General > General Technical Chat
Discussing the usage of the TEA thread
bitseeker:
--- Quote from: EEVblog on August 30, 2022, 12:38:33 am ---
--- Quote from: mnementh on August 29, 2022, 06:49:33 pm ---I can get "not watching the day-to-day"... but when a user is engaged in a direct, face-to-face discussion with you, I think it's reasonable to expect you to have read what they've said. As owner, especially where moderation of a thread has become "an issue", I think "not being aware" of the post above which quotes you is... well... just plain a weak excuse too.
--- End quote ---
...
In the case of your quoted posts of me above, I don't actually remember writing them, probably because I didn't have a deep vested interested in this TEA discussion. I got a report, and I did a fly by post, that happens a lot.
In this case it just happend to be very important to you and some others and I missed the gist of it, sorry, my fault for not realising at the time that this was serious.
I don't know what more to say.
--- End quote ---
Although not directed to me, I see what you mean.
--- Quote from: bsfeechannel on August 30, 2022, 12:42:34 am ---
--- Quote from: BU508A on August 29, 2022, 10:12:06 am ---Why? I considered a nice "Welcome" as being polite from the regulars to potentially new TEA members.
--- End quote ---
I'm trying to interpret the sentiment of exclusion some feel toward the thread. If you're talking about TEA members, is there some kind of implicit membership? Aren't all the forum users members of all threads? If it's adequate to welcome "new TEA members", is there a situation when someone, given they abide the forum rules, is not welcome?
--- End quote ---
BU508A, right above your reply, put it quite succinctly and sokoloff enhanced it eloquently when he wrote:
--- Quote from: sokoloff on August 30, 2022, 01:04:41 am ---The state transition that happens via these welcome messages is not from “unwelcome” to “welcome”, but rather of “not yet welcomed” to “welcomed”.
It’s a matter of routine social graces and overt inclusion. Part of the evidence of that is that you personally remember that you were welcomed by a particular member. You might feel the same if a pub regular called you over and clinked glasses with you or the first time the bartender greeted you by name and started pulling your pint as you walked in. You were always welcome, but now you’ve been welcomed.
--- End quote ---
It is because it's not necessary that it adds to the experience, the intangibles of belonging to a community.
--- Quote from: bsfeechannel on August 30, 2022, 12:42:34 am ---Bitseeker reflection that "(t)he size and visibility of the TEA thread has become too much for the forum" may hide other aspects the TEA "membership" needs to address, perhaps.
--- End quote ---
Many arguments thus far have been about ancillary things. There are also fundamentals that need to be solved. It isn't just one thing and they're not all easy nor simple to grasp at a glance. It's hard being human. Even harder when there are many.
--- Quote ---I can only regret his departure. He did an amazing job cataloguing the points of interest along the thread. And yes, he welcomed me when I starting posting there a few years ago.
--- End quote ---
I'm not gone. I do need a break, though. Recent events and their effect on sleep does wear on a person both mentally and physically.
tggzzz:
--- Quote from: thm_w on August 30, 2022, 12:22:11 am ---
--- Quote from: tggzzz on August 29, 2022, 09:43:50 pm ---Only in simple twatter like posts.
Many replies to complex interesting posts have multiple points that are best interleaved with the original.
If you want non-nested quoting, go to stackexchange or seaboard. There's a good chance you will see what I mean, and come back.
And if pigs had wings they could fly.
(See, even responses to boring trivial posts benefit from interleaving, to associate one point with the other).
--- End quote ---
The complexity of the post or interleaving doesn't affect that, if you click the link at the top of the quote it will bring you to the post being quoted.
If you interleave then you'd scroll up to the first link you see.
edit: I think I might see what you mean though, but, to arrive there the initial post you are quoting would be quite disorganized and might deserve a second post or something. Anyway, I would only want the collapse ability if it existed, not disabling.
--- End quote ---
Omitting context by shipping what you wrote is a favoured technique of those that are losing an argument and want to slew the discussion by using strawman arguments. That is, of course, a reprehensible debating technique, but it happens all too often.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/programming/any-examples-of-os-not-written-in-cc/msg3550788/#msg3550788
The ability to accurately specify the context of your reply is crucial where I make a point, someone makes a counterpoint, ,I rebut their counterpoint, etc. Where you are telling someone something they don't really want to hear, there is zero chance they will be psychologically prepared to follow links to discover why they are wrong.
But it isnt necessary to invoke antisocial behaviour. Here's a good natured technical example where interleaving makes the discussion possible. Rebuttalt to my points would be inserted somewhere in the middle (and it might have happened in this case!)
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/microcontrollers/interrupt-routine-duration/?action=post;quote=4358599;last_msg=4360132
Overall, multilevel quoting can, like any other tool,be misused. But if someone uses a chisel to damage some wood, that not a reason to remove chisels from the toolbox.
Specmaster:
--- Quote from: EEVblog on August 30, 2022, 02:46:11 am ---
--- Quote from: Brumby on August 30, 2022, 02:39:55 am ---
--- Quote from: Specmaster on August 29, 2022, 02:25:53 pm ---Well, it always used to be just another thread under the Test Equipment banner and to my knowledge since the decision was made by someone to make it a sticky and also to make it the number 1 sticky....
--- End quote ---
Stickies are just another section of a board and follow the same positioning as threads in the non-sticky section. The TEA thread stays at the top position nearly all the time because it is the most frequently posted to, but nobody set it there.
--- End quote ---
Correct. There is no abilty to set the position.
--- End quote ---
True, it was perhaps the incorrect statement by me, but putting it as a sticky, coupled with you giving it plugs in your video blog does tend to suggest to others that it is the place to be for all things test equipment, which clearly it isn't. I doubt that anybody can deny that it has lead to a large increase in the number of "new" visitors to the TEA thread (note I didn't say newbies), and that many were disappointed by their findings and this lead to a greater uplift in the level of complaints because these "new" complaints were added onto the old existing complaints and it was that new level which triggered the admin team to take a look and miss handle to the situation, and it exploded as a direct result.
There will always a certain level of people in any large group who will be disruptive, its in their nature and these people can be found in every walk of life, and judging by the comments already made, the other threads have their share of these people, and it would seem, enough to keep the admin team busy in those threads, while historically leaving TEA to by and large self police, which we have generally done very effectively
Brumby:
--- Quote from: bitseeker on August 30, 2022, 06:02:18 am ---I'm not gone. I do need a break, though. Recent events and their effect on sleep does wear on a person both mentally and physically.
--- End quote ---
Entirely understandable - and I'm sure you're not alone.
It is my hope that we all find a constructive way forward.
Brumby:
--- Quote from: Specmaster on August 30, 2022, 08:01:38 am ---... to a large increase in the number of "new" visitors to the TEA thread (note I didn't say newbies), and that many were disappointed by their findings and this lead to a greater uplift in the level of complaints because these "new" complaints were added onto the old existing complaints and it was that new level which triggered the admin team to take a look and miss handle to the situation, and it exploded as a direct result.
--- End quote ---
Sorry - I just can't agree.
If I walk into a thread I've not frequented and find it's not what I expected, I'd just walk away. I wouldn't whinge or carry on, let alone start reporting.
IMO, your hypothesis is a reach at best and not at all consistent with my observations about how people respond in a forum.
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