makita, but I'm not paying nearly as much for a new battery as I would for a new drill.

--- End quote ---

Both energy and power density are improved, the drill can do more torque and it can supply that torque for longer before needing a battery charge.
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