Author Topic: Goodbye Windows, Hello Linux [advice needed for a Linux workstation at home]  (Read 29226 times)

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Offline stj

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tor is not anonymous, governments control the nodes.
 

Offline Whales

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- needs VT-d/VT-x (hardware virtualization) capable processor

Sidenote: That's normal for all virt software in my experience (excluding very slow full-emulation modes).  Everything in the last 10 years *should* have this, although it's often turned off in the BIOS by default (for who-knows-why reason).

Offline bd139

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Some of the ass end consumer SKUs don’t have VT-x for some reason. I bet they do but intel decided to play market segmentation games.
 

Offline BradC

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Some of the ass end consumer SKUs don’t have VT-x for some reason. I bet they do but intel decided to play market segmentation games.

Of course they do. Same die, different fuses.
 

Offline RoGeorgeTopic starter

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Indeed, some of the recent CPUs doesn't have virtualization.  As an example, my former i3 doesn't have it: https://ark.intel.com/products/77488/Intel-Core-i3-4160-Processor-3M-Cache-3-60-GHz- That i3 is not so old, it was launched in 2014 and discontinued in 2017.  During the same period of time, and with the same socket, its biggest brother i7 have VT-d/VT-x capabilities.


A small introduction to virtualization

It is all about the idea of running many OSs (Operating Systems, e.g. Windows or Linux or BSD) on the same computer, and they can all run simultaneously.  This can be done in many ways.
  • 1.  The simplest way is to have a disk for each OS, and each time the computer boots, you can choose if you want Windows 10 or Ubuntu or whatever.  This is not virtualization.  It does not run both in the same time.  This is a bare metal install, or Type 0, like any ordinary Windows 10 or Ubuntu or MacOS install.
  • 2.  Once the computer is up and running the preferred OS from point 1., we can still running some other OS to run on top.  For that, one can install a program called VirtualBox, or VMWare (both are free for home use).  These programs can create a whole new virtual machine, with everything from BIOS, to disks and processors.  These is virtualization.  It is known as Type 2 virtualization.  Note that Type 2 is built on top of an existing and running OS we choose at point 1.
  • 3.  If we want to get rid of the OS loaded at point 1., and run virtual machines without Windows/Ubuntu + VirtualBox/VMWare, then we will call this a Type 1 virtualization.  To run many OSs at once, obviously we need some kind of arbiter between the many OSs, an arbiter capable keep the many OSs separated and without conflicts between each other.  This "arbiter" is called a Hypervisor.  The Hypervisor itself is installed on bare metal, sometimes the hypervisor it is referred as dom0.  The hypervisor is usually not a full OS, like Windows 10 or Ubuntu.  One can think about a hypervisor as a small OS, having only very basic functionality, without web browser or things like this (if one insists, one can have a dom0 with web browser, but we let this aside for a while).  Examples of hypervisors are ProxMox or Xen.  ProxMox is based on KVM, but these details are just adding confusion.  For now, we will let the details aside.
  • 4.  All the above examples:
    • Type 0, or no virtualization == choosing between Windows and linux at boot time, only one at a time, each installed bare metal
    • Type 2 virtualization == multiple Windowses/Linuxes running simultaneously inside a VirtualBox/VMWare which was installed on top of a bare metal Windows/Ubuntu
    • Type 1 virtualization == multiple Windowses/Linuxes running simultaneously inside a Xen/ProxMox/KVM hyperviser
      have the same purpose, which is to run various OSs on the same machine, without these OSs interfere or conflict with each other.
    To complicate things even more, sometimes we don't need/want to have another full OS running.  Sometimes we need just a particular program to be isolated and self-contained.  For this, there is another concept called containerization, as an example Docker containers and snap installs.
To recap, 1. is a normal install, 2. and 3. allows us to run Virtual Machines (VM), and 4. is used to isolate and contain only programs, not full machines.  The details about how on Earth one can e.g. reboot a Windows VM, and see the BIOS screen, while other Windowses and Linuxes are running just fine on the same computer, are very interesting, but quite complicated.  Won't go into details for now.


The next video will try to roughly explain how virtualization works.  It's the most intuitive and non technical explanation I've seen so far.  Worth a look from those new to virtualization.
...
Aaaand I can not find that video anymore, bummer!  :palm:
 ;D
 
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Offline bd139

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Worth reading this on virtualization as well at a lower level: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Popek_and_Goldberg_virtualization_requirements
 

Offline eugenenine

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1.  Which one would you choose as a home desktop?
Slackware

3.  I don't like to reinstall too often, yet I want the latest gimmicks, too.  Which one to pick for the long run
Slackware
 

Offline technix

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Indeed, some of the recent CPUs doesn't have virtualization.  As an example, my former i3 doesn't have it: https://ark.intel.com/products/77488/Intel-Core-i3-4160-Processor-3M-Cache-3-60-GHz- That i3 is not so old, it was launched in 2014 and discontinued in 2017.  During the same period of time, and with the same socket, its biggest brother i7 have VT-d/VT-x capabilities.
I think you can find used Xeon E3-1230v3 and Xeon E3-1231v3 out there. Those chips will work on most motherboards that supports your i3-4160 and support VT-x. That was a popular chip for upper mainstream builds in 2014-2015, being almost equivalent to i7-4790 non-K but costs just slightly above i5-4690K. You will need a graphics card though since that Xeon chip does not have integrated graphics, but as of now used RX 480, RX 580 and GTX 1060 6GB card are fairly cheap, since cryptocurrency miners are dumping them after the cryptocurrency crash.
 

Offline RoGeorgeTopic starter

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I found there is a running service called Firmware Update (fwupd) on my Ubuntu10.18.  Fedora should have fwupd, too, but didn't checked. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fwupd)

If I understood it right , this service seems exactly the kind of thing that I don't like, don't need, and don't want.

Updating firmware online is the last thing I wish to be possible from the OS level.  Even worst, some updates are NOT DIGITALLY SIGNED, and NOT VERIFIABLE.

Just a random example (for my Logitech wireless mouse):
https://fwupd.org/lvfs/device/cc4cbfa9-bf9d-540b-b92b-172ce31013c1
That LVFS web page states clearly that there is NO security and NO possibility to check the firmware for that wireless receiver.  This is what the Security section for that mouse firmware update is saying:
- Added to the LVFS by Logitech
- Update is not cryptographically signed
- Firmware cannot be verified after flashing
- Virus checked using ClamAV

Other way said, there is no security whatsoever.  Not only that it trust online updates from a 3rd, but there is no way for me to check if that firmware blob really is from Logitech or not.

This looks to me like a big security flaw, just waiting for the shit to hit the fan.

Did I got it right?  Is fwupd a running service, installed by default, that can reach all my hardware, and change firmware inside various pieces of hardware without letting me know?  And those changes can be pushed from the Internet, by default? And are not digitally signed, and not even verifiable in any way?

This can not be true, what am I missing here?  :-//

Offline bd139

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AFAIK fwupd just checks for firmware updates then puts files in the right place. UEFI secure boot takes care of the signing stuff. From a user perspective PolicyKit controls access to specific updates as well.
 

Offline HoracioDos

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AFAIK in order to update firmware you must pull them manually.
sudo fwupdmgr update

if you want to check available firmware updates
sudo fwupdmgr refresh

This is fwupd service status by default in linux mint.
● fwupd.service - Firmware update daemon
   Loaded: loaded (/lib/systemd/system/fwupd.service; static; vendor preset: enabled)
   Active: inactive (dead)
     Docs: https://fwupd.org/
 

Offline rdl

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Why in the world would you need to update firmware in a Mouse ?
 

Offline bd139

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The “ship buggy shit early” culture of the 00’s and onwards.
 
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Offline RoGeorgeTopic starter

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Will lookup the details, thank you. 

Need to dig more.  My current skills with systemd:


 ^-^

Offline bd139

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On Systemd, I don’t fix it now. If it goes bang, then the node, which is usually on AWS, just gets redeployed. Not having any of that shit to deal with.

As for the unit files, they’re pretty easy to push out with ansible. Until you get to dealing with LXC etc.
 

Offline stj

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The “ship buggy shit early” culture of the 00’s and onwards.

lol
i buy mice from poundland.
they even have spaces on the board for a 100ohm resistor and an led to light the wheel!  :-+
btw, they work without any firmware updates.  :-DD
 

Offline bd139

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I had a conversation a week ago about those Poundland mice. They’re easy to patch a rubber ducky into. We thought it might be fun to do that to a couple and put them back on the shelves in the shop  :-DD

They’re actually pretty decent mice.
 

Offline Mr. Scram

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Some of the ass end consumer SKUs don’t have VT-x for some reason. I bet they do but intel decided to play market segmentation games.
Almost all of the Intel consumer chips are the same silicon. I think there's two, maybe three designs covering the entire range. Of course you're going to get dies consuming more or having outright broken parts towards the edges of the wafer, but most of it is pure segmentation.
 

Offline jmelson

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A small introduction to virtualization

Yes, I run Ubuntu 12.04 for my main desktop (never run the latest, the bugs haven't been found yet), and then use VirtualBox to run several Windows guest OS's in it.
I let VirtualBox set up the generic Windows file system, but then map the user directory to a Linux subdirectory.  That makes it easy to move files back and forth on the Linux system, even when the Windows guest OS is not running.  Doesn't seem to be any performance issues, either.

I use XP for the older apps (like Protel 99 SE) and now they need Windows 7 for my tax software.  That is about all that's left that I need Windows for!

Jon
 

Online Circlotron

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Re: Goodbye Windows, Hello Linux [advice needed for a Linux workstation at home]
« Reply #219 on: February 01, 2019, 05:11:28 am »
I use XP for the older apps (like Protel 99 SE)
99SE works well under wine.

* Set wine version to Windows 2000
* Set odbc32 and odbccp32 to native in winecfg
* Install MDAC 2.8 SP1 & Jet 4.0 (SP8) using WINETRICKS

* Run Protel Setup. In the Setup Type screen choose Custom and uncheck NT Drivers
* Install SP4
* Install SP6
 

Offline RoGeorgeTopic starter

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Re: Goodbye Windows, Hello Linux [advice needed for a Linux workstation at home]
« Reply #220 on: February 01, 2019, 10:11:30 am »
This morning Ubuntu 18.10 (w Gnome) did an upgrade update.

- Grub decided to chain other independent Grub installations from other disks, disks that have their independent Grubs, and that were never chained before.  Of course, it did a complete mess.  This won't be easy to untangle.
Why Grub, why?  :palm:

- All desktop icons are now loosing their position at each reboot, aligning themselves in the most upper left place, in a position where there is no active monitor.
Why is it so hard for Gnome to remember icons' position relative to each monitor, and not relative to "X screen 0"? :horse:
« Last Edit: February 01, 2019, 12:10:13 pm by RoGeorge »
 

Offline HoracioDos

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Re: Goodbye Windows, Hello Linux [advice needed for a Linux workstation at home]
« Reply #221 on: February 01, 2019, 11:47:02 am »
You can install timeshift to make system snapshots before upgrading. If something goes wrong you can easily revert changes. That's why I like Mint. It is already there and it works like a charm
 

Offline Nominal Animal

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Re: Goodbye Windows, Hello Linux [advice needed for a Linux workstation at home]
« Reply #222 on: February 01, 2019, 05:19:25 pm »
- Grub decided to chain other independent Grub installations from other disks, disks that have their independent Grubs, and that were never chained before.  Of course, it did a complete mess.  This won't be easy to untangle.
Why Grub, why?  :palm:
Because the update authors are trying to cater to users who are not in control of their own tools.

Why is it so hard for Gnome to remember icons' position relative to each monitor, and not relative to "X screen 0"? :horse:
Gnome developers believe user access to tunables is evil, and that Gnome should behave the exact way the developers designed.  It bit you, because none of them have the same configuration as you do.

(This is intended as a honest description, and not as snarky.  Me just fail English, though.)
 

Offline RoGeorgeTopic starter

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Re: Goodbye Windows, Hello Linux [advice needed for a Linux workstation at home]
« Reply #223 on: February 01, 2019, 05:53:46 pm »
OK, then.  No hard feelings.
It's time to get KDE Plasma a try, I guess
 ^-^

Offline Nominal Animal

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Re: Goodbye Windows, Hello Linux [advice needed for a Linux workstation at home]
« Reply #224 on: February 01, 2019, 08:02:07 pm »
It's time to get KDE Plasma a try, I guess
Go for it :-+ Before you try, you won't know if it works for you or not.

I personally like XFCE and LXDE, and will simply switch between Gnome/XFCE/KDE at login time, by selecting the session type, depending on what I do.  Although I don't like Gnome much, I keep using it to keep my experience fresh so I can help students having issues with it on the exact same hardware.

If you can afford the time and effort in experimenting a bit -- as in, using the different ones when trying to accomplish actual tasks, but recognizing that the UI being unfamiliar means it will feel odd and clunky at first --, I do definitely recommend testing the different ones; even up to seeing how hard/easy they would be to customize to your own needs.  In practice, that means that at random, when you have a task to accomplish, but extra time to do it in, use a different Desktop Environment to see how you would accomplish the task there.  The best test cases are the dull ones, like creating backups, examining your archived emails, connecting to network shares or your own NAS box, and so on.

(The first thing I do when I create my own user account in any Gnome variants, is adding my own Oblivion-derived theme to the terminal and text editors.  I need fully black backgrounds, as I use them full screen and switch between them, and dark background seems more comfortable to my eyes than light backgrounds.  I don't even bother keeping the XML theme file around; I just edit it on the fly.  Not everything needs to be optimized; it is always a balance, and it will change in time.)

I must admit that in my particular case -- I deal with a lot of tabulated data in text form, PDF versions of published articles, and so on -- knowing bash, find, sed, and awk (and related command-line conversion utility toolkits, like NetPBM tools and GhostScript/Poppler scriptlets) makes a much bigger difference than any of the desktop environments.  You don't need to remember their syntax offhand, except for POSIX basic and/or extended regular expression syntax, which you should consider a mathematical form for expressing matchable character sequences, but being familiar with their use means that rather than looking for GUI or DE tools to find/catalog/index something, you write a single-use stanza on the command line to accomplish the task in one go.  I keep a browser tab open to bash, awk, and make user guides (single-page versions), plus man pages open to sed, find, stat, xargs, or whatever tools I think I might use, because I do not bother to remember the details; I only remember how they work in the conceptual level.  Works just fine.  Even stuff I've never done before feels easy, as long as I have the necessary information on the file formats, problem at hand, and what it is that one wishes to accomplish.  (This also means I find "tests" where someone asks what option X does for command Y ridiculous: why would you bother remembering such details, when you can trivially check?  My brain is limited, and I'd rather use it to solve problems than store facts and details that I can in any case look up faster than I can speak them out loud.) 

Usually, the bottleneck is my brain, trying to figure out whether I am looking at the problem at the right level of abstraction.  I don't know how many times my subconscious pipes up five minutes later or the next morning, pointing out how to solve the undiscussed underlying problem with a small fraction of the effort.  If I did a :palm: every time, I'd have a dent in my forehead.  So, I've learned that to accomplish things efficiently, I must think at them quite a bit first, rather than dive in head first.  But I like doing that, too.
 
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