General > General Technical Chat

Covid 19 virus

<< < (276/381) > >>

Siwastaja:

--- Quote from: SiliconWizard on March 26, 2020, 06:15:11 pm ---
--- Quote from: Siwastaja on March 26, 2020, 05:56:12 pm ---Needless to say, enforcing the actions by the police/military are only needed because of these groups of people. This is why the Finnish strategy, "we only give suggestions and trust people follow them" is a catastrophe.

--- End quote ---

I don't know a lot about Finland, but a bit about nordic countries in general, and I would have expected people there to be a lot more well behaved than this. But maybe it's just a small fraction of all people (but in that case, that would not be as significant a problem as it is?) Or maybe the Finnish are just obnoxious? Or something. :P

--- End quote ---

Finns are likely to protest somewhat less than what Italians did at the beginning, but many do protest here, like everywhere. So the difference isn't an order of magnitude thing, I think we are quite average here when it comes to being selfish at the expense of others. I think you need to look at certain Asian cultures to see a big difference in this behavior. Though, this being said, even these countries (and they especially!) rely on actually enforcing the rules by the fear of actual sanctions, even if they "might" not need it. Funny thing, isn't it?

"Losing face" is a big thing in some Asian cultures, and it works to some extent here, as well. But this can go both ways; at the early phase of this kind of epidemic, certain social bubbles form, and one of them is the "lallallaa overreaction, I don't want to show I'm scared, not overreacting, lallallaa". So in order not to lose face, you need to pretend living like usual. I think this happens everywhere in Europe to some non-meaningless extent, including Finland; just wittnessed today a few middle-aged guys at a store loudly protesting how stupid this overreaction is because "we have only one dead" (the correct number at that time was 3, as corrected by the cashier, and currently is 5). These people existing is the reason why we need to enforce the rules.

Actually we had some opinion poll numbers how the people here see the actions of the government. I forgot the source, but they were approximately like this: 45% thinks they underreact, 45% thinks they react in the correct proportion at the correct time; 10% thinks they overreact. It's this 10% of people who are dangerous as is and need to be actually enforced with sanctions. 0.1% wouldn't matter; 10% does.

not1xor1:

--- Quote from: SiliconWizard on March 26, 2020, 06:17:45 pm ---@not1xor1: I don't know how much we can trust the published figures, but currently Italy has one of the highest death rate (deaths/total cases) with about 10%. This is gigantic.

--- End quote ---

yes... the reason is yet unclear...probably a combination of:
- being several weeks ahead in the pandemic,
- overcrowded hospitals in some parts of the country,
- using a different criteria for attributing deaths to COVID-19,
- missing lots of positive cases,
- bad air quality,
- old age,
- lacking of D vitamin (just read about that a couple of hours ago), etc.

BTW I just noticed that both Spain and France have alarming high rates too

SiliconWizard:

--- Quote from: Siwastaja on March 26, 2020, 06:52:05 pm ---Actually we had some opinion poll numbers how the people here see the actions of the government. I forgot the source, but they were approximately like this: 45% thinks they underreact, 45% thinks they react in the correct proportion at the correct time; 10% thinks they overreact. It's this 10% of people who are dangerous as is and need to be actually enforced with sanctions. 0.1% wouldn't matter; 10% does.

--- End quote ---

Ok I see...

Now with (from what I've just seen) 958 cases and 5 deaths, things don't look that bad for Finland so far. Don't get me wrong, I'm not underestimating this, and I agree anything should be done to keep this under control, but from figures alone, I can at least slightly understand why some people there would still think it's relatively "mild".

TheNewLab:
at over 1400 postings in this topic in only a short number of days..

I guess I may share what Reuters came up with more detailed numbers. Some are estimates, Others are in my mind humorous, yet good.

I have not tallied what the sum of Reuters numbers are. Anyone else may do that.

The biggest concern are enough beds in hospitals, adequate resuscitators, adequate PPE for health care works. YT search "Italy" filter "this week" or "this month" You will find a number of videos from Italian healthcare workers.

Here are the Reuters numbers:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-usa-bill-contents-idUSKBN21D2CQ

In a way I want to say "just chill out" However, Some fear may be healthy. most of what is suggested is good hygiene. Others, are simple to practice, except, er, uh..Not touching your face. That's the most difficult.

I feel, focusing on facts are best, as it is the unknown creates the greatest fear.

Nusa:

--- Quote from: SiliconWizard on March 26, 2020, 06:17:45 pm ---@not1xor1: I don't know how much we can trust the published figures, but currently Italy has one of the highest death rate (deaths/total cases) with about 10%. This is gigantic.

--- End quote ---

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries   now has a deaths/1M pop column in their charts, saving you from doing the math. Italy and Spain are way ahead of everyone else by that measure.

Navigation

[0] Message Index

[#] Next page

[*] Previous page

There was an error while thanking
Thanking...
Go to full version
Powered by SMFPacks Advanced Attachments Uploader Mod