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do you work out?

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thermistor-guy:

--- Quote from: NiHaoMike on June 17, 2018, 07:04:22 pm ---What about the few who eat a lot, exercise little, and yet are really skinny? (I know a few who are like that, both on TV and in real life.). The vague answer is "they have a high metabolism", but do scientists know about the exact details

--- End quote ---

There is a phenomenon called TOFI - thin on the outide, fat on the inside. This is where some individuals seem to have normal body weight, but their internal organs are choked with fat. Instead of accumulating fat in adipose tissue and looking obese, these individuals store the fat in and around internal organs. Despite appearances, these individuals are well on the way to suffering from metabolic syndrome, diabetes type II, non-alcoholic fatty liver disease, and so on. External appearance can be misleading.

However, it is also known that humans, like other animals, defend a certain body weight via the operation of a feedback loop, mediated by Leptin. Leptin is a hormone  secreted by adipose tissue. It signals to your brain (the hypothalamus, which controls hunger) that you have enough energy stored to engage in daily life. The more fat you have, the more Leptin you secrete, and, if the feedback loop is working well, the less hungry you feel (over time).

Conversely, the less fat you have, the less Leptin you secrete, and the more hungry you feel, if - and this is a big if - the feedback loop is working correctly.

So some people stay skinny because they eat a lot from time to time, but other times they eat less, with the Leptin-mediated feedback stabilizing their body weight.

But certain diets can interfere with the feedback loop. In particular, diets high in carbohydrates can cause chronically high levels of Insulin in your bloodstream. Insulin acts on the brain as well as other organs. Chronically high insulin interferes with Leptin signalling in the hypothalamus. In effect, it reduces the feedback loop gain, causing "Leptin resistance".

So you get fat people whose adipose tissue is pumping out huge amounts of Leptin, but because their Insulin levels are chronically high, their brain gets increasingly "deaf" to the massive  Leptin signal. As far as their hypothalamus is concerned, these people are starving.  Their Leptin feedback loop is deranged by their high-carb diet, but the feedback is still working in a fashion.

Hence the phenomenon of fat people who are always hungry and who are regulating at a very high body weight. No matter what they do, it seems, they can't lose weight permanently. The answer is to change their diet, so that their Insulin is no longer chronically high; they regain Leptin sensitivity; and their hypothalamus starts regulating at a saner level of body weight.

CopperCone:
if you are skinny then keep adding more weight each time you work out, even if its like some 1.25lb plates on a barbell (typically 2.5-5lb per workout), or get magnets to stick something like 0.5 lb - 1.25lb plates on your dumbells (you wanna ramp up dumbells slowly IMO).. your body will eventually not be able to perform the exercise without increasing muscular growth, it just won't be physically possible to do what your doing without some kind of growth some where, no matter what is going on with the metabolism or whatever.

thermistor-guy:

--- Quote from: CopperCone on June 16, 2018, 05:28:20 pm ---Do you work out? I do strict heavy barbell exercises like stronglifts.

I noticed that engineers seem to enjoy doing 'fun' physical activities with more of a focus on cardiocentric/endurance activity then more then strict muscular exercises. Biking and climbing seem popular with engineers I know in particular. How do you fit in? Some also seem to enjoy jogging.

--- End quote ---

I enjoy aerobics. But I also enjoy heavy lifts (deadlift, clean, clean and jerk, etc.), and bodyweight calisthenics (front lever, dragon flag, pistol squat).

For aerobics, I do a hard one-hour session each week, either a "rolling hills" type routine on an elliptical cross-trainer, or interval training on a stationary bike (one minute sprint, one minute easy pace, repeat for the hour). I make sure the session takes me close to my limit - if I'm feeling stronger than normal, then I speed up. I also run to and from the gym, even on aerobics days, so I get a few hours of jogging per week that way.

Bodyweight calisthenics is where the real action is, for me. One of my current goals is to master a strict one-arm pullup. I can do posted pullups - that's where you pull up mainly with one arm, with the other arm providing some  support and balance. And I can do one-arm negatives, lowering myself by one arm from the top pullup position. But I can't do the strict one-arm concentric yet. Something to look forward to.

NiHaoMike:

--- Quote from: thermistor-guy on June 18, 2018, 02:09:11 am ---But certain diets can interfere with the feedback loop. In particular, diets high in carbohydrates can cause chronically high levels of Insulin in your bloodstream. Insulin acts on the brain as well as other organs. Chronically high insulin interferes with Leptin signalling in the hypothalamus. In effect, it reduces the feedback loop gain, causing "Leptin resistance".

--- End quote ---
Freelee The Banana Girl, a fitness model, actually advocates a high carb, low fat diet for those looking to lose weight as well as those who just want to be healthy. The key is that natural, unprocessed carbs like those found in fruit are very different from refined carbs.

Another point that I just remembered is that cold weather is something else that can help with weight loss. Apparently just 15 minutes of exposure to cold weather (not even that cold at 53F) is as effective as a hour of exercise, although it is important to note that it is not a substitute for diet and exercise - just another tool that can be used for weight loss. That might be one of Allie Moore's secrets to how she stays so skinny - she doesn't mind cold weather very much.
https://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/02/140211-shivering-cold-exercise-brown-fat-white-fat-irisin-metabolism-weight-loss/

On the contrary, particularly hot weather makes it difficult to get a lot of exercise activities done.

thermistor-guy:

--- Quote from: NiHaoMike on June 18, 2018, 04:24:31 am ---
--- Quote from: thermistor-guy on June 18, 2018, 02:09:11 am ---But certain diets can interfere with the feedback loop. In particular, diets high in carbohydrates can cause chronically high levels of Insulin in your bloodstream. Insulin acts on the brain as well as other organs. Chronically high insulin interferes with Leptin signalling in the hypothalamus. In effect, it reduces the feedback loop gain, causing "Leptin resistance".

--- End quote ---
Freelee The Banana Girl, a fitness model, actually advocates a high carb, low fat diet for those looking to lose weight as well as those who just want to be healthy. The key is that natural, unprocessed carbs like those found in fruit are very different from refined carbs...

--- End quote ---

Yes, it's called the fruit paradox: Fructose is a problematic nutrient, so how is it that consumption of raw fruit seems to be beneficial? The fibre in raw fruit helps slow done absorption, so the liver does not get a large sudden hit of fructose, unlike sodas loaded with HFCS. Fruit fibre is an ameliorating factor, but not the whole answer. Raw fruit also contains antioxidants and other bioactive ingredients that processing tends to remove. These ingredients help liver function (among other things), but I'm not sure that explains it either.  The fruit paradox is still a mystery.

I advocate raw fruit as a replacement for fruit juice. I also advocate fruit that is strongly or brightly coloured, a la Terry Wahls. The intense colour indicates the presence of antioxidants and other bioactive ingredients. So mango, passionfruit, papaya, kiwi fruit, berries, cherries, rockmelon, mandarines: yes. Pale coloured fruit, like bananas, apples, pears, I tend to avoid because there are more nutrient-dense fruits available. For the same fructose load, I get more nutritional bang for my buck.

Everyone differs in their tolerance of carbohydrates, and this tolerance tends to decrease as you get older. Some people do ok on high carbs, especially young people. But some people don't, even as children. To complicate matters, there is a plausible argument, put forward by Paul Jaminet and others, that some unrefined carbs (e.g. rice, starchy vegetables) are necessary to feed the bacteria in your gut, which in turn feed you. Some people have adverse reactions to paleo diets for this reason - their carb restriction is too extreme for their gut to handle.

Using myself as an n=1 experiment, and monitoring myself for how well I recover from hard workouts, I've settled on a diet that is moderately low-carb, moderately high-fat: meat, fish, vegetables, fruit, some nuts, some dairy (which I can tolerate), olive oil,  and coconut milk (plus some  other refinements I won't go into here).

If I eat really well, I can do hard workouts 36 hours apart with good recovery. If my nutrition is not on point, then takes me 48 hours or more for good recovery. The gym, and my runs to the gym, make it clear whether I'm getting it right.

If you are interested in nutrition, I recommend following the work of researchers in two areas: nutrition for elite athletes, and nutrition for treating chronic life-threatening disease. In both cases the stakes are high, and getting it right matters very much. Obsolete dogma from a bygone era doesn't cut it. Two names to start with are Jeff Volek (athletes) and Terry Wahls (life-threatening disease).

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