Author Topic: Coronavirus cure  (Read 26433 times)

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Offline james_s

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #100 on: April 05, 2020, 02:48:48 am »
I suspect it's the same part of the brain that is involved in religion, clearly it is more active in some people than others and some of those latch onto something other than one of the prevailing conventional religions. It's futile to argue logic with them because their belief is not based on logic to begin with.
 
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Offline not1xor1

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #101 on: April 05, 2020, 06:10:17 pm »
In the old days, people believed in witchcraft...   in the 50's and 60's, people ended up in mental hospitals thinking they were being controlled by radar, or laser, or any of the technologies that were new at the time.  Today, "the unknowing" worry about cell phone radiation, vaccinations, and any number of other things that they do not have the training or knowledge to understand.  Because they can't trust "experts" (largely due to the Dunning-Kruger effect [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning–Kruger_effect] one suspects), they end up going with their own superstitions instead.  Sadly, there are so many messed up people like that.  Enough to get leaders of modern countries elected by them...

The Dunning-Kruger effect implies that people who have some knowledge about a given matter feel expert in any other subject even when they lack the most basic knowledge. On the other side, people who do not feel knowledgeable are often more expert than they believe (probably because they do not trust their gut feeling and investigate and try to learn from reliable sources).

Belief in conspiracy theories is much more complicate than that. Probably the need to make sense of the unknown or to attribute an agent-driven cause to casual events is part of the problem. Poor economical situation (middle class wiped out by free-market frenzy in the last decades) with the feeling of impotence and lack of control on one's own life also contribute to that.

Last but not the least nowadays there are organizations, think tanks, state-backed trolls, who exploit such social weakness for various reasons, often mixing various paranoid subjects like no-vax, chem-trails, climate denial, etc. just to fuel mistrust in science.

While that sounds like a conspiracy theory itself  ;D it is based on trial evidences and/or government reports.
I'm referring to various Union of Concerned Scientists documents and on EU pages about Russian (and other) trolls spreading fake news and fueling controversies.
 
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Offline SilverSolder

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #102 on: April 05, 2020, 06:49:19 pm »

The Dunning-Kruger effect implies that people who have some knowledge about a given matter feel expert in any other subject even when they lack the most basic knowledge.[...]

Basically, Dunning-Kruger means that idiots tend to be LOUD idiots!  The incompetent overestimate their abilities, and the competent underestimate theirs.

The Wikipedia article has become more mealy mouthed over time. 

From https://www.verywellmind.com/an-overview-of-the-dunning-kruger-effect-4160740 -

Quote
The Dunning-Kruger effect is a type of cognitive bias in which people believe that they are smarter and more capable than they really are. Essentially, low ability people do not possess the skills needed to recognize their own incompetence. The combination of poor self-awareness and low cognitive ability leads them to overestimate their own capabilities.

The term lends a scientific name and explanation to a problem that many people immediately recognize—that fools are blind to their own foolishness. As Charles Darwin wrote in his book The Descent of Man, "Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge."
[...]

Agree with your other good points.


« Last Edit: April 05, 2020, 06:52:20 pm by SilverSolder »
 

Offline DrG

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #103 on: April 05, 2020, 06:52:38 pm »
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/talking-apes/201801/why-do-people-believe-in-conspiracy-theories

https://physicsworld.com/a/why-do-people-still-believe-in-conspiracy-theories/

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-do-people-believe-in-conspiracy-theories/

...and, of course, a video...she is/was a grad student so I am cutting her slack for the ultra-simplistic communications, plus, I went to her site and she bills herself as a neuroscientist / comedian [and also she is nice to look at].

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z98U1nMFrJQ&feature=youtu.be
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Offline james_s

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #104 on: April 05, 2020, 07:10:02 pm »
I've noticed this now and then in myself, the more I learn about a topic the more aware I become of just how much more there is to know so the less knowledgeable I feel. Every now and then it sneaks up on me and I realize with some surprise that I really am an expert on one thing or another, though it's usually something obscure with little practical value.
 
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Offline SilverSolder

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #105 on: April 05, 2020, 11:50:31 pm »
I've noticed this now and then in myself, the more I learn about a topic the more aware I become of just how much more there is to know so the less knowledgeable I feel. Every now and then it sneaks up on me and I realize with some surprise that I really am an expert on one thing or another, though it's usually something obscure with little practical value.

Yes, the more you know, the more you realize you don't know.  Science is not infinitely certain.  Men of science aren't either...   but fools too often are.
 
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Offline Siwastaja

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #106 on: April 06, 2020, 12:56:02 pm »
Learning is like an S curve. First you learn slowly, because you don't yet know how to learn; but you also don't know what's ahead. When you are getting closer to the highest rate of change, absorbing a lot of new information efficiently, you are shocked to see how much you don't know, because you see the increasing rate and have no idea when it will slow down.

Once your learning starts slowing back down because you already know so much and have absorbed all the critical stuff properly, it gets much easier, and you start feeling confident. Until you find something new to learn, starting the process again.
 
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Online nigelwright7557

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #107 on: April 06, 2020, 01:40:51 pm »
Did you miss the last roll and now have nothing to wipe your ass? ;D My sister in UK told me all toilet paper and eggs are gone.

If you eat enough eggs you will become egg bound and wont need any toilet paper.

 

Offline DrG

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #108 on: April 06, 2020, 01:47:52 pm »
Did you miss the last roll and now have nothing to wipe your ass? ;D My sister in UK told me all toilet paper and eggs are gone.

If you eat enough eggs you will become egg bound and wont need any toilet paper.

Ahhh yes, a form of self-constipating to go along with self-quarantining, self-isolating and gastro-intestinal distancing.
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Offline SilverSolder

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #109 on: April 06, 2020, 02:20:46 pm »

I would guess the manufacturing/distribution of toilet rolls is not geared for rapid changes in demand...   
 

Offline MT

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #110 on: April 06, 2020, 02:35:28 pm »
After being Frustrated to no end with all the Comments and Videos on Facebook 'linking' 5G to the CoronaVirus, and that the Vaccines that they are working on, will include a Tracking Microchip, I decided to do a quick video of my own. Trying my best to Dispel some of the Mistruths, and just trying to inform people.

You can check it out below. And also, remember to Like and Subscribe...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=NAHe7uFZ6qM
Sorry to say but thats a dead end, the bankster cabal already divided people up and as soon one side get to know about
military Active Denial System (ADS) 95GHZ all your arguments will be down the toilet no matter the facts you present.
Not even the argument the Sun blasts various wave lengths (some that heats you up) will do.

However what you could do is to research into why all those crocked doctors suddenly pops up everywhere and that we
all been frauded again by the banksters just like what hapend in 2007-8!
« Last Edit: April 06, 2020, 03:02:30 pm by MT »
 

Offline MT

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #111 on: April 06, 2020, 02:49:30 pm »
In the old days, people believed in witchcraft...   in the 50's and 60's, people ended up in mental hospitals thinking they were being controlled by radar, or laser, or any of the technologies that were new at the time.  Today, "the unknowing" worry about cell phone radiation, vaccinations, and any number of other things that they do not have the training or knowledge to understand.  Because they can't trust "experts" (largely due to the Dunning-Kruger effect [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning–Kruger_effect] one suspects), they end up going with their own superstitions instead.  Sadly, there are so many messed up people like that.  Enough to get leaders of modern countries elected by them...

The Dunning-Kruger effect implies that people who have some knowledge about a given matter feel expert in any other subject even when they lack the most basic knowledge. On the other side, people who do not feel knowledgeable are often more expert than they believe (probably because they do not trust their gut feeling and investigate and try to learn from reliable sources).

Belief in conspiracy theories is much more complicate than that. Probably the need to make sense of the unknown or to attribute an agent-driven cause to casual events is part of the problem. Poor economical situation (middle class wiped out by free-market frenzy in the last decades) with the feeling of impotence and lack of control on one's own life also contribute to that.

Last but not the least nowadays there are organizations, think tanks, state-backed trolls, who exploit such social weakness for various reasons, often mixing various paranoid subjects like no-vax, chem-trails, climate denial, etc. just to fuel mistrust in science.

While that sounds like a conspiracy theory itself  ;D it is based on trial evidences and/or government reports.
I'm referring to various Union of Concerned Scientists documents and on EU pages about Russian (and other) trolls spreading fake news and fueling controversies.

Dunning-Kruger effect implies is that of a group of know-it-all's with a ADHD circular arguments on a forum called EVBLOGG labeling everybody else inside and outside that forum as idiots, loud idiots, and morons, fools, quacks , con artists, conspiracy theorists etc.

So what Dunning-Kruger really are is its a rhetorical trap that anyone who mentions it have fallen into there fore i wont mention it. ::)
« Last Edit: April 06, 2020, 03:41:28 pm by MT »
 

Online wraper

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #112 on: April 06, 2020, 06:50:23 pm »
Sorry to say but thats a dead end, the bankster cabal already divided people up and as soon one side get to know about
military Active Denial System (ADS) 95GHZ all your arguments will be down the toilet no matter the facts you present.

 

Offline Homer J Simpson

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #113 on: April 11, 2020, 01:14:09 am »
 

Offline gorge441

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #114 on: April 11, 2020, 03:18:08 pm »
I am really sorry to say, i have no idea where it comes from or who made it :-//. China blamed the US and the US blames China :box:. Somebody said it comes from bats, somebody said from worms, etc. I am really confused. Though, 5G  can't be avoided :-+. Because the radiation that comes out of it is really harmful to animal life.
 

Offline SilverSolder

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #115 on: April 11, 2020, 03:51:14 pm »
Because the radiation that comes out of it is really harmful to animal life.

You are starting a fight here. This forum had a few past discussions on whether non-ionizing radiations harm lives. All threads ended up being locked and someone being banned.
Also FYI, 5G uses a few bands, some "legacy" bands are just 2G/3G/4G bands freed from deprecation of legacy services.
2G has been radiating 2W peak per phone for the past decades and so what? WiFi has been using the 5G~6G band for a decade, so what? ADAS and other consumer level radars have been using 60G band, and so what?

An elderly gentleman once told me that around the time her house was wired for electricity for the first time, his mother used to put plastic plugs in all the unused wall outlets, "to prevent electricity escaping and harming her family".   New technology -->  new fears.
 
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Offline james_s

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #116 on: April 11, 2020, 06:50:11 pm »
Much of the problem is that most people don't understand that "radiation" means something that radiates, whether that is light or radio waves or alpha, beta, or gamma radiation, etc. They don't comprehend the difference between say visible light and gamma radiation. Both are "radiation", both are photons even, but only one of them will kill you with radiation sickness.
 

Offline Gyro

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #117 on: April 24, 2020, 08:02:25 am »
Yay, the internal UV and disinfectant cure... or how to make your medical expert look really uncomfortable on camera!  :-DD

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-52407177


Just in case anyone gets any ideas, let's not try this one at home folks!  :scared:

« Last Edit: April 24, 2020, 08:04:21 am by Gyro »
Best Regards, Chris
 
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Offline nctnico

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #118 on: April 24, 2020, 11:56:12 am »
Yay, the internal UV and disinfectant cure... or how to make your medical expert look really uncomfortable on camera!  :-DD

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-52407177


Just in case anyone gets any ideas, let's not try this one at home folks!  :scared:
Just when you think Trump can't possibly come up with even more idiotic ideas  :palm:
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 
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Offline BravoV

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #119 on: April 24, 2020, 12:04:00 pm »
I guess the betting begins on when or where the 1st casuality will pop out,  based on president's suggested "method".  :scared:

Offline Gyro

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #120 on: April 24, 2020, 12:04:35 pm »
Accoding to the text, his much vaunted Hydroxychloroquine drug actually increased the death rate in a study on military veterans in a US government run hospital too. I wonder if they got a choice?  ::)

How does the Monopoly card go?  'Read what's on the paper in front of you, do not deviate from what's written on the paper in front of you, do not pass go, do not collect $200'.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2020, 12:10:44 pm by Gyro »
Best Regards, Chris
 

Offline DrG

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #121 on: April 24, 2020, 06:57:50 pm »
Accoding to the text, his much vaunted Hydroxychloroquine drug actually increased the death rate in a study on military veterans in a US government run hospital too. I wonder if they got a choice?  ::)

Don'y really like the orange fur ball, but in his defense, I must say people don't get treated with a potentially deadly drug without a reason.
Chances are those groups being treated with the drug are more severe cases to begin with.
In other words, the survival rate difference could just be contributed by survivor's bias.

Conventionally, in the US, drugs are approved for a particular purpose. That approval is based not only on studies demonstrating safety, but studies demonstrating efficacy for the condition.

Once a drug has been approved for use, Doctors can and do prescribe the drug to patients with a different condition than the one the drug has been approved for.

Usually, this is called “open label” or “off label” use.  In my view, in the great majority of cases, this is done responsibly.

In relatively few instances, there is something generally called “compassionate use” in which a treatment that has not shown specific efficacy is used with full consent and as something of a last resort.

 Because we don’t go around giving people Covid-19 or placebo in a random drug trial, you are going to deal with some harsh realities. In these cases, we will only have the observational data to report – but that is still much better than no data.

Chloroquine drugs are known to carry significant risk and MDs know this, so, yes, they are not going to prescribe the drug for “the heck of it”.

The problem (in this case) with the “Orange Plague” is that he should not be talking about treatments at all because he is obviously clueless and embarrassing so. I actually feel pity for the legitimate SMEs who sit back there and must be ulcerating on a daily basis.
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Offline maginnovision

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #122 on: April 24, 2020, 07:20:54 pm »
Accoding to the text, his much vaunted Hydroxychloroquine drug actually increased the death rate in a study on military veterans in a US government run hospital too. I wonder if they got a choice?  ::)

Don'y really like the orange fur ball, but in his defense, I must say people don't get treated with a potentially deadly drug without a reason.
Chances are those groups being treated with the drug are more severe cases to begin with.
In other words, the survival rate difference could just be contributed by survivor's bias.

This is also just one study of many and as I understand they ran it with two groups. One that got less than the recommended dosage and one that got OVER the recommended. The over the recommended group is the group that was harmed. As far as I know people all of a sudden pointed this study out because most studies were positive but people hate trump so really LIKED this study. The jury is still out though. Until we have many studies conducted properly we can't say what the verdict will be. All over the world people are trying to find something to combat this long and short term and I think the over reacting to every single piece of news is pretty dumb.
 
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Offline maginnovision

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #123 on: April 24, 2020, 07:23:52 pm »
Yay, the internal UV and disinfectant cure... or how to make your medical expert look really uncomfortable on camera!  :-DD

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-52407177


Just in case anyone gets any ideas, let's not try this one at home folks!  :scared:

If you actually care about what's going on here, which I suspect you don't, I'd recommend you watch the press briefings on the official wh.gov youtube channel. They're not edited, nobody is adding their opinion, and they aren't removing context. This way you can make up your own mind and at the very least you do know exactly what happened and what was said as you read the news.
 

Offline Gyro

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Re: Coronavirus cure
« Reply #124 on: April 24, 2020, 07:31:13 pm »
I did watch it. Live! With full context!

Did you?

Edit: ... but today he says he was being sarcastic, so that's ok then!  ::)
« Last Edit: April 24, 2020, 07:38:23 pm by Gyro »
Best Regards, Chris
 


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