| General > General Technical Chat |
| Covid 19 virus |
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| iMo:
--- Quote from: Nominal Animal on March 15, 2020, 01:37:04 pm ---.. our government has categorically stated it is impossible: they are bound by law to not do that, that they do not have the legal right to reinstate border controls. .. --- End quote --- Is it a Finnish law or an EU law? EU countries like Czechia, Slovakia, Poland have closed their borders without any problems. |
| Cerebus:
--- Quote from: mrflibble on March 15, 2020, 12:36:44 pm --- --- Quote from: imo on March 15, 2020, 07:55:07 am --- --- Quote from: nctnico on March 15, 2020, 01:25:35 am ---This is pretty much in line with what I'm experiencing currently. Flu like symptoms for the past couple of days. Now I start to develop a cough and my lungs start to feel watery. --- End quote --- In mid March in Europe you may feel similar symptoms with a) cold (because people underestimate the still low temperatures while sunny days already), b) flu - because the flu season, c) hay fever - allergy season starts - people with pollen allergies and asthma, d) others. Thus only a test will tell you more.. --- End quote --- In general I tend to keep away from threads like this because I suffer from hysteria induced narcolepsy, but a real quick FYI: Coarsly chop up onion, put in handkerchief, crush onion, inhale the sulfur goodness. No magic bullet (duh), but useful tool. The main component in this case being the anti-inflammatory one. Also anti-viral, but lets work under the assumption that the preventative ship has already sailed. You want to reduce or inhibit the inflamatory response induced by the viral infection making friends with your immune system. --- End quote --- If that folk remedy were to damp down the inflammatory response, if, then it would be exactly the wrong things to do. The inflammatory response is exactly evidence that your immune system is responding as it is supposed to. --- Quote ---Ninja-ing your local friend asthma patient's inhaler and huffing that also works /some/ but in general is frowned upon. Plus those are typically corticosteroids, so not the best match IMO as treatment in the early stages. AFAIK they are useful at the later stages though. Aaaanyways, trying not to get into it. Short version: inhale an onion and with a bit of luck enjoy the reduced discomfort. Cheap, easy, scalable, no substitute for proper medical care, but better than nothing in a situation where the relevant medical resources are somewhat strained. Good luck! --- End quote --- The normal, typical asthma inhalers are short acting beta2-adrenoceptor agonists not corticosteriods. These 'reliever' inhalers - colour coded blue in the EU - typically contain salbutamol/albuterol but some use formoterol/eformoterol - those are the two commonest, there are others. These are only taken in immediate response to asthma symptoms and are the only asthma treating drug that is likely to offer some symptomatic relief in ARDS. The dose delivered by a pocket inhaler is unlikely to be effective, both because of dose and delivery mechanism. People with ARDS probably are being treated with sympathomimetics like this, but by nebulisation of a solution with oxygen (producing a fine cloud of droplets that can be inhaled). Typical dose of salbutamol from a pocket inhaler 200ug, typical dose from nebulisation 2mg repeated every 15 minutes until an effective response is seen. Sometimes atropine analogues are also given as relief medication (e.g. ipratropium bromide aka atrovent). Green colour coded asthma inhalers contain long acting beta2-adrenoceptor agonists and are given as preventative treatment on a regular basis to people with more serious cases. Brown colour coded inhalers are corticosteroids designed to damp down the immune response and prevent asthma symptoms from occurring in the first place when used on a regular basis. Use of corticosteriods would be specifically contraindicated in the presence of infection unless concomitant therapy was given for the infection. Some inhalers contain a mixture of types of medication (e.g. Symbicort, a long acting beta2 agonist (formoterol) with a corticosteroid (budesonide)) - there is no standard colour coding for combination inhalers. Best you stick to not giving pharmaceutical/biomedical advice as you clearly don't know what you're talking about. Kindly remember that "A little knowledge is a dangerous thing". |
| SilverSolder:
--- Quote from: Nominal Animal on March 15, 2020, 01:37:04 pm --- --- Quote from: SilverSolder on March 15, 2020, 12:17:58 pm ---Does a tin foil hat provide any form of protection against this? --- End quote --- It is not a conspiracy theory, it is just a consequence of their actions. They believe, like the worker movement in 1918 in Finland believed, that Finland is doomed unless it merges with a larger union. They aren't evil, or conspiring; just ignorant and wrong. They genuinely believe that unless they replace Finns with humanitarian immigrants, something bad will happen to everyone; that it must be done for the world to be safe. Sometimes that bad thing is genetics ("we need better genes", even though most humanitarian immigrants suffer from consanguinity more than Finns), sometimes it is the aging population ("we need someone to wipe our bums when we are old", even though employment rate among the immigrants is significantly lower than average, and raw numbers indicate each humanitarian immigrants is financially a negative net loss on average for the society), sometimes it is "white man's burden" (the tar in most slave ships was produced in Finland), sometimes international obligations, sometimes something else. Did you know that Finns are basically what remains of the hunter-gather population all over Europe, up till agriculture came along? (See e.g. this, a report by Swedish archaeologists, using bog corpses dating back 5000 years.) No, neither do Finns. We are still taught in school that we displaced Sami people, coming from a bend somewhere in the river Volga. And that we should be ashamed for our history. Being a proud Finn is worse than announcing oneself as a reborn Adolf Hitler. Try waving a Finnish flag on a sunny non-national holiday, and you will be spat on. Fifteen years ago, at Helsinki University, I took the mandatory Swedish class. The lecturer asked the students how they identify themselves: as Helsinki'ers, as Finns, or as Europeans. 95% of the students -- everyone except me -- said they identify themselves primarily as Helsinki'er, then as an European, and laughed the idea of identifying as a Finn. That is how deeply self-loathing is ingrained in current youth. (Me, I'm a barrel-raised woodland creature, and as basic [in the derogatory sense] a finn as you can get.) Everything I am saying here is easily verifiable. I am not implying that there is someone wringing their hands together, cackling evilly, with a plan on how to replace the population in Finland with immigrants. I am just saying that the current actions inevitably lead to that. The most important of those actions, in the current pandemic, and pertinent to this thread, is their absolute refusal to even consider reinstating border controls. The reason for that is that while the majority of Finns have clamored for border controls ever since 2015, and returning humanitarian immigrants to the safe EU countries they came from, our government has categorically stated it is impossible: they are bound by law to not do that, that they do not have the legal right to reinstate border controls. If they now reinstated border controls, even for curbing the spread of the pandemic, they would immediately prove they have lied to Finnish citizens for years. So, instead of doing the sane thing and protect everyone living in Finland by instating health inspection based border controls, our beloved leaders are still claiming it would be illegal for them to do so. The only reason to do so, is 1) to avoid being exposed as a liar, and 2) to avoid risking their long-term desire, of Finland being a haven for humanitarian immigration. This is not a conspiracy theory, or any theory at all, because the first reason is a consequence of the second, and there are no other reasons stated by our politicians in the media (or even in private). --- End quote --- My take on it is - there is nothing wrong with being proud of your country and flying your flag. But that must never become a reason to sh!t on other people or countries, and you must never lose sight of the fact that you are not perfect. (I have been to Finland, and liked it!) |
| Nominal Animal:
--- Quote from: imo on March 15, 2020, 02:16:43 pm --- --- Quote from: Nominal Animal on March 15, 2020, 01:37:04 pm ---.. our government has categorically stated it is impossible: they are bound by law to not do that, that they do not have the legal right to reinstate border controls. .. --- End quote --- Is it a Finnish law or an EU law? EU countries like Czechia, Slovakia, Poland have closed their borders without any problems. --- End quote --- I have no idea, and the media is unwilling to ask such questions. Searching Finlex, I'd say they are lying, but that too would make me a conspiracy theorist, wouldn't it? --- Quote from: SilverSolder on March 15, 2020, 02:20:26 pm ---My take on it is - there is nothing wrong with being proud of your country and flying your flag. But that must never become a reason to sh!t on other people or countries, and you must never lose sight of the fact that you are not perfect. (I have been to Finland, and liked it!) --- End quote --- I absolutely agree. While I rail against things like Finns not recognized as indigenous, it is not that I want some "privilege"; I just want us to look at history honestly, and learn from it, instead of using fictitious history as a political tool. The "non-indigenousness" of Finns has been used as a political tool for over a hundred years, and even in the face of archaeological DNA evidence, there seems no end to it. It is at the core of the beliefs that lead to the emotional need for Finland to be part of or replaced by something bigger. I mean, respected researchers have rejected the DNA evidence, and instead state that linguistic theories are more reliable, because those theories can be used in guilting people to follow some political ideology/agenda or other. |
| iMo:
Finland may close their borders anytime, as they wish. There cannot be such a law which forbids that. An EU country still may decide on its borders even it is a part of Schengen Area (26 countries incl. Finland). |
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