Author Topic: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station  (Read 170538 times)

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Online BravoV

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #100 on: June 04, 2013, 07:45:47 pm »
Just downloaded and grabbed the picture in the Hakko 850B manual, the photo below should be self explanatory.

« Last Edit: June 04, 2013, 07:50:13 pm by BravoV »
 

Offline saturation

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #101 on: June 04, 2013, 10:41:07 pm »
Its more versatile than the Hakko manual shows.  You can squeeze or expand the fork to fit different spaced components; you can also use one end at a time; in through hole components you can insert it between leads and twist or lift it up to pull the leads out of the holes while desoldering or using hot air.  I use that tool a lot, before it I used sold wire or paper clips.
Best Wishes,

 Saturation
 

Offline zany

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #102 on: June 22, 2013, 12:33:05 pm »
Bought one of these Atten units 2 weeks ago... looks like I'll have to tear it apart!   :)  Will take some pics, hopefully most QA issues have been resolved.
 

Offline zany

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #103 on: June 22, 2013, 03:51:22 pm »
Apologies in advance for the crappy quality of the photos... really need another camera...

Notes:

- Earth ground is connected to chassis via lower rear right screw, the back plate and body metal have been sanded down to bare metal.
- continuity passed from metal nozzle of handle and bracket metal to earth prong of IEC
- measured 28 Ohms from metal nozzle to earth prong, OL from bracket metal to earth prong
 

Offline saturation

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #104 on: June 22, 2013, 10:27:29 pm »
Your photos are very blurry, its not the camera is the focusing.  Good luck with the repairs.
Best Wishes,

 Saturation
 

Offline staze

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #105 on: August 13, 2013, 02:24:32 pm »
So, purchased one of these from sainsmart (110V obviously), and it just arrived today. Before powering it up, I took it apart, and for the most part, everything looks good (though it smells like they boxed it within minutes of its paint job... smells like an autobody shop).

Nozzle and body of unit are grounded (nozzle has a nice solder to ground, body is grounded through one of the bolts on the transformer. Bolts have lock-washers. Interesting that the transformer is listed as 110V/50Hz. Guessing the 10V higher we have here, and the 10Hz extra shouldn't be an issue (would think the frequency would only matter for any kind of clock using mains frequency).

Fused on the hot leg of the wiring, nice.

Alas, it's switched neutral. While certainly not a deadly fault (hey, they used to do this on house wiring in the states), I will fix it. I just don't get why they'd do it that way... how much could it really save?

Anyone have suggestions for how to fix the switching? Figured I'd just cut the current switched neutral, solder and heatshrink, then cut and solder in some splices to have the hot switched. Anyone have a more elegant solution? 16g stranded good enough for the load?
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Offline amyk

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #106 on: August 13, 2013, 05:55:11 pm »
Alas, it's switched neutral. While certainly not a deadly fault (hey, they used to do this on house wiring in the states), I will fix it. I just don't get why they'd do it that way... how much could it really save?
It saves cutting and connecting one more piece of wire... probably a not insignificant cost if you're building millions of units.
 

Online Monkeh

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #107 on: August 13, 2013, 08:09:21 pm »
16g stranded good enough for the load?

16?! What is this, a welder? You'd get away with 22 easily.
 

Offline staze

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #108 on: August 14, 2013, 01:56:55 am »
For 110v, 700W? Would think 22g would be a bit small for that... 16g is probably a bit big too. =)
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Online Monkeh

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #109 on: August 14, 2013, 02:29:00 am »
For 110v, 700W? Would think 22g would be a bit small for that... 16g is probably a bit big too. =)

Only if you're using the shit 60C rated stuff.
 

Offline staze

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #110 on: August 14, 2013, 08:40:09 am »
Cool.

Though kind of moot at this point. Took the unit apart and the power switch proceeded to fall apart (blade came out, remaining one appears loose as well).

Have contacted the seller, but am not holding out much hope... guess I could file a paypal grievance should that not work.
“Give a man an answer, he’ll keep his job for a day. Teach a man to Google, and he’ll be employed for a lifetime”
 

Online Monkeh

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #111 on: August 14, 2013, 09:13:21 pm »
Eh, I'd just take it as the price of cheap tools and replace the switch.
 

Offline staze

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #112 on: August 15, 2013, 03:38:26 am »
Eh, I'd just take it as the price of cheap tools and replace the switch.

Yup. Found a "real" replacement made by Cherry that I ordered through Digikey. In credit to sainsmart, they offered to pay for the replacement plus shipping. =) So, cool!
“Give a man an answer, he’ll keep his job for a day. Teach a man to Google, and he’ll be employed for a lifetime”
 

Offline geostep

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #113 on: August 16, 2013, 11:54:31 am »
I found this post in the 'Other Equipment and Products' forum:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/lights-flicker-when-using-wep-858d-rwork-station/

I warned him about the dangers of the 858D and told him to read this thread.  I hope he does!   :scared:

- George
 

Offline staze

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #114 on: August 16, 2013, 11:56:46 am »
Could be, and yes, safer to open it up and look, but I'm guessing he's just overloading that circuit... no different than running a vacuum or clothes iron and having the lights flicker.
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Offline Frenchie

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #115 on: August 23, 2013, 10:23:44 pm »
Finally got around to buying one of these in the 220V version. Mains wiring was surprisingly good compared to some of the examples seen here. I wasn't real impressed with the strain relief in the handle, nothing a bit of hot snot can't address though.
 

Offline Koubik

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #116 on: October 02, 2013, 04:31:53 am »
Hi everyone! just want to share my experience. I received my ATTEN 858D+ 4 days ago, everything was working great for the first 3-4 times but today when I've turned it on I  saw the temp screen numbers going crazy, but it was under 100C only above 100 it was showing good. Then I spotted that temp was raising way to slow, 3 minutes to go to 350C and only to 370-380 not more, sometimes only to 280. So I opened  a nozzle to check if there was any problem, redid all the joints but nothing. Then I unscrewed the mainboard to check the joints there and guess what...it worked, only by unscrewing it. There is one very bad big join so I hope this was a problem. Sorry for my English folks. ::)
 

Offline saturation

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #117 on: October 09, 2013, 10:34:50 pm »
If this worked check for a cold or broken joint still around, the unflexing of the mobo caused the poor connect to close.

Hi everyone! just want to share my experience. I received my ATTEN 858D+ 4 days ago, everything was working great for the first 3-4 times but today when I've turned it on I  saw the temp screen numbers going crazy, but it was under 100C only above 100 it was showing good. Then I spotted that temp was raising way to slow, 3 minutes to go to 350C and only to 370-380 not more, sometimes only to 280. So I opened  a nozzle to check if there was any problem, redid all the joints but nothing. Then I unscrewed the mainboard to check the joints there and guess what...it worked, only by unscrewing it. There is one very bad big join so I hope this was a problem. Sorry for my English folks. ::)
Best Wishes,

 Saturation
 

Offline Molybdo42

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #118 on: October 16, 2013, 05:53:33 am »
I also bought this station and I am kind of not reassured :
- high and low voltage wires are systematically zip-tied together
- no ground connection to chassis and paint everywhere
- dodgy ground connection on the heater
- heater is powered by the mains
- thin wires used to carry the 230V to the heater in close proximity to low voltage wires

Made in China...
 
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Online Monkeh

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #119 on: October 16, 2013, 05:58:13 am »
So would you rather they power the heater with 24V and have a gigantic thick cable?
 

Offline Molybdo42

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #120 on: October 16, 2013, 07:31:33 am »
So would you rather they power the heater with 24V and have a gigantic thick cable?

Well... Most of the power consumed by this soldering station goes into the heating element and it uses a 5A fuse.
In worst case scenario (ex : failure of temp sensor), can this small wire handle 1150W ?
 

Online Monkeh

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #121 on: October 16, 2013, 08:09:52 am »
So would you rather they power the heater with 24V and have a gigantic thick cable?

Well... Most of the power consumed by this soldering station goes into the heating element and it uses a 5A fuse.
In worst case scenario (ex : failure of temp sensor), can this small wire handle 1150W ?

Probably. You want to shove 30A+ up to the handpiece?
 

Offline M. András

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #122 on: October 18, 2013, 07:36:15 am »
just got a 852d+ rework station. well the thing has no earth wire to the hotairgun :) i wont change nozzle on that thing without unplugging thats for sure. second i had to tweak the trimpots on the thing to get atleast acceptable temp difference between the displayed temp and the measured temp with a thermocouple, approx 1-2cm from the nozzle initially it was over a 100celsius difference rest was ok didnt even bothered with the iron as i have an expensive weller station. for the price it worth this, but need a bit of practice couldnt get the scrap board to gain enough temp to remove a soic ic
 

Offline alias_neo

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #123 on: October 30, 2013, 04:18:36 am »
I just bought the Atten branded one myself, it's in an Atten box, by all accounts I would believe it was a genuine OEM.

However, as soon as I open the box, I notice two things, first, the station does NOT have holes in the right hand side to switch the wand cradle over. I'm a lefty so that sucks for me. Of course I can add the holes myself, but to me it indicated I have a clone.

Second, the calibration pin on the front panel is blanked. I'm not sure how usual this is, but I have seen units with it available.

I intend to take the "Atten" apart before it's turned on, I wonder if someone would be willing to check over some pictures and point out any issues? I'm an Electronic Engineer, so the general stuff is not an issue, but I have a phobia of mains electricity and am not familiar with the wiring regulations etc.

First point of call for me will be to ensure that the live (brown) is the fused wire, and that earth is connected to something, then I'll make sure the earth (yellow, green, yellow/green) pin shows no resistance between the shroud of the handle and the metal of the casing, of course accounting for the paint, and fixing it where there is an issue (with my dremel).

Please correct me if I got any part of that wrong, and whether there are additional points to check.

I don't have a thermocouple or other temperature sensing device to test the accuracy, I intend to buy a better meter, but building up an entire electronics workshop of reasonable quality equipment, all at once isn't easy on the wallet.

Side note: If someone could recommend a meter with temperature capabilities at a decent price (UK) that is reviewed on EEVBlog I'd love to watch more videos and potentially add one to my Christmas list. I currently use a DMM that was ~£5 in Maplin, so in reality it's worth about £2.

Thanks.
 

Offline M. András

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Re: DEADLY WIRING FAULT ; Atten 858D+ Hot Air Rework Station
« Reply #124 on: October 30, 2013, 09:39:32 am »
upload the photos and someone definetly will help you on that. as for the thermocouple its the actual elements which limit the sensing range specially its insulation. i melted part of my original supplied fluke probe when i set my chinese thing to approx a correct temp, the meter measures up to 1000c or more i dont really remember the range. but the probe is rated for 2xx celsius
 


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