EEVblog Electronics Community Forum
General => General Technical Chat => Topic started by: Falcon69 on December 17, 2014, 04:33:44 pm
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SO, just heard on the news that the US has been talking to Cuba for the last year, and are now exploring options of putting up an embassy in Havana.
The US hasn't explored these options since 1961.
Does that mean Cuban Cigars will now be legal in the US?!! :-+
A historical event for sure!
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Indeed, it would appear that the embargo is being dissolved.
About time.
This will practically make the country rich over night once the investors and tourists move in.
Since not much of the country is modern, we should see a massive movement of electronics into the country.
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Quick!!
Everybody !
Travel to Cuba in its aboriginal state!
Before all the US citizens and US capitalists are allowed to flood this beautiful island..
Frank
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About time. Cuba still gets lumped in with Sudan, Syria, Iran, and friggin' North Korea in its export control group :palm:.
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This will practically make the country rich over night once the investors and tourists move in.
Since not much of the country is modern, we should see a massive movement of electronics into the country.
Not unless the government changes their economic policy.
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Quick!!
Everybody !
Travel to Cuba in its aboriginal state!
Before all the US citizens and US capitalists are allowed to flood this beautiful island..
Frank
You are late by over 500 years, but if it's just US influence then you are late by 100 years. Plus there is still a ban for travel for tourism.
Now to see what Florida and Congress have to say about all of this, I hope Congress lifts the embargo, and let the Cuban citizens decide for themselves once they have more access to information about how things are in the world with wages over $20/month.
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they just had a live update from the white house with Obama commenting on all of this, however, I wasn't really watching it. :palm:
And who changed the header? It was Cuba?? Now it is Cuba !!!
I wasn't that excited about it when I posted it, I was actually alittle confused as to why this took so long!
LOL
EDIT: Nevermind, LOL. I guess Miguel can change the header of his own post. didn't know you could do that! LOL
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Plus there is still a ban for travel for tourism.
Only for you guys.
I wonder why now. China getting closer ties? Maybe this is the first time there is an actual downside to the status quo?
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Apparently it is not "now", the US has been in talks for nearly a year with Cuba.
It seems since Fidel's brother, Raúl Castro, has taken office now (in April of 2011), his brother is more willing to open talks with the US.
I think it's a good thing. Long over due for that country.
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EDIT: Nevermind, LOL. I guess Miguel can change the header of his own post. didn't know you could do that! LOL
I just replied to Frank.
Pope Francis brokered the deal, I think it's a good thing for both countries, specially since Raúl Castro is in favor of allowing his citizens more access to international information and access to the internet.
Maybe the cartillas for food rationing, and being all a government employees go away (right now companies pay the government for the employees and the government pay the employees a fix amount).
Anyways, I think it's a good move overall and hopefully the Cuban citizens are better for it.
Edit: I just spent in lunch alone a full month salary for your average Cuban citizen.
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Plus there is still a ban for travel for tourism.
Only for you guys.
I wonder why now. China getting closer ties? Maybe this is the first time there is an actual downside to the status quo?
Quote from Wiki:
Effective January 14, 2013, Cuba ended the requirement established in 1961 that any citizens who wish to travel abroad were required to obtain an expensive government permit and a letter of invitation.
So they have been changes lurking it seems offering more freedoms to their citizens. Still not quite there yet, but I think freedom of movement was probably a big factor on the White House decision.
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Plus there is still a ban for travel for tourism.
Only for you guys.
I wonder why now. China getting closer ties? Maybe this is the first time there is an actual downside to the status quo?
Maybe some politicians have realized that continuing to do the same thing and expecting different results is a fools errand.
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Darn, no more cheap Cuban doctors, though they needed 2 interpreters with them a lot of the time. One from Spanish to English, and the other to do the local languages. Some of them were pretty good doctors, though the students that went there had a few come back in a state that was forbidden. No TOP there in Cuba, so 1 went and 2 came back.
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The whole cuba thing is a farce. The entire political class, particularly the conservatives, never understood what a totalitarian government fears the most: information access. Embargo did nothing but solidified the government of Cuba.
That's where Nixon was infinitely smarter than any of the presidents: he toppled the Chinese government and liberated China without firing one shot.
So I am 120% supportive of Obama's move today to normalize the relationship with Cuba. One of the very few smart moves his administration has ever made.
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That's where Nixon was infinitely smarter than any of the presidents: he toppled the Chinese government and liberated China without firing one shot.
Regime change in China had nothing to do with the US. Relations between China and the US improved after Mao's death.
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Canadians spend their vacation in Cuba and come back very happy.
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We went there on holiday a few years back - superb! I was sat out overlooking the sea with a Cuban cigar in one hand, a drink in the other, and my beautiful wife by my side! 8)
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Canadians spend their vacation in Cuba and come back very happy.
That reveals a lot more about the Canadians than Cuba, :)
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I wonder why now. China getting closer ties? Maybe this is the first time there is an actual downside to the status quo?
Maybe some politicians have realized that continuing to do the same thing and expecting different results is a fools errand.
Don't know, it seems like keeping things the way they are has been in everyones interest.
US: "Tough on Cuba" -> get votes
Cuba: "Oppressive imperialists" -> it's not our fault things are shit
And backing out of that means admitting you were wrong. So something has to come along and change the situation for anything to happen.
Wild speculation follows. I'm thinking along the lines that Chinas growing influence in recent years means someone sees a risk of Missile Crisis II: Nuclear Boogaloo.
Possible Chinese perspective: The US already has forces just off the coast of China (Taiwan), so it's only fair that the other superpower gets to park some of theirs on Cuba. Then negotiations lead to withdrawal on both sides, Taiwan peacefully reintegrates with the mainland, boost to the economy, one big happy family, etc.
Or at least that could be a useful scenario for a Cuban leader to outline. "You give us nowhere else to turn..." Normalization of relations would then be a preemptive move from a US perspective.
How's that for an armchair geopolitical analysis? :-)
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They kept a lot of classic 50's american cars riding there, will be traded in against the new petrol efficient small cars if this century, it will never be the same ????
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And a vacation spot where $100/day actually gives you a lot will be gone as well.
Of course it's always fun to visit a place where you are essentially a millionaire compared to the masses. NOT!
But I do have my hopes up if they do follow through bringing information to their population and let them free to travel and earn competitive world wide salaries so they can actually do travel, as we all can.
I've been playing Silvio Rodriguez and Pablo Milanes all day btw :)
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Possible Chinese perspective: The US already has forces just off the coast of China (Taiwan), so it's only fair that the other superpower gets to park some of theirs on Cuba.
Let us not forget that the whole reason this problem with Cuba started was that the US had already stationed IRBMs in Turkey PRIOR to the Soviets attempt to level the playing field by doing likewise in Cuba. (Similar range and time of flight profile.)
An often overlooked fact is that the US withdrew those missiles as part of the negotiotions to resolve that immediate crisis.
But, just like a pair of schoolkids, neither Cuba or the supposed grown-up, the US, even looked at each other for decades after that embarrassment.
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While good for Cubans, i wonder what would be lost.
Cuba was (and still is?) that one place unmolested by globalization.
It's one of the very few places where i couldn't find any of the "common" products, like coca-cola.
There is a charm in that.
There was also a curious inversion of roles.
Back in USSR, as a kid i was occasionally going around the central streets asking random people to change me some dollars.
Fast forward a decade and a half, and here i was on Cuba, being asked by random people to change them some dollars.
Peculiar. :)
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Marco Rubio is a typical example of a hypocrite. He demands sanctions on Cuba until there is democracy. And yet he is happy to deal with a totalitarian regime with open arms like China. Hypocrisy as its worst. Unlike the majority of Republicans, a few great statesmen like Jimmy Carter had the guts and intelligence to say US foreign policy over Cuba was an attack on the ordinary innocent Cuban citizen.
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When was the last time you saw a citizen of Cuba on the Internet while they are in Cuba?
Also they couldn't leave the country unless they paid a big sum of money and got an invitation letter from the Cuban government to do so.
They still have ration booklets, and companies pay the government for employees and the people get paid by the government after they take their cut.
As for a totalitarian regime I would not put China on that pot, their citizens are free to travel and actually are probably the top tourists out there right now. And they do have access to the Internet.
But part of the agreement is to bring the Internet to the people, at least they will start to learn how is it outside of their island.
Even if since January 2013 they are free to travel, earning a medium income of $20/month I don't think they can get too far.
But sure Rubio (Cuban) is a hypocrite because he doesn't know what's all about, and I guess not all of us want freedom.
That said I think Obama did good and I do hope Congress lifts the embargo, it's all about letting the fine Cuban people enjoy the same freedoms and mobility as we do for a decent pay so they can actually do things we take for granted.
Or I guess they could take their chances and risk their life on a clandestine boat to Florida.
Anyways it's a good thing what has happened and it's better than the Status Quo that accomplished nothing. I just hope that Congress does the right thing and lifts the embargo, that will give a chance to the Cuban citizens to at least be informed.
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Of course it's always fun to visit a place where you are essentially a millionaire compared to the masses. NOT!
The tourism industry is an important part of the Cuban economy which benefits lots of the local people; If more people went and spent money there perhaps you wouldn't feel so bad! ;-)
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The whole cuba thing is a farce. The entire political class, particularly the conservatives, never understood what a totalitarian government fears the most: information access. Embargo did nothing but solidified the government of Cuba.
That's where Nixon was infinitely smarter than any of the presidents: he toppled the Chinese government and liberated China without firing one shot.
So I am 120% supportive of Obama's move today to normalize the relationship with Cuba. One of the very few smart moves his administration has ever made.
I could not agree with you more.
I am no fan of Obama (worst in my lifetime), but on this move, he is 100% right on the money. US culture is the MOST powerful export we have... it influences the whole rest of the world and it is unstoppable. I've seen how US culture has seeped into secret military installations in Siberia and into Tehran and Baku and everywhere else. Restricting it from Cuba was the worst move ever.
And let's just call it like it is... the only reason the Cuban embargo has remained in force for so long is because Kennedy was the one that implemented it, and because he was our most beloved President in modern times and because he got killed, nobody wanted to step on his legacy by reversing one of his biggest blunders as President.
The Nixon/China example couldn't be more of a bullseye. What clearer evidence do we need? And furthermore - by trying to isolate Cuba, all we did is give them fewer options on who to sidle up with... and who did they choose? Russia, Venezuela and Iran. Great ::)
I know a few very successful businessmen in NYC who have been spending a lot of time in Cuba recently... the recent announcement by the administration is the tip of the iceberg... there is a LOT more going on behind the scenes (economically) that we aren't privvy to just yet.
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The Nixon/China example couldn't be more of a bullseye. What clearer evidence do we need?
Why is it that lots of Americans think they're responsible for regime change in China? The US government had nothing to do with it. Chairman Mao died and after a short period of political instability Deng rose to power and opened China up to the rest of the world.
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Indeed, it would appear that the embargo is being dissolved.
About time.
This will practically make the country rich over night once the investors and tourists move in.
Since not much of the country is modern, we should see a massive movement of electronics into the country.
There seems to be a bit of an electronics scene in Cuba, also computing. The electronics aspect is more related to keeping stuff working and making things out of what we would call junk box parts. I've heard on a spanish speaking forum that a guy from Habana had made his own "battery charger" (I think it was alkaline, or NiCD) out of a rectifier, a resistor and a mains plug. Very rudimentary but interesting.
Amateur radio is there in Cuba, of course, I expect transmissions to be monitored. The intended purpose of the radio club, apparently was to provide a way to deal with national emergencies, war and stuff like that. Of course, the daily life of a Cuban ham radio shack wouldn't be like that, I suspect.
There's also a computer club, you can join the club and have access to (mostly outdated, Linux or XP based) computers. They see it mostly like a hobby, not a tool. It's called "joven club de computación y electronics " or something like that. I'd translate it as "youth club of computation and electronics"
I have talked to Cubans and heard their perception do Cuba. It's strict on some aspects, but is not bat-sh*t crazy like North Korea is. You could say the same sort of propaganda has been seen in most countries at some point in the last century. The problem is this propaganda is kind of persistent in Cuba.
They don't have much criminality, education is good. There's some things they have nailed. Their teachers often move to Dominican Republic and are very welcome because their quality is so much better.
It's also quite tourist friendly, and Cubans can travel and move away from the country (although the government can be strict, I don't know any details).
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It's also quite tourist friendly
Next vacation spot?
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I was there in 2009, it's a nice place to be and all of the locals I met were amazingly friendly. The continued American embargo once the cold war was over was always a puzzle to me.
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Canadians spend their vacation in Cuba and come back very happy.
Perhaps not for long (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/19/world/americas/cubas-fans-in-canada-anxiously-picture-an-island-awash-in-americans.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=b-lede-package-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0)
Coming soon to Havana - Mcdonalds and Wallmart...
Never been to Cuba but some of my American friends have (Via Mexico). Looks like I missed my chance to see it in its unspoiled state.
I was able to travel in Hungary and Czechoslovakia in 1988 before the Berlin Wall came down. Prague was amazing and unspoiled. Not a western tourist or franchise in sight. Good times...
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Never been to Cuba but some of my American friends have (Via Mexico). Looks like I missed my chance to see it in its unspoiled state.
I was able to travel in Hungary and Czechoslovakia in 1988 before the Berlin Wall came down. Prague was amazing and unspoiled. Not a western tourist or franchise in sight. Good times...
You could still go to North Korea - totally unspoiled, I heard.
Or many places governed by ISIS - totally unspoiled too by western tourist and "Mcdonalds and Wallmart..."
Don't let the door hit you on your way out.
As a matter of fact, the country you live in is also 100% free of "Wallmart".
Seriously, I would call this the spoiled rat symptom: spit the hands that feed you. Too bad that we don't yet have a means to get rid of leeches like that.
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You could still go to North Korea - totally unspoiled, I heard.
Or many places governed by ISIS - totally unspoiled too by western tourist and "Mcdonalds and Wallmart..."
Don't let the door hit you on your way out.
As a matter of fact, the country you live in is also 100% free of "Wallmart".
Seriously, I would call this the spoiled rat symptom: spit the hands that feed you. Too bad that we don't yet have a means to get rid of leeches like that.
Ha. You really are a child aren't you?
One of the great things about having actually traveled in communist countries is you get to see first hand all of the reasons why communism doesn't work. My time spent travelling in Hungary and Czechoslovakia was incredibly educational. I spent time with some very rebellious young people and was at Wenceslaus Square during the 70th anniversary of the First Czech Republic. I saw the armored trucks with water cannons and teams of soldiers with German Shepards to disperse the crowds.
But just because one is a believer in capitalism does not mean one can't find fault in the fast food, strip mall, American franchise crap that seems to invade every corner of the planet these days.
The great thing about freedom is it means freedom to criticize and find fault- even in the face of the chicken-hawk, kool -aid drinking believers in "American Exceptionalism" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism)
USA! USA! USA! :blah: :blah: :blah:
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You could still go to North Korea - totally unspoiled, I heard.
Or many places governed by ISIS - totally unspoiled too by western tourist and "Mcdonalds and Wallmart..."
Don't let the door hit you on your way out.
As a matter of fact, the country you live in is also 100% free of "Wallmart".
Seriously, I would call this the spoiled rat symptom: spit the hands that feed you. Too bad that we don't yet have a means to get rid of leeches like that.
Ha. You really are a child aren't you?
One of the great things about having actually traveled in communist countries is you get to see first hand all of the reasons why communism doesn't work. My time spent travelling in Hungary and Czechoslovakia was incredibly educational. I spent time with some very rebellious young people and was at Wenceslaus Square during the 70th anniversary of the First Czech Republic. I saw the armored trucks with water cannons and teams of soldiers with German Shepards to disperse the crowds.
But just because one is a believer in capitalism does not mean one can't find fault in the fast food, strip mall, American franchise crap that seems to invade every corner of the planet these days.
The great thing about freedom is it means freedom to criticize and find fault- even in the face of the chicken-hawk, kool -aid drinking believers in "American Exceptionalism" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism)
USA! USA! USA! :blah: :blah: :blah:
Last time I checked, people are streaming into this country to live and prosper, not out of it.
You are free to go anytime you want. Let me know when you leave so I can be at the airport to wave goodbye to you.
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You are free to go anytime you want.
Ah, another who does not understand what freedom really means. It is those who equate criticism with treason who are best suited to live in totalitarian states.
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You are free to go anytime you want.
Ah, another who does not understand what freedom really means. It is those who equate criticism with treason who are best suited to live in totalitarian states.
So you are free to give your opinion about them and their country but they are not free to give their opinion about you without being labeled children who don't understand?
Seems to me the knife cuts both ways.
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It's also quite tourist friendly
Next vacation spot?
No!!!! Come visit us! ;D
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So you are free to give your opinion about them and their country but they are not free to give their opinion about you without being labeled children who don't understand?
Of course they are free to give an opinion. But demonstrating a lack of understanding of why criticism of one aspect of American culture does not make one unpatriotic (quite the opposite actually IMO) makes them fair game for being exposed as either naive or hypocritical.
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No!!!! Come visit us! ;D
I'd love to visit the Dominican Republic. A friend of mine goes there yearly and loves it. The Bahamas is the only Caribbean country I've seen so far. Life is too short...
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The Nixon/China example couldn't be more of a bullseye. What clearer evidence do we need?
Why is it that lots of Americans think they're responsible for regime change in China? The US government had nothing to do with it. Chairman Mao died and after a short period of political instability Deng rose to power and opened China up to the rest of the world.
The equal and opposite question is why do lots of non-Americans seek to minimalize American achivements and/or take every opportunity to criticize America and Americans? I think we know the answer.
There is a lot written about Nixon's trip to China, but there isn't any serious analysis of the event that consider it anything less than a major turning point of world history for the late 20th century. If you don't like giving America that much credit, read Margaret MacMillan's account (she's a historian and professor at Oxford in the UK). But Nixon's trip to China dramatically changed the cold war, changed China's political and economic direction and directly led to the current Chinese socio-political climate and relationship China has today with the rest of the world.
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Of course they are free to give an opinion. But demonstrating a lack of understanding of why criticism of one aspect of American culture does not make one unpatriotic (quite the opposite actually IMO) makes them fair game for being exposed as either naive or hypocritical.
So you think bashing America makes you patriotic and anyone who doesn't agree with you is naive or hypocritical? It seems to me that dannyf and JoeO summed up your viewpoint and attitude pretty succinctly. The original article you referenced quoted some Canadians as lamenting that Cuba will be "ruined" by American tourists. You then said that it will become "spoiled" when Americans start to visit en-masse. It's pretty clear you don't like (at a minimum) large swaths of your countrymen and your culture.
You also suggested that you have "actually" traveled to communist countries, implying that those who criticize you aren't as experienced as you. You then criticized "fast food, strip mall American franchise crap that invades every corner of the world"... as if Americans were forcing the rest of the world to succumb to the will of McDonalds.
It seems to me that you believe you have a superior taste and understanding of the world and that folks who criticize you are less intelligent or less worldly or less knowledgeable and merely naive riff-raff who don't share your intellectual space. And the retort that "you're free to leave" seems pretty apt considering the disdain you express for many aspects of this country and many of it's people.
The worst kind of critic is the one that feels they are more knowledgeable and worldly and wise and they have a *right* to legislate their viewpoints upon the rest of the populace, who aren't as insightful or experienced (but who apparently know that it's Walmart and McDonald's).
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Of course they are free to give an opinion. But demonstrating a lack of understanding of why criticism of one aspect of American culture does not make one unpatriotic (quite the opposite actually IMO) makes them fair game for being exposed as either naive or hypocritical.
So you think bashing America makes you patriotic and anyone who doesn't agree with you is naive or hypocritical? It seems to me that dannyf and JoeO summed up your viewpoint and attitude pretty succinctly. The original article you referenced quoted some Canadians as lamenting that Cuba will be "ruined" by American tourists. You then said that it will become "spoiled" when Americans start to visit en-masse. It's pretty clear you don't like (at a minimum) large swaths of your countrymen and your culture.
You also suggested that you have "actually" traveled to communist countries, implying that those who criticize you aren't as experienced as you. You then criticized "fast food, strip mall American franchise crap that invades every corner of the world"... as if Americans were forcing the rest of the world to succumb to the will of McDonalds.
It seems to me that you believe you have a superior taste and understanding of the world and that folks who criticize you are less intelligent or less worldly or less knowledgeable and merely naive riff-raff who don't share your intellectual space. And the retort that "you're free to leave" seems pretty apt considering the disdain you express for many aspects of this country and many of it's people.
The worst kind of critic is the one that feels they are more knowledgeable and worldly and wise and they have a *right* to legislate their viewpoints upon the rest of the populace, who aren't as insightful or experienced (but who apparently know that it's Walmart and McDonald's).
How does criticizing the fast food/Wallmart/ strip mall aspect of American corporatism equate to "bashing America"
Where did I claim to want to "legislate" my viewpoint?
I just happen to like to visit historic foreign cities without being bombarded with American corporate culture. Plenty of that to see here thank you very much.
The vitriol in your post (and the other self ordained keepers of the "American Way") speaks volumes.. Jeez, no wonder so many abroad dislike us.
I guess wanting to emphasize the more benign aspects of American culture makes me unpatriotic in your eyes?
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One of the great things about having actually traveled in communist countrie...
I think you have demonstrated so much love and admiration for those authoritarian states, and so much hatred for your home country, so much disdain for its political system and capitalism, so much dismissiveness for your fellow countrymen, that it must pains you to live in western society, or any society that has been influenced by western culture.
Why would you torture yourself and force yourself to live such a miserable life?
If you like to live in those repressive regimes, take advantage of the freedom we have (unjustly) offered to you and live there.
With any luck, they may celebrate your arrival by putting certain body part of yours on a stick - which, justly, would have completely minimized your carbon footprint, another goal of your life that you are equally afraid of achieving on your own.
:)
Seriously, what you failed to comprehend is basic human decency, grace, respect for others, and appreciation for people who helped you.
Honor, as some "rednecks" would say. All things that you insist that others afford you but none you think you should offer to others.
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I think you have demonstrated so much love and admiration for those authoritarian states,
Did you actually read what I wrote or are you just purposely being deceptive? I actually expressed the exact opposite sentiment.
.. and so much hatred for your home country, so much disdain for its political system and capitalism,
...more slander and made up stuff. I did no such thing.
... it must pains you to live in western society, or any society that has been influenced by western culture.
Why would you torture yourself and force yourself to live such a miserable life?
If you like to live in those repressive regimes, take advantage of the freedom we have (unjustly) offered to you and live there.
Why would you torture yourself and force yourself to live such a miserable life?
If you like to live in those repressive regimes, take advantage of the freedom we have (unjustly) offered to you and live there.
With any luck, they may celebrate your arrival by putting certain body part of yours on a stick
Uh hum. Well you've created quite a straw man there - completely unrelated and in part actually antithetical to what I've said.
You demonstrate exactly the qualities that create and thrive in totalitarian states: The inability to tolerate any criticism and the need to denigrate anyone who dares to point out flaws or imperfections - exactly the opposite of the ideals our country was founded on.
Fortunately, as a country we rejected your this type of thing when we rejected the McCarthyism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCarthyism) of the 1950s.
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The Nixon/China example couldn't be more of a bullseye. What clearer evidence do we need?
Why is it that lots of Americans think they're responsible for regime change in China? The US government had nothing to do with it. Chairman Mao died and after a short period of political instability Deng rose to power and opened China up to the rest of the world.
The equal and opposite question is why do lots of non-Americans seek to minimalize American achivements and/or take every opportunity to criticize America and Americans? I think we know the answer.
There is a lot written about Nixon's trip to China, but there isn't any serious analysis of the event that consider it anything less than a major turning point of world history for the late 20th century. If you don't like giving America that much credit, read Margaret MacMillan's account (she's a historian and professor at Oxford in the UK). But Nixon's trip to China dramatically changed the cold war, changed China's political and economic direction and directly led to the current Chinese socio-political climate and relationship China has today with the rest of the world.
All Nixon's visit to China did did was improve relations between the US and China but it did not do anything to reduce the repressive state of the Chinese government or change their economic policy. I don't mind giving credit when it's due but I feel as though many Americans seem to attribute all good things in the world to the country. Let's not forget how the US won the war! ::)
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I was there in 2009, it's a nice place to be and all of the locals I met were amazingly friendly. The continued American embargo once the cold war was over was always a puzzle to me.
There were three main reasons for the embargo. 1.) COMMUNISM EVIL BAD STALIN JUJU, 2.) Castro's nationalization of businesses and property owned by US companies in Cuba, 3.) the hatred towards Castro from Cuban refugees, who organized into a political bloc with substantial power in a state (Florida) which often plays a pivotal role in US Presidential elections.
#1 stopped being relevant in 1989, #2 has become less relevant as the companies in question go bankrupt / stop giving a shit, leaving #3 as the main reason for the continued embargo. And as the older generation Cubans die off and the younger ones become more liberal that power has been waning as well.
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No!!!! Come visit us! ;D
I'd love to visit the Dominican Republic. A friend of mine goes there yearly and loves it. The Bahamas is the only Caribbean country I've seen so far. Life is too short...
You should come around this time of the year, as the sun is still shining bright, there's not much rain, there's a lot of fresh breeze and the air is not the humid hell it is during summer.
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Interesting article: Ana Belen Montes - The forgotten lady who gave her life for Cuba http://vineyardsaker.blogspot.it/2014/12/the-forgotten-lady-who-gave-her-life.html (http://vineyardsaker.blogspot.it/2014/12/the-forgotten-lady-who-gave-her-life.html)
A reader comment to that article is worth quoting. Short pre-revolution history of Cuba:
Most people in the US know very little about Cuba, and it's history, before, during, and after the Revolution. As an example, women, played a part in the Revolution from the beginning. I can think quickly of 3 of the large participants of the Revolutionary struggle that were women. Celia Sanchez, Haydee Santamaria, Vilma Espin, all are well known in Cuba for their roles in the Revolution. The US demonization of Cuba and Castro has been ongoing for over a half century. If the MSM had been as powerful during those early years it would be on a par with that Putin is subjected to today. I will if I may share a bit of knowledge on the Cuban Revolution here on this article about a another Cuban heroine.
Cuba has been a whipping boy for the US since the Revolution. They feared the example of Cuba throughout Latin America, as the slave that escaped. I learned from Cuba's fate to understand the US's vindictiveness when crossed. Which is why I've said over and over that Russia can't trust them and must be strong. They do not forgive or forget. Show weakness and they will destroy you for it.
The US made of Cuba almost a colony from the beginning of the 20th century. Most everything imported came from the US. And there were few factories producing manufactured goods in Cuba. The main exports of Cuba were almost all sent to the US and US interests controlled almost all of them. There was a saying that the second, and many times the most important man in the country was not the President, but was US ambassador. The military and intelligence services were all trained, and armed by the US. A similar relationship the US is trying to develope with Ukraine today. The Cuban upper and middle classes were very Americanized. Though paradoxically it was from those very elements that most leaders of the Revolution came from. In the 1920's and early 30's a particularly nasty pro-American ruler was President, Machado. He was a dictator renowned for throwing political opponents to sharks in Habana Bay. (as a sidenote Dezi Arnaz of "I love Lucy" fames father was a supporter of his. And fled Cuba at his overthrow). His rule polarized Cuba. And led to resistance to US domination. It also led to the rise of Batista the man Castro later fought during the Cuban Revolution. At Machado's overthrow mobs sacked and burned mansions of Machado's supporters. And hung from lampposts any of his supporters they could find. Especially members of the dreaded "Porra" secret police. A warning for today's nazi junta in Ukraine to ponder on. (a sidenote:It was that mob violence that Castro wanted to prevent by telling the people that the murderers would be tried and executed after the victory. And not to take violent revenge themselves. The US demonized Castro for fulfilling that promise.)
After polarized and very corrupt years of "democratic" government in Cuba 1952 came along. Castro was a young lawyer from a rich family. Married into another rich family that were supporters of Batista, former President, former military commander, and about to run for President again. ( sidenote: Castro's in-laws were the Diaz-Ballard family. Making Castro the uncle of the Florida anti-Castro Diaz-Ballards of Republican fame in Florida) But most thought he couldn't win. The President was going to run again ad most thought, though corrupt (read Yanukovich) he would win. The man Castro supported had killed himself over a scandal and the opposition was in turmoil. Rather than risk losing, Batista staged a coup, overthrew the President and took power. Approved by the US of course Castro in a symbolic move filed a law suit against him with the Supreme Court for treason in overthrowing the government. As you can guess, it was dismissed. He like Putin, was concerned by legality. And wanted to show there was no legal way to undo the coup.
He and other young dissidents started organizing a revolt. They picked the second city in Cuba, Santiago for the revolt. Castro's home province. And the province known for its rebellious nature, Oriente. Being young with no military training the revolt failed. But several soldiers were killed and others injured in the revolt. Castro and several others escaped. But others were captured, and Batista ordered many to be murdered in reprisal. That sent a cry of outrage across Cuba. And the Archbishop of Santiago threatened to order his clergy to denounce the government if the massacre continued. Among those captured was Haydee Santamaria, her brother, and fiance. After torture her brother and fiance were murdered. She was also tortured and the torturer showed her the eyes taken from her fiance during tortue to scare her into revealing where others were hiding. She told him if her fiance suffered that without talking she would not talk.
Castro surrendered under a safe conduct from the Archbishop and was with others charged with treason and tried in a closed trial. During the trial Vilma Espin, able to help with his defense smuggled out a record of the trial daily. From it came one of the most important speeches that Castro ever made. And a rallying cry for the Revolution. He acted as his own attorney in the trial and said to the court "Convict me as you will, for History will absolve me". They were convicted but pardoned a year later and threatened with death were forced to leave Cuba for Mexico. There Che joined him and the rest is History.
On one hand if the warming of US-Cuban relations is really for the best I'm glad it happened while Fidel is alive to see it. Despite the recent hoax death report. Fidel may yet live to watch the collapse of the US dollar financial empire.
Otoh, the Obama administration is so vile and duplicitous that I'm hesitant to believe *anything* coming from them can be well intentioned.
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There were three main reasons for the embargo. 1.) COMMUNISM EVIL BAD STALIN JUJU...
...#1 stopped being relevant in 1989
Wrong. Cuba is still communist, as are China, Laos, North Korea and Vietnam. Only when Marxism/Leninism/Maoism is denounced, the regimes are toppled, their leaders are purged, and their billions in foreign bank accounts and properties are seized, can any of these countries have a hope of becoming democratic. Punish the despots at the helm of these governments, not the proles.
The mistake the former eastern block countries made was they let the communist leaders carve up state owned enterprises amongst themselves. These crooks became instant multimillionaires and billionaires, whilst the people continued in poverty. Instead, those communist crooks should have been given a Ceaucescu sendoff.
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Haha...
The US wants to "help" Cuba to get into the internet. Right now, that goes over lines through Venezuela. The US having some problems to intercept those, With no embassy, there is no "official" way to do squat.
Why do the US want to help out there, again?
Greetings,
Chris
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Some members of this forum should not miss appointments with their psychologist.
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Why do the US want to help out there, again?
Heard an interview of the State Department's head for the future Cuba mission. She suggested that the deal for Alan Gross is a typical "spy-for-spy" swap.
That tells you all you need to know about Alan Gross and USAID (Alan Gross' employer for his Cuba internet assignment).